Scripture vs. the facts.
05 March 2016, 06:45 PM
#992
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
05 March 2016, 06:55 PM
#993
Oh dear, is English your second language? You should have said! I made it perfectly clear what I was saying, but I can repeat it in French, German, Russian or Arabic if that would make it any easier for you to understand.
And it would take more than one Christian or even a whole church full of them to corner me, especially if I was armed!
05 March 2016, 07:12 PM
#994
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh dear, is English your second language? You should have said! I made it perfectly clear what I was saying, but I can repeat it in French, German, Russian or Arabic if that would make it any easier for you to understand.
And it would take more than one Christian or even a whole church full of them to corner me, especially if I was armed!
And it would take more than one Christian or even a whole church full of them to corner me, especially if I was armed!
I'm interested in your ontological position, sir, as you are in mine. What are the foundations for your being? Are you a nihilist?
05 March 2016, 07:43 PM
#995
Anyone with the capacity to think critically and forensically will, when reading the last dozen or so posts, see that you've made incongruent statements and, being acutely aware of this, you're now trying to make light of it. I can forgive this, it's just your pride getting in the way of truth.
I'm interested in your ontological position, sir, as you are in mine. What are the foundations for your being? Are you a nihilist?
I'm interested in your ontological position, sir, as you are in mine. What are the foundations for your being? Are you a nihilist?
What utter rot. You're confusing lightness with tedium. And if you believe your first paragraph why would you be interested in any response I might give to your second? Now that would be incongruous.
05 March 2016, 07:52 PM
#996
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don't get me wrong, whilst you may find it tedious, I actually enjoy sparing with you. I'm afraid, however, that you made a value judgement about IS in relation to Islam and when questioned you floundered. That's what happened. It's on record.
05 March 2016, 08:08 PM
#998
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just clear it up for me then? How are you able to make value judgements about IS having a "distorted version of Islam"? If you could simply point me to the measure, please.
Last edited by JTaylor; 05 March 2016 at 08:10 PM.
05 March 2016, 08:30 PM
#999
Right, last try.
It's accepted by Western & many Muslim scholars that, like the Bible, the Koran is not the word of God but a contrived text composed from a number of texts covering hundreds of years. This is rarely openly expressed for fear of reprisals. However, despite the evidence the Koran is firmly believed by Muslims to be the word of God transmitted to Muhammad by the Angel Gabriel. Remember him? With me so far?
Isis has misinterpreted the texts of the Koran. 'It is forbidden in Islam to kill the innocent' being one obvious example that they have rather ignored. How is that not easy for you to understand? It's not a value judgement on my part but a simple statement of fact.
Now if you respond quickly you can be No: 1,000.
05 March 2016, 08:38 PM
#1000
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Right, last try.
It's accepted by Western & many Muslim scholars that, like the Bible, the Koran is not the word of God but a contrived text composed from a number of texts covering hundreds of years. This is rarely openly expressed for fear of reprisals. However, despite the evidence the Koran is firmly believed by Muslims to be the word of God transmitted to Muhammad by the Angel Gabriel. Remember him? With me so far?
Isis has misinterpreted the texts of the Koran. 'It is forbidden in Islam to kill the innocent' being one obvious example that they have rather ignored. How is that not easy for you to understand? It's not a value judgement on my part but a simple statement of fact.
Now if you respond quickly you can be No: 1,000.
It's accepted by Western & many Muslim scholars that, like the Bible, the Koran is not the word of God but a contrived text composed from a number of texts covering hundreds of years. This is rarely openly expressed for fear of reprisals. However, despite the evidence the Koran is firmly believed by Muslims to be the word of God transmitted to Muhammad by the Angel Gabriel. Remember him? With me so far?
Isis has misinterpreted the texts of the Koran. 'It is forbidden in Islam to kill the innocent' being one obvious example that they have rather ignored. How is that not easy for you to understand? It's not a value judgement on my part but a simple statement of fact.
Now if you respond quickly you can be No: 1,000.
05 March 2016, 08:44 PM
#1001
Woo hoo! There is a God.I get to make the post 1000
05 March 2016, 08:45 PM
#1002
Oh
05 March 2016, 08:49 PM
#1004
Swine,lol
05 March 2016, 09:12 PM
#1005
The old interpretation is highly debatable and reinforces your previous claims that Islam is an evil in the world.
While 'modern day' Muslims are honour bound to attempt to convert the infidel (that's us) to Islam at every opportunity they are not obliged to kill us when they fail. I have spent too much time in their company in foreign parts and know this to be true. That I have survived to tell the tale suggests that instant death is not guaranteed when you remain a non believer.
Their scholars are at pains to point out that Jihad is purely defensive and they are quick to defend the Koran against the excesses of Isis. However I wouldn't trust any of them further than I could punch them and am always on my guard when working with them abroad.
05 March 2016, 09:18 PM
#1006
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The old interpretation is highly debatable and reinforces your previous claims that Islam is an evil in the world.
While 'modern day' Muslims are honour bound to attempt to convert the infidel (that's us) to Islam at every opportunity they are not obliged to kill us when they fail. I have spent too much time in their company in foreign parts and know this to be true. That I have survived to tell the tale suggests that instant death is not guaranteed when you remain a non believer.
Their scholars are at pains to point out that Jihad is purely defensive and they are quick to defend the Koran against the excesses of Isis. However I wouldn't trust any of them further than I could punch them and am always on my guard when working with them abroad.
While 'modern day' Muslims are honour bound to attempt to convert the infidel (that's us) to Islam at every opportunity they are not obliged to kill us when they fail. I have spent too much time in their company in foreign parts and know this to be true. That I have survived to tell the tale suggests that instant death is not guaranteed when you remain a non believer.
Their scholars are at pains to point out that Jihad is purely defensive and they are quick to defend the Koran against the excesses of Isis. However I wouldn't trust any of them further than I could punch them and am always on my guard when working with them abroad.
05 March 2016, 09:31 PM
#1007
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here's my previous rant about Salafism for what it's worth; a couple of pages of ranting to be fair. 
https://www.scoobynet.com/1031858-fr...l#post11761864
https://www.scoobynet.com/1031858-fr...l#post11761864
05 March 2016, 09:33 PM
#1008
To be precise I meant infidels from the Muslim standpoint. Although not a Christian infidel you would not be excused that title by a Muslim.
So why don't you tell me why Salafism is a distortion of Islam? Sunnis wouldn't agree with you and would surely strike you down!
05 March 2016, 09:52 PM
#1009
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As I understand it the perjorative 'infidel' is reserved for atheists and polytheists etc. I think even the Salafists would describe me as a 'person of the book', but these are just details, right? Secondly, I don't think Salafism is a distortion of Islam; on the contrary. I lay out my case in the link above.
05 March 2016, 10:04 PM
#1010
As I understand it the perjorative 'infidel' is reserved for atheists and polytheists etc. I think even the Salafists would describe me as a 'person of the book', but these are just details, right? Secondly, I don't think Salafism is a distortion of Islam; on the contrary. I lay out my case in the link above.
Sorry to disappoint you but you are in infidel in the eyes of a Muslim, as are all Christians, casual or totally committed.
Generally, living in the Middle East, you will not encounter infidels. This is because Allah the merciful, the compassionate, the loving, has set apart the sandiest, hottest, most uncomfortable place on earth for his chosen people. Occasionally however, you may spot an infidel purchasing oil for his nation, America. A way to know if the man you see is an infidel, is to look for white skin, blond Hair, calm attitude, lack of turban, lack of suicide bomb, crucifix necklace, and enjoyment of bacon.
05 March 2016, 10:21 PM
#1011
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry to disappoint you but you are in infidel in the eyes of a Muslim, as are all Christians, casual or totally committed.
Generally, living in the Middle East, you will not encounter infidels. This is because Allah the merciful, the compassionate, the loving, has set apart the sandiest, hottest, most uncomfortable place on earth for his chosen people. Occasionally however, you may spot an infidel purchasing oil for his nation, America. A way to know if the man you see is an infidel, is to look for white skin, blond Hair, calm attitude, lack of turban, lack of suicide bomb, crucifix necklace, and enjoyment of bacon.
Generally, living in the Middle East, you will not encounter infidels. This is because Allah the merciful, the compassionate, the loving, has set apart the sandiest, hottest, most uncomfortable place on earth for his chosen people. Occasionally however, you may spot an infidel purchasing oil for his nation, America. A way to know if the man you see is an infidel, is to look for white skin, blond Hair, calm attitude, lack of turban, lack of suicide bomb, crucifix necklace, and enjoyment of bacon.
05 March 2016, 10:30 PM
#1012
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The thing that perplexes me is where was God and Religeon when our Neanderthals cousins were sh!tting in caves and ebbing out a existence for 60,000 years till Jesus or Mohammed came to the party ? Created the earth in 7 days then took 60,000 years off 
05 March 2016, 10:38 PM
#1013
I'm sure you're already at the bottom of it, you just want to nail me for disagreeing with you. My claim, if such it was, is that Islamic scholars are trying to keep the lid on things (in the face of much anti Muslim feeling) and in so doing have attempted to defuse the notion of Jihad as entirely warlike. As for explaining anything I'm a simple ex soldier with hands on experience of Muslim attitudes but I'm no scholar. Interpretations of texts are exactly that, with all the variations in meaning thus implied.
05 March 2016, 10:48 PM
#1014
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm sure you're already at the bottom of it, you just want to nail me for disagreeing with you. My claim, if such it was, is that Islamic scholars are trying to keep the lid on things (in the face of much anti Muslim feeling) and in so doing have attempted to defuse the notion of Jihad as entirely warlike. As for explaining anything I'm a simple ex soldier with hands on experience of Muslim attitudes but I'm no scholar. Interpretations of texts are exactly that, with all the variations in meaning thus implied.
Last edited by JTaylor; 05 March 2016 at 10:49 PM.
05 March 2016, 10:57 PM
#1016
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
06 March 2016, 02:40 AM
#1017
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 48,539
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You've missed Islam (15%) and Christianity (2.5%) which accounts for more than 200 million souls. Hindus account for 80%.
You assume wrong. As Swati attested earlier , Hindus revere Jesus as a holy man and the 180 million Muslims I mention above all recognise Jesus as a major prophet. Including the 2.5% Christians, that's 97.5% of all Indians who revere and worship Jesus.
As I've stated on at least a dozen occasions it is my firm belief that Jesus is the only way to the Father.
You assume wrong. As Swati attested earlier , Hindus revere Jesus as a holy man and the 180 million Muslims I mention above all recognise Jesus as a major prophet. Including the 2.5% Christians, that's 97.5% of all Indians who revere and worship Jesus.
As I've stated on at least a dozen occasions it is my firm belief that Jesus is the only way to the Father.
I ought to clarify.
I did not attest that 97.5% of the Indian Indians 'worship' Jesus. My dad did, but that doesn't mean that the rest do.
India is very tolerant (to other religions) and a God-obsessed country. They'd worship almost anything there. From cars to animals, from sky to rocks! More so, if the object has any religious importance from any religion of the world, whatsoever. However, I'd say that almost 95% of the population (excluding 2.5% Christians) recognises Jesus Christ as prophet for Christianity and most (if not all of that 95%) may revere him as an avatar (incarnation), but they do not worship Jesus Christ. They worship their own prophets and avatars, related to their own religion. Unlike my home, it's not that usual to find Jesus's poster of framed image in a Hindu home, although wearing a holy cross around the neck became very fashionable among the young Hindus in the 80's. I'd still say you have more chance of finding Jesus's image in a Hindu home than finding any of the Hindu Gods' image in an Indian Muslim's or Indian Christian's home. I'd say '0' chance, to be honest.
It doesn't matter, though. With all the respect and recognition to all other religions and sects, the country remains predominantly Hindu and the Hindus worship Ganesha, Lakshmi, Shiva, Buddha, Sai and many other thousands of incarnations / avatars that they deem preferable to their own practice.
2.5% Indian Christians of India's total population certainly worship Jesus and they're entitled to worship the figure of their preference.
I'm wide awake at this odd hour because my one cat God is out galavanting. I've been whistling through my front door intermittently as my 'call in' to him since 12:30am but he's giving me a deaf ear. I can't rest until he returns. I should put the kettle on.
Last edited by Turbohot; 06 March 2016 at 02:43 AM.
06 March 2016, 03:08 AM
#1018
I'm awake too.One sugar please :-)
06 March 2016, 08:01 AM
#1020
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Home
Posts: 14,758
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
https://www.scoobynet.com/1034784-sc...l#post11801146
Last edited by JTaylor; 06 March 2016 at 08:04 AM.