FB is superb Jay

 

I do my reading and on feedback . & they come back as one of the best place to go to . They do it all ECU & esl . And for the price as my car is a 1994 . I would be happy to pay that . As I drive in & drive out & the car is done . & I no it's done by someone that comes highly spoken of. That's wear I am going.

 

If uprated/performance parts are used to coincide with the power increase then the stress/strains should be easily within the tolerances for the specific parts meaning "safe" power.

just like a stock engine is setup on standard internals etc...

 

So the 2.5s are quite safe on stock internal and standard power?
BPR is correct, no such thing as a mechanical device without risk of failure, regardless of parts used in construction.

 

No because they have a known defect (chocolate pistons)

Im trying to say that the power is safe with regards to the parts

430bhp on a v9 2.0 sti for example

mapped correctly will be safe power

Im not saying every car will run 100% for the rest of its life but with a car that has been mapped correctly you stand a better chance providing it is not taken above its capabillitites

 

Really? Safe for how long?
What do you think is the safe and reliable limit on stock v9 internals such as con rods?
How does 380ft/lbs sound? That is my information from one of the most respected subaru tuners/racers in the country.
Still think it's safe AND reliable at 430bhp?

My point is that unless you have definitive knowledge of what components will withstand, it doesn't matter who maps the car, if you stress a component beyong its design parameters you are taking a chance purely because you don't know what the component capabilities are. All you have is anecdotal evidence of what the majority of test cases have shown these components are capable of.
Good mapping has no effect on component durability once you increase the duty requirement.

 

Completely agree Blue by you. Well said!

I used to build quite a few "bulletproof" race engines for my various race cars in the good old days (pre-family induced poverty). No matter what the spec or the uprated component, eventually something would give! Fact! Weather it was a manufacturing defect with an uprated part or just sheer bad luck something would eventually cause yet another engine rebuild.

I stand by my original statement. There is no such thing as a 100% reliable unbreakable tuned engine or modified car!

Ask anyone on here with a well spec'd well built engine and I'll bet they all expect to pay for a rebuild at some point. That's just the way it goes!

 

Keith Black, a highly respected builder of race engines in the US using the finest parts you can buy, offered two guarantees with his engines.
1) It will start.
2) It will break.
'nuff said.

 

My two cents...

I found Duncan and his website extremely helpful when choosing the upgrade path for my Blob WRX.

I am now running around 285bhp with a few mods and Duncans remap, with absolutely no complaints or problems to date. have done around 10k since then. Power delivery is vastly improved and even my MPG has improved.

So I'm a happy customer and have nothing to complain about!

 

Just to correct you, there are no 'defective' pistons in a wrx, they are just lower design spec than in a STI as typical. To say the are defectiove is also untrue, if it was true every single car woul fail and they don't

 

Totally agree
Let's not forget we are also talking about engines that are not what you would call bullet proof at the best of times

Like I said earlier , start messing and all your doing is making work and expense in one way or another
We've got a bloke slagged off on here now because of mis quoted power or boost and a few niggles ( nothing more )
What about the so called pros that have built engines that have gone pop in record time ,

If we are in the name and shame game because summats not quite right or gone wrong with a modded car it's gonna be a very long list indeed

 

I beg to differ, build an engine to a spec say 400 capable and and stay below it. Respect your builders/manufacturers advice and enjoy your car for a long time. I don't expect my car to go pop any time soon. why? Because I asked the builder for a 400 capable engine and I have no intention of taking it any where over 350. I follow the builders advice to the letter and ignore the advice/opinions of a lot of the folk on here.
Dont get me wrong there's a mountain of info on here but sorting the wheat from the chaff is hard work. This thread is a classic example.
BTW I'm booking Duncan to tweak my car in a few weeks.

 

This is a how long is a piece of string scenario
Mapping aside , other factors come into play
How you drive ( mechanical sympathy )
Where you drive ( trackdays ect)
How you maintain your car
How much use ( milage)
Then there's mechanical failure , with the best will in the world it happens
You may drive sensible and cosset your pride and joy driving well below its 400 capable engine mapped to 350
But would you be so confidant thrashing it within an inch of its life every other weekend around a race track
It would be a very brave man to give a lengthy engine warranty for that

 

Again, if you read the WHOLE thread, you would realise your talking crap with this statement

 

Toneh I agre with u mate. We all miss spell things. Or things not sound the way u ment it.
( read the thing keep up .

 

I have read it , and it's bloke not happy with mapper cuz car has issues so comes on here moaning about it

My response is , tough , should have listened 2 year ago

Hence the great mapping rip off

Simples

 

As diplomatic as always toneh.

My experience with Subarus and all this moding lark is, if you want them to be reliable stick with standard power or PPP, be VERY diligent about oil changes, I change the oil between 5/7000 miles depending on the type of driving i've been doing, it will be 7000 this time as i've just done a 3k round trip to the UK in my Blob Wrx which has just ticked over 109k miles, they do last if your sensible about how you drive them, rag the **** off them and bounce them off the limiter all the time and it's going to get expensive sooner or later, as with ANY car.

Once you start moding you need to make sure you can afford to fix it if the worst happens.

Even the best mappers have off days (some more than others) and components fail as a matter of course, it's just the luck of the draw as to how and when it happens that determines the end result, which could be anything from catastrophic engine failure to engine not starting, Fuel pumps being a perfect example.

Being a petrol head is expensive and full of highs and lows, if there's any aspect of that your not prepared to accept then get off the roller coaster.

 

Well it is what it is mate

The stick I got for that thread and what I said was unreal , yet we've still got folks folks posting and moaning about it
The thing is it's not about one mapper it's the business as a whole

" only took half hour " " cost this much "

Well surprise surprise , no **** Sherlock you don't say

 

Majority of 2.5's (hatch onwards) do fail

this was aimed at the 2.5's not the wrx's

 

Realised it was at the 2.5, but the majority don't fail. Just a high percentage when compared to other engine, supposedly the rate is around 30%

 

Unsure of torque ratings but the v9 sti's are good for 450bhp

running 400 say would be adequate providing the engine is serviced regularly and looked after (still to be driven hard on the road, not track use by the way)

My car is running a v9 sti short engine with v3 sti heads, recommended by a local Subaru specialist, mapped by Bob Rawle. Both agreed my set up will be "safe", rebuilt 2500 miles ago (before being mapped) and producing 436bhp with 340 ft lbs of torque.

However, im not ruling out any mechanical failure due to whatever circumstances (because that would be naive) but what I am saying is the power and map are within the tolerance's advised to me by a well respected and trusted engine builder.

 

Totally agree

 

Maybe being a bit harsh but 30% is still a whopping percentage

 

Where are you getting your random stats from Maca?

 

Random stats?

If you are referring to the bhp capabilities of the v9 sti engine they come from a man who has been building Subaru engines for 14 years and has a wealth of experience

 

Yep. You stated very informatively that 30% of all 2.5 engines blow up. First I've heard of this and was wondering where your accurate compiled info was coming from?

 

Supposedly it's the internal Subaru figure, but was a leaked thing ages ago. Officially no figures exist

 

If you read the thread properly this info was stated by Tidgy and not myself

 

And it was not stated informatively Brown Pants

 

Post 470, he was quoting someone else