AndyC_772

iTrader: (2)

Based on the experience of my own car's PPP, I'd certainly look at Prodrive's offering first. The quality of the parts is beyond reproach, reliability is rock solid (touch wood!), and the power delivery is very smooth and just where it's needed - even if a few more horses wouldn't have gone amiss for the money. I believe that Prodrive seem to have their priorities much the same as mine.

I'd probably have the PPP fitted from new, so that the cost just became part of the same big bill as the car, then I wouldn't have to think about it as much

Andy.

Big Goon

If I had no warranty issues to worry about then I would deffo go the full de-cat route with a remap, infact I may still go that way even if the PPP is released.

Pooder

Ids
Agree about the brake dust but your slow speed brake problems are strange I am not getting this-Brembos should be faultless suggest you contct your dealer for imediate replacement
Steve

Pooder

Ids
Rattle in yr rt ear try moving the seat belt
Steve

Big Goon

Think he means the pads knocking while at low speeds, normally from cold or reversing etc, just the design of the caliper with floating pads I believe, my old Brembos did the same.

wacky.banana

Dave TS,

I have some sympathy with Scoobcar60. Perhaps we have all been guilty of perpertuating the hype around the impending PPP without pushing Prodrive harder for more info.

I note from your threads that you (may) have some knowledge of what's coming; however IMHO, that might only help to fuel the flames of frustration from others who want that information in order to make an informed choice (how the hell do you get smileys when you want them?).

I definitely don't agree with dealers taking deposits (allegedly) in order for Prodrive to gauge demand. There's other ways of doing this (ie gauging demand).

If Prodrive, via this BB, become aware of dealers either giving out incorrect information or may be misrepresenting Prodrives position (I will assume this is happening by accident, as I don't have the evidence to say otherwise), then they should be doing something about. If they don't then I fear the loomimg reality of the scenario where would be customers become so disenchanted with the whole idea of the upgrade that they just walk away!

As you know my choice for upgrade will be elsewhere (and I will be looking for hard evidence/data, etc first before I commit) as I'm not keen on all this cloak & dagger stuff. For those who want the upgrade perhaps it might be wise to bypass the dealers and go to Prodrive direct for info?

Yes, I am aware that they might say "go back to your dealer"; however push hard. If all you get is that there is nothing to say at this time then at least that's a result. I can't see Prodrive being insensitive to the dangers of an increasingly restive customer base, especially if that disenchantment were to feed back to the press, perhaps?!!(smiley here)

Cheers

WB

scoobycar60

This is becoming a pointless and fruitless quest but...

Dave T-S I can assure you I am fully awake

I chose to buy an STI for many reasons performance being one of them, I know of no one "forced" to buy one???

If I thought an evo 7 was a better car I would most certainly have bought one.

The emissions info is news to me, Thank you for that, it helps explain a lot.

Warranty is important to me otherwise I certainly would have bought a JDM car.

Andrewza

I don't think anyone is complaing (yet) about what we'll get more complaining about the massive lack of communication between Prodrive, IM and Dealers. From the rumours of there being a PPP months ago, to there definitely being a PPP, but nobody (apart from you Dave, which I agree adds to the frustration) knowing what it is exactly and what figures we can expect. I just think IM needs to make sure all their official representatives are singing from the same hymn sheet so no-one ends up disillusioned or disappointed with this farcical release of the PPP.

Dave T-S

Scoobycar60
I was probably a bit sharp with you, for which I apologise

Having fitted non approved parts in the past which has been an exercise with mixed results, I'm now fairly defensive of Prodrive and what they do - and they don't even pay me!

Andrew
The feeling I get reading between the lines is that IM appear to have jumped the gun in releasing info to dealers/dealers releasing info to owners and this hasn't helped things.

Pooder

Andrewza
Yes its wierd Ive been getting 4-6weeks from my dealer since I bought mine 3 months ago. See my other thread a dealer is quoting a bhp figure in the Sunday Times(STI with PPP for sale)

Phil Harrison

'Pity we keep on getting new threads about this, few of which throw much new light. Remember, quite a few Scoobynetters have been driven by Mike in the development car, (including me ) and not one of us has said that it's anything other than awesome!

We know it improves the 3000 to 4000 range, not only 'cos Mike says so, but because we've experienceded it (and I agree with Neil that I, for one, don't need too much more in the >4000 range for road driving). I don't give a toss whether its 301 bhp or 305 - I can't tell the difference when driving! I DO, of course, expect 'around 15% extra power and torque' for it to be worthwhile.

The value-for-money is subjective: question is, are you prepared to pay a total of £29490 (prodrive body) for the driving experience you'll get (and the warranty you'll keep)? Well, it's still 2 grand less than a P1 was (that should get 'em going again ) And you can do one of two things - 1) wait for a demonstrator near you: and wait again at the end of the queue, or 2) form a judgement from the reports you've had on Scoobynet, and take a risk. Isn't it, in part, to find out what other Scoobynutters think about a whole variety of matters, that makes you read and post?

Ids/Pooder:
Yep: heaps of brake dust (but for some reason apparently not as adhesive to the alloys as was the dust from my mainstream MY'00 & '99 model.) Yep, a rattle, tho' from the nearside rear suspension, the subject of endless threads on the "suspension" board. Nope, not into ICE (tho' I'd like speed-sensitve volume as fitted to my previous Calibra Turbo).

....And using too much oil......? (about to start a thread on this)

I have only the same old question....

W-H-E-N?

Cheers,

Phil

scoobycar60

Thanks for that Dave T-S, no offence taken, actually I think we probably agree on most things! I'm a firm believer in Prodrive products and as you I have had mixed results with other kit.

wacky.banana

Dave,

Thanks for the smiley info. Important really so people get a feel for where one is coming from (the written word can be such a dangerous thing for inflaming passions!).

To whoever made the comment about the rear nearside suspension rattle, I'm beginning to wonder whether this is a suspension problem or the jack & kit moving about in its holder. Mine's coming out tomorrow to see if it makes any difference.

Thanks for the various responses to this thread so far, keep them coming. There's nothing like a healthy, friendly debate about a subject we all lurve (the STi, that is) to keep the juices going.

Cheers

WB

Dave T-S

WB
You can now use the smilie for when the PPP is going to arrive LOL

wacky.banana

Dave,

LOL

Phil Harrison

No, Wacky, the jack's under the driver's seat, and we've tried the parcel shelf fix, and the seatbelt fix, all to no avail

Phil

Dave T-S

WB



Dave

IFG

To be honest I think the difference between any other release of a manufacturer approved upgrade via the dealers and the Subaru one is that we know a little too much before it actually happens. This only goes to increase the frustration. We know that Prodrive employees (and friends of) frequent this board and therefore tend to believe that the rumours put about could be true.

It doesn't help that Dave TS keeps replying in various threads that he knows the facts but can't tell us. It would have been better if he'd just not replied.

Ian.

Dave T-S

WB

In view of IFG's comments, I shan't post on the issue again....

wacky.banana

Dave,

Probably best not to, it only raises expectations, etc. Don't take offence at IFG's comments, he makes a fair point. I think I put it a bit more subtly yesterday.

Anyway on a much brighter note how are yours and Mrs TS' STi's going then? Just had my 1K service today so I no longer need to watch the 4.5K rev limit. Think the car is awesome, still learning how to drive it properly though (6 speed gearbox plus torque band in the wrong place can make for some interesting situations!)

Keep on posting, just keep your head down on the PPP stuff.

Cheers, & regards to the missus.

WB

Dave T-S

WB
Carolyn's car has 5600 miles on now, and is still quicker than mine, with only 2300 miles (even with a Scoobysport decat centre and backbox). Mine got a lot freer around 1500 miles, but still has some catching up to do.

You settle into the handling after a while, and it is very quick cross country even with rain soaked roads and half worn original RE040 tyres on

The best bit of yours is still to come yet - enjoy

scoobycar60

DOH!
Please dont go Dave T-S, the cats out of the bag and the horse has well and truely bolted now ....no chance to shut the gate so why not play along.

I am more guilty than most at "pushing it" w.r.t ppp and what you know, but you have provided us with some good answers on some issues. I appologise if I the issues have become contentious, that is not mine nor most peoples intent.

I for one value anything you care to share with us on what is going on with prodrive.

IFG in Dave T-S's defense I along with others pushed Dave T-S too hard over Prodrive and so he had to justify his position rightly with privaledged information. This is all a bit harsh IMHO, these threads started as friendly banter with Dave T-S loyally defending Prodrive. If you have read the previous posts I am sure you should understand this, your post is in effect far too late to be helpful in any way.

Please continue to post, I'll be good I promise.......

Pooder

Dave
Dont be upset keep posting
Steve

Pooder

Dave
Its interesting what you say about Carolyns car I am now at 4200 miles and cant believe how the performance keeps increasing. I have not had mine on a dyno but having had some serious moters before I am conviced mine is giving a lot more than 261 bhp
Steve

Dave T-S

Steve
Officially, it's 261.5 bhp - that extra half makes all the difference LOL

But seriously, my old WRX was around 250bhp, and there is a LOT of difference for 11 bhp or so extra, which anyway is more than offset by the extra weight. The STi 6 speed box/gearing must be an issue, as well as the extra torque (even if it is above 4000 rpm).

wacky.banana

Dave,

I'm in danger of taking my own thread way off topic but what the hell. Have you thought that the reason why Carolyn's car is quicker than yours is because she lays off the chips and you don't(LOL & LOL again)?

Keep posting mate, your advice was invaluable when I needed answers to questions before I bought the car. You saved me from making an expensive mistake (remember our debate about turbo spiking on the STi7?).

Cheers again, top man.

WB

Pete Croney

I also know all the info on this. I have for some time. I have chosen to make no comment whatsoever.

I find the marketting strategy of this product totally stunning. Prodrive invited a select group of people from this BBS to drive the car, before Subaru UK had given the go ahead for the conversion. Dealers knew nothing and could find nothing out. Even now, the only official information is the price. Rumours abound about the bhp output, but the only think people seem really interested in is the torque output and, specifically, where the peak torque is.

The STi is a great car, tragically stunted by a massive lack of performance below 4,000 rpm. Boot it from 80mph in 6th... excited?

Surely if Subaru want to get some firm idea of sales they should get a spec sheet and graphs out now, together with a release date, instead letting the misinformation, missed dates and apathy ruin what may be a great product. Don't blame Prodrive, its Subaru you'll buy the product from and Subaru who market it.

Remember the P1 marketting? How long did it take to shift them all after a lack of information caused hundreds of people to order and then cancel when dates weren't met and specs weren't quite as good as the gossip? Hundreds sat unsold for almost a year, until they were sold off cheap to the dealer network. It would be funny (sad) if a bean counter somewhere was getting kits made up based the number of replies to (all of) the threads about it on this bbs.

And Dave... you old black WRX, in its full trim, would leave your STi('s), in current trim, for dead down the lanes Been there, done it

Of course, full boost at 3200rpm would help, but we'll have to wait and see won't we

GDBSTi

I agree 100% with Pete. Subaru South Africa have the same approach and because of this BMW kick there butt in sales here. A 2nd Hand E46 M3 cost twice as much as a new STi7 due to the high demand. Although 90% of the new E46 M3's and 100% of the 2nd Hand E46 M3's are sitting at the harbours ready to be shipped to Hong Kong and Singapore. This is due to BMW's own stupid pricing policy in the East and the UK for that matter, our E46 M3's cost 28 000 Ponds New . Perhaps the motorcar industry doesn't care for us enthusiast only their shareholders and right now the USA is KING for Subaru.

And by the way, according to my sources 3200rpm full boost would be useful in South Africa too :-)

johnfelstead

i wonder how they chose that select group?

scoobycar60

I would love to know too......

Know what you mean Pete below 4000rpm the performance of my Sti is somewhere between tragic and pathetic and the annoying thing is is shouldn't be so.

Unless "Subaru" as you rightly say pull their f**king finger out soon....

I for one will be looking long and hard at motec and your de-cat exhaust options.

and perhaps a group buy for an after market warranty.....