suba

i ride a scooter and i can beat any cars going into london (even with a pillion) during peak time, including police pan european bikes .

there is a time and place for bikes to beat cars, and vice versa. also, for a car driver, you got the comfort of air-bags, seat-belts, safety cage, etc so you will be more daring to push just a little more. as for a biker, there's no such comfort, and it's all down to the biker's confident on the handling of the bike and the knowledge of the road/track.

Pavlo

Bikes are always going to have a head start, they weigh less, don't encompass the rider, have lower frontal area, and use high quality engines even in road bikes.

But you can always design a car (4 wheeled vehicle) to go round corners faster than a bike simply because of the shape of a bike/rider, and the limits of running tyres on their sides, and just being able to lean enough.

If you want to compare 4/2 wheels, why not compare a 250cc GP racing kart to a 250cc GP bike. Same engine in some cases, just 4 wheels as apposed to two. All up weight in long circuit trim is about 200kg on the kart (set by rules) how does this compare? Cost would be less than the bike for sure. I might be able to find some lap times for circuits that bikes race on.

I suggest you check this out:
http://www.superkart.org.uk/Downloads/LAP%20RECORDS.doc

Anyone have any comparative times for bikes, Oulton, Mallory and Donny should be available.

Paul



[Edited by Pavlo - 7/10/2002 6:17:44 PM]

[Edited by Pavlo - 7/10/2002 6:22:02 PM]

Tiggs

pavlo,

i think ppl (apart from craig ) are sticking to raod car road bike as that is what they own and that is what they see everyday on the way to work....im sure karts are very quick though!

T

ps- quick ring time is 8.15 for a good rider i guess?

puppypower

Now put your baby, dog and pram on it and see how fast it goes!

Pavlo

I agree, but somehow the discussion became:

"Bikes are always faster than cars, except when the cars go faster still, and that's not fair".

I think it's odd, that some think that because a car designed without a roof, air con, stereo, heater 4 seats and so on it's not a fair match against a bike.

It's possible for cars to go quicker, but I agree costly. But not many production cars use what amounts to mass produced race engines.

Karts are quite quick, but they are not as powerful as some would have you believe. Twin cylinder rotax powered kart, used the same engine as the Aprillia 250 gp bike, good for about 80-85hp circa 1997. But you can use nearly all that power nearly all the time, having said that they do lift the front wheels on a standing start.

Think I should point out that have no great wish that bikes shouldn't be faster than cars, as said above, going fast is what they (bikes in blade class) are for.

Paul

W9GTR

Hmmmmmmmmmm I love it when a thread comes together
Craig would that be the westie that couldn't keep up with the blade that you're building?
Seriously though I do like the look of the new westie and am considering one for myself, but as you're building one I'll wait till you've had all your teething troubles sorted and have a go in yours before making up my mind (if you let me of course)
Let me know when it's finished.
Steve

LG John

I've got £13k and love fast vehicles. Lets see, 0-100 in 6 seconds bike or a scooby.........I'll take the scooby everytime mate

W9GTR

Saxo boy
I spose your right mate, you wouldn't look quite as good navigating the high street for the 25th time on a friday night on a bike. For a start nobody would be able to see your face through the dark visor, secondly the infamous "right hand crossed over to the left of the steering wheel while struggling to peer over the dashboard" pose would deffo be out of the question as you would have no steering wheel not to mention the lack of uump cha uump cha from the Kenwood
Only kidding by the way
Steve

LG John

I'm 6 foot and don't own a cap and while I could afford a £13k scooby I couldn't afford to run through Edinburgh's main streets 25 times @ 20mpg! Let's make this fair, for ever 2 wheels a bike has an engine.......think we can get another flat four turbo in the boot of a scooby lads?

CraigH

Steve,

Yeah that's "almost" the one.

Except theirs is heavy and low powered - ours will be, err, different

We've already saved 35kg without really trying

Jza

Car drivers/Anti bikers please read:

Another question... Fun Factor.

Does ultimate top speed and low lap times rock your boat? The bike got 10/10.

We drive cars that really flatter our skills.

Bikes are so much more FUN... you can take you lap times, wet weather performance, better braking etc and shove it up your ****.......

Notice that every person who owns a bike on this BBS always raves about them.... ever wonder why you 4 wheel only muppets???

BUY A BIKE AND FIND OUT. Its a different world to driving a fast Jap car. You get your knee down for the first time and your interests in life take a dramatic change of direction...

BIKES RULE and i've got a bike and a scoob - so i figure i should know

Jza

Sheepsplitter

Well said Jza!

MattOz

Bikes and Cars - AGAIN!! I Love it! LOL

I've been lucky enough to have a large number of bikes and cars. Bikes include Blades, ZX9-R, Aprilia RSV-R etc, and cars such as STI 5 V-ltd, Skyline etc. Not even on a crappy British summers day can any car I've had be as much fun as my bike. No Sir!!

I believe that Jza hit the nail on the head, when he said that it's the bike riders on the bbs that really know, and the car only drivers come up with weather and condition excuses to bolster their blinkered side of the banter.

Show me rain, and I'll still see you in my rear view mirrors. Sure, you'll be a little closer, but that's only until the next bit of straight! LOL

Lastly, I believe that bikers make better car drivers too, because of their increased spatial awareness and their reduced reaction times!

Cheers
Matt

CraigH

Agree with matt on bike riders being better drivers (I must be an exception )

Reckon Westies with bike engines are as close as you can get to the fun of a bike - they may even be a little scarier - at least on a bike your 4ss is more than 6inches off the ground

LG John

My problem with bikes is the way they accelerate. I much prefer the feeling/sensation of being pushed into a seat than clinging on to something. I've riden a powerful jetski which would murder any road bike 0-30 (no traction issues is water) and whilst it was fun, the feeling of being hauled along didn't float my boat. That and the fact it was almost impossible to keep hold of the bars if you cranked up full throttle

Jza

"I much prefer the feeling/sensation of being pushed into a seat than clinging on to something"

Matron!!!!! Gnaff Gnaff bet you say that to all the boys!!!

LOL

Jza

LG John

LOL, That's not even funny

teambwr47

Its a track and thats where it all should end!!!!
Bike on race track as opposed to a road where he can't apex knowing there is nothing coming the other way, tyres warmed very nicely at the track good tarmac etc etc etc .
Jamie Robinson is an ex British bike champion/Grand Prix rider and as far as i'm aware the testers are no where near that standard in terms of their car credentials??
Normal day bike versus P1 on a tight narrow tree lined B road car wins no doubt.
Before anyone starts to shout.
I am a bike rider and take me to Brands or any other Uk track with my bike and car and the situatuion i know will be reversed.
Equally give me the two and close the road allow me to put tyre warmers on the bike and check the route and again say goodbye to the car.
Its horses for courses and situations!!

teambwr47

However for sheer adrenalin and despite loving me P1 to bits, the bike wins every single time no matter how good your car may be!

Hoppy

Anyone who thinks bikes are slower has never ridden one. Try 0-60 in 2.3 secs. That's the fastest time MCN has ever recorded, on an old GSX1100R with longish wheelbase by today's standards.

Having said that, Performance Bikes mag took an R1 and a Caterham Superlite to Dono and the car was fractionally quicker. Everyone was amazed. Those Caterhams are mega-quick.

Richard.

CraigH

The car tester in EVO was Simon Harrison - I believe he's a BTCC champion (of sorts)

Bikes still suck though

W9GTR

Pavlo
So what's the fireblade, a pumped up pushbike?

Or a not so mini superbike...

No mate i think you my friend are missing the point. The blade is a road Bike that costs circa 9k pure and simple. The Radical is primarily designed as a trackday car and cost 45k. If an out the crate bike can produce a time like 1.14 on the standard (****e) suspension, what time would it produce if you chucked Ohlins forks/shock/damper at it, super sticky rubber (super corsa for eg.) and lifted the **** end to sharpen up the steering, filter, zorst and power commander. Methinks the Radical would have been in trouble Total cost of bike plus mods circa 13k.
I am a relative newcomer to bikes but even I am constantly amazed at how quick you can "make progress" on 2 wheels. By the way for any one who doesn't know i also own a Scoob and a 450bhp Skyline so I have no reason to err on the side of bikes other than real life experience. I have followed Birdy down quite a few roads in my time and I seriously doubt you would see which way he'd gone in a Scoob (unless it was snowing of course)
Still nice to see all the self proclaimed experts with no experience of riding coming out of the woodwork again
Steve

[Edited by W9GTR - 7/10/2002 8:33:49 PM]