Will supply nice cars if they Germans play silly beggars, oh and the Swedish, Americans and not to forget our own jaguar, land-rover.
Don't forget the French who are desperate to sell their cars

 

You're conveniently missing the point that nobody outside the UK really cares about the UK!

France and Sweden are in the same boat as Germany. The UK is quite an insignificant market with the steering wheel on the wrong side. Also, they will all be subject to the same tarifs, so the competition from other vehicle importers won't worry them.

OUR Jaguar Land-Rover is actually India's JLR and along with the German (Mini, Bently, RR), Japanese and American manufacturers with production in the UK, they will be more concerned about the losses they may occur if their manufacturing is no longer within the EU. Sales to the rest of the EU make up more of their sales than the UK does, so in the end, they will do the maths and decide if its more profitable to remain in the UK or shift manufacturing to Eastern Europe.

To any large international companies operating in the UK, car manufacturers or other, they certainly won't consider any loyalty to UK workers or tradition, it will only come down to they economic calculations that they make. The cost of staying in the UK compared to the cost of being outside of the UK. Much of their calculations will depend on the trade deals agreed post Brexit and how long it takes to make the agreements. Certainly some will remain, but some will certainly choose to leave the UK. The longer it takes to make the negotiations, then the more will leave.

 

Maybe they should have thought about that a bit more before playing the awkward card at every step of the way when Dave the Rave was trying to negotiate the concessions he wanted in his quest to try and avoid Brexit in the first place. Just sayin'

As for the trade stuff, since the advent of the WTO, tariffs ain't what they used to be, and 90% of the world's foreign trade is done at tariff rates lower than 5%, with or without trade deals in place. To the average UK consumer, that's a drop in the ocean compared with the 20% VAT which is slapped on just about everything in this country.

 

Lol, if we leave its Germany's fault

 

Out out out , thought I doubt the majority of the uk will have the ***** to vote out , with starting an argument I thought we've had several wars to defend our right to freedom and not to be controlled by someone in Brussels ??

 

Which wars have we fought to keep our freedom from Brussels?

Who's threatening your freedom?

There's a whole lot more 'freedom' under threat if we leave than if we stay.

 

Yes, I have never understood this "freedom" thing

It would be interesting for someone who thinks they aren't free to explain exactly what they mean

 

Interesting you should mention the war!

Hitlers rise to power was based on Nationalistic (****) anti-immigration views, in particular against Jewish and Roma, who were taking German jobs and Germany's percieved loss of self governance thanks to the treaty of Verseille signed after WWI.

Sounds a little familiar

 

My post was in response to BMWhere b!tching that it would be OUR fault if the EU implodes and/or self-destructs as a result of us leaving. If you actually agree with that position, that only proves one thing, which is that the EU is a dead beast walking and isn't worth saving to start with. If on the other hand you simply hadn't read his post ...

 

B1tching, sure!!

Maybe you need to re-read his post

Just sayin

 

Unfortunately people don't want to read what they don't want to hear! Which is true for people set on both sides of the argument.

I was certainly not bitching, I was merely stating the concerns in Germany (and likely other EU members) about Brexit that you don't get in the UK press, which seems to be under the impression that the rest of the world somehow depends soley on trading with the UK.

Let me make my position a little clearer...

I'm in the EU and whatever the UK votes for, I'm staying in the EU, be it with work permit or taking German nationality. I'm British and proud of my background, but I also consider myself a European and I would prefer for the UK to remain, because, having seen life on both sides of the channel, I truely believe the UK is better off in the EU. But if the UK wants out, then you're the ones that have to live with it! Its not going to have a major affect on my life other than being sadly dissapointed at the small mindedness of the British people.

 

And I'm sure Germany will welcome you with an attitude like that

 

I was going to apologize for (mis)representing the views of the Germans about Brexit as your own, but it's pretty clear now that you do in fact share them to quite some extent.

As for your point that Brexiters believe the world's trade somehow revolves around the UK, that has to rank as one of the strangest and most outlandish claims I've come across in this entire debate, and you'd be doing international relations a massive favour if you tried to set the Europhiles or other locals around you straight on that. The primary reason why 99% of the people here want to leave is because the EU has turned into a bloated and inefficient jobs-for-the-boys scheme for smarmy bureaucrats, nothing more, nothing less.

 

But interestingly, a claim that is supported by the fact that posts on this very thread regarding our trade relationship suggest we don't need Europe, they needs us

I can dig them out if you want

 

The much heralded piece of legislation promoted by David Cameron which would give UK court ultimate power over EU courts has been ditched.

The comments are, it is un-workable whilst still in the EU. What!! These were made Stephen Crabb the current wok and pensions Minister(pro EU).

So Despite David Cameron promising that we would have UK control by his renegotiation's with the EU, it is not possible whilst we remain in the EU

Just another one of the failed promises this government has made in an attempt to fool the public he did a wonderful job

Vote LEAVE!

 

I somewhat doubt that this is the primary reason why many want to leave. Going off the majority of comments I've heard, immigration is clearly the primary reason people want out!

As for the EU being bloated, maybe, maybe not, I don't know any statistics or research on the matter about how many bureaucrats the EU needs to be able to function correctly vs the actual size of the EU. Nigel Farrage is certainly a smarmy bureaucrat, on that we can certainly agree! I won't ever try and argue that the EU organisation is in anyway perfect, very few organisations are. For me, the biggest problem is the whole moving between Brussels and Strasbourg every month - any bloating and jobs-for-the-boys problems pale into insignificance against this! But just because an organisation has problems, should we scrap it or try and fix it?

What about the NHS? That is also an extremely bloated, inefficient and a jobs-for-the-boys scheme with far too many managers and not enough doctors! Should we scrap the NHS or perhaps should we try and reform it to be fit for purpose?

Local councils, Whitehall, the British Government - also bloated, inefficient and jobs-for-the-boys! Perhaps we should abandon all government and reinstate the Queen as a single authority?

What about the FA? Are they fit for purpose? Should we ban football?

The argument to leave the EU because its governance isn't perfect is akin to a baby throwing its toys out of the pram! We shouldn't abandon things that are principally a good idea just because they're not working as well as they could/should - we just need to reform them to make them better!

 

And yet, the facts as they are, show that THEY sell us FAR more than we sell them? Hence, they need us more than we need them?
I'd have thought that was simple even for a remainer?


As for us not being a great market for BMW/Merc/VAG, don't you believe it.

Get some figures for yourself.

 

NOT freedom from Brussels, Martin, and you know it

But yes, my father fought to have the UK free to do as it wished and NOT under the control of anyone else. As did many other men, and women, some of whom made the ultimate sacrifice......and for you to make light of that is pretty low.

The EU are threatening our freedoms, freedom to deport, freedom to refuse entry etc etc.

Please justify your last ludicrous statement?

 

Freedom of movement.

Not to mention all the accumulated rights and protections for consumers and employees we have via the EU

And please explain where I have EVER made light of the sacrifice of our servicemen or women. I think you are really reaching now.

 

okay, so you are simply moving the goalposts

we were talking about Germany - i provided figures that did not support your fantasy that Germany would simply roll over and take it up the sh1tter and let us have our cake and eat it

now you change it to "they" presumably you mean the WHOLE of the EU

well derrr - yes off course the whole of the EU does

 

The EU does not threaten your freedom, that's just baloney

 

If roughly 45% of our exports are to the EU, yet only roughly 16% of EU exports are to the UK, why do you think that they are selling far more to us than we are to them?

The actual amount may be bigger, but the percentage is much smaller, we have far more to lose.

We are their largest single export market, but so what?

Of course, we will continue to trade, it's just under what terms.

 

don't confuse him with actual facts and figures

 

Bit like Boris in many ways. Except at least Alcazar means what says.

 

Sure, the UK is a great market, but, for one, the people who buy overpriced Luxury cars like BMW/Merc/Audi/Porsche etc. will still buy them even if they cost more. VW may have a little more to lose, but as long as the competition from France, Italy, Japan or wherever are operating under the same trade restrictions, there won't be a significant drop in sales for them, its just the price will be higher for the UK consumers.

This is exactly the point, the UK will continue to import from the EU, maybe the numbers will fall a little, but on the grand scheme of things, the loss to companies in the EU zone from the UK leaving will only account for a tiny portion of their overall business.

As for the EU importing from the UK, I personally can't think of anything that the UK exports that couldn't be sourced from somewhere else. Why should other EU countries continue to import from the UK when they can get the same things for a lower price from other EU countries or China. There is no way in hell the UK could compete with Chinese labor and manufacturing costs on an open global market.

So the pressure for the EU to offer the UK great trading terms because they need us is completely fictional. Yes, the other EU states currently import a lot from the UK, because we're in the EU and can offer competitive prices without tariffs, leave the EU and the EU will buy elsewhere.

 

Seeing this has gone on to cars...what extra cost is it for a manufacturer to make a right hand drive car with MPH dials?

The fact that BMW refuse to make a M135i with Xdrive (AWD) in RHD must indicate that there is a expense to make and sell a car to a more limited market...

 

additional tooling for the machines, design changes to make all the mirrored components fit. Tooling alone will run into millions, but in the grand scheme not alot, there just making extra money cos they know we will pay it

 

The problem with Xdrive (or 4matic) in particular is likely to be that the additional transmission components are relatively bulky, so redesigning them to also fit in a RHD version of the same car is actually not that straightforward. On 2wd cars, the extra potential revenue from selling to RHD markets will far outweigh the development costs of relocating the steering column and other components.

Edit: Adding also that the awd market is already a niche segment, so the cost overhead for the redesign makes up an even bigger proportion of the likely revenue gain.

 

the great thing is that if the price of German cars goes up

it won't be a problem - because we have a world class finance industry that will make ready cheap money/credit available for the

"I want" - generation

what could possibly go wrong with that!!!!

 

We don't need the freedom of movement that is in place at the moment. It gives us the right to go and live abroad, yes, but it gives FAR too many people the right to come and WORK here. OK if your job is well-paid and secure, Not so OK if it's not. Today's figures say that nearly 7% of our workforce now comes from the EU.....

Aaaaaand, we are back to martin's IAJFEE.

The accumulated rights etc are now on our statute books and would have to be actually removed. if they WERE, the government would be at the next election. Scaremongering.

You belittled their sacrifice by apparently misunderstanding about them having fought to be free from Brussels..it's not a subject to make lilght of, and you did.