Foxhunting types:1, Motorists:0
17 September 2002, 04:24 PM
#182
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<devil's advocate>The agruments against fox hunting IMHO, also apply to fishing. If we have a conscience, then we should not fish either.</devil's advocate>
(Don't know if this point has been made but I can't be arsed to read 8 pages of posts
)
(Don't know if this point has been made but I can't be arsed to read 8 pages of posts
)
17 September 2002, 04:26 PM
#185
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Bleedin' 'ell - this was on page 2 when I went out at 0940.....page 9 now?!?! 
Can't face reading the 7 extra pages therefore I'm right you're wrong, the end.
Can't face reading the 7 extra pages therefore I'm right you're wrong, the end.
17 September 2002, 04:26 PM
#186
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<devil's advocate>The agruments against fox hunting IMHO, also apply to fishing. If we have a conscience, then we should not fish either.</devil's advocate>
1. The point's already been made that if fishing was 25 blokes running along the shore, whooping and screaming, before jumping in the lake and shredding any fish they caught, it probably would have been banned by now.
2. Controversial, but there's a great deal of research which claims that fish don't have nervous systems built to deal with pain. Therefore, they don't suffer in the same way as - for example - a mammal might.
17 September 2002, 04:27 PM
#187
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but I can't be arsed to read 8 pages of posts
Don't be so quick to criticise without at least following the thread
17 September 2002, 04:28 PM
#188
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Ok so let me get this straight, if i go and sit round a lake in the middle of nowhere, having a few beers and a few smokes waiting for mr carp to come along and take that lovely boilie sitting on the bottom of the lake, I wind him in, take the hook out of his lip and put him back in the water without touching him cos he is still in the net I landedhim in, thats as bad as going out and tearing a fox to pieces is it?
Some people
Some people
17 September 2002, 04:30 PM
#189
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Right. I'm bored of this. I also know from previous experience that it's a discussion which will never be resolved, because of the fundemental differences of opinion of each side. We're more likely to see the Palestinians and Israelis forming a peaceful alliance against the US before we see the pro- and anti-hunting lobbies agree. 
I'm going to butt out now, and leave you all too it.
I also know from previous experience that it's a discussion which will never be resolved, because of the fundemental differences of opinion of each side. We're more likely to see the Palestinians and Israelis forming a peaceful alliance against the US before we see the pro- and anti-hunting lobbies agree. I'm going to butt out now, and leave you all too it.
17 September 2002, 04:30 PM
#190
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1. The point's already been made that if fishing was 25 blokes running along the shore, whooping and screaming, before jumping in the lake and shredding any fish they caught, it probably would have been banned by now.
2. Controversial, but there's a great deal of research which claims that fish don't have nervous systems built to deal with pain. Therefore, they don't suffer in the same way as - for example - a mammal might.
2. Controversial, but there's a great deal of research which claims that fish don't have nervous systems built to deal with pain. Therefore, they don't suffer in the same way as - for example - a mammal might.
17 September 2002, 04:32 PM
#191
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I would also prefer if all foxes were taken out via a farmer and his rifle, for one that would mean more business for me, but I can't really see that happening.
Most of the farms I do fox control on the farmer has an old relic of an airgun and *maybe* a s/s shotgun. Also, it's not exaclty easy to shoot foxes. Sure if one walks past you and you blast it with a shotgun no problem, but what if you've been called out to deal with a fox problem. I will call foxes in using varios method's this can take 1 - 4 hours depending, remeber this is also done at night.
Even then once you have the fox in 'range' you have to shoot it, normally 100-300 yards away,you have to be a competent marksman to do this. Bullet balistics, windage.
The Joe average farmer, with his air rifle, will cause more drastic problems. There are not enough fox marksman to meet demend.
If you get rid of fox hunting, more marksman will be needed, you need to keep a happy medium.
I digress....
Most of the farms I do fox control on the farmer has an old relic of an airgun and *maybe* a s/s shotgun. Also, it's not exaclty easy to shoot foxes. Sure if one walks past you and you blast it with a shotgun no problem, but what if you've been called out to deal with a fox problem. I will call foxes in using varios method's this can take 1 - 4 hours depending, remeber this is also done at night.
Even then once you have the fox in 'range' you have to shoot it, normally 100-300 yards away,you have to be a competent marksman to do this. Bullet balistics, windage.
The Joe average farmer, with his air rifle, will cause more drastic problems. There are not enough fox marksman to meet demend.
If you get rid of fox hunting, more marksman will be needed, you need to keep a happy medium.
I digress....
17 September 2002, 04:32 PM
#193
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Some people even eat the fish they catch not sure what happens to the fox that just got shreded but I will put a large wager on the fact the hunt don't go home and eat a fox steak!
not sure what happens to the fox that just got shreded but I will put a large wager on the fact the hunt don't go home and eat a fox steak!
17 September 2002, 04:33 PM
#194
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I wind him in, take the hook out of his lip and put him back in the water without touching him cos he is still in the net I landedhim in, thats as bad as going out and tearing a fox to pieces is it?
17 September 2002, 04:34 PM
#195
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I am a little concerned that we have forgotten about the squirrels and badgers....in favour of a balanced view I feel that we should not forget the day to day persecution that they face as well.
sorry 8 pages and I have decided to go muppetwards
sorry 8 pages and I have decided to go muppetwards
17 September 2002, 04:35 PM
#196
I wasnt going to post another reply as this thread is getting a bit out of hand, but what the heck. I made my position clear several pages back now and cant be bothered to recap. Basically I do not like fox hunting but am very opposed to banning it, for reasons I have spelt out. It is cruel, it is ineffective as a means of pest control - no argument there whatsoever.
One thing is very clear to me from this thread - I am in a minority. I have no doubt that hunting will be banned. That is how a democracy should work and whatever my opinions, I have to accept that. Unfortunately whenever this topic is raised there are a lot of pro-hunting people who really ought to keep quiet as they make inflammatory comments which only strengthens the cause of the majority of people who are against it.
One thing is very clear to me from this thread - I am in a minority. I have no doubt that hunting will be banned. That is how a democracy should work and whatever my opinions, I have to accept that. Unfortunately whenever this topic is raised there are a lot of pro-hunting people who really ought to keep quiet as they make inflammatory comments which only strengthens the cause of the majority of people who are against it.
17 September 2002, 04:39 PM
#198
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I went on a Squirrel hunt, I kid you not! The was a plague of the little grey rats with fluffy tails and they were doing serious damage.
Myself and about 20 other people went into the woods to get rid of the majority of them.
There was a follow up on every squirrel that was brought out the tree to ensure it was dead. Mainly due to the fact that we thought it would be cruel to let them suffer.
Myself and about 20 other people went into the woods to get rid of the majority of them.
There was a follow up on every squirrel that was brought out the tree to ensure it was dead. Mainly due to the fact that we thought it would be cruel to let them suffer.
17 September 2002, 04:40 PM
#199
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Because it has gone back in the water in less than 2 minutes normally without me touching it, let alone ripping the living daylights out of it.
The only point you can justify here is possible stress caused by fighting it while winding it in. The fish goes onto live another day wiser in the fact it is more reluctant to take bait and just as healthy as before it took the bait. And if you know anything about carp fishing you will know they are not dumb fish but extremely wise old ******* that get more and more crafty the older they get. Also if they were damaged in any way then they wouldnt go onto live to a ridiculous age and getting to 60lb is size
It is no where comparable to ripping an animal to pieces with other animals!
The only point you can justify here is possible stress caused by fighting it while winding it in. The fish goes onto live another day wiser in the fact it is more reluctant to take bait and just as healthy as before it took the bait. And if you know anything about carp fishing you will know they are not dumb fish but extremely wise old ******* that get more and more crafty the older they get. Also if they were damaged in any way then they wouldnt go onto live to a ridiculous age and getting to 60lb is size
It is no where comparable to ripping an animal to pieces with other animals!
17 September 2002, 04:43 PM
#202
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Quote from Page 7 of this marathon thread:-----By NeVeTaS
__________________________________________________ ______________
"Well said Puff, I run a country side management company, and my biggets problem is mis informed Tw*ats ranting and raving about stuff they know nothing about.
Sure a load of ""toffs"" going about on horses may not be your cup of tea, thats fair enough. But get to know all the facts first.
Contact me via email and I will send you pictures of what foxes do to small calves and piglets. If the ""toffs"" don't hunt them, the farmer will end up sending his son out with an underpowered airgun to do the job, resulting in 1,000's of injured foxes.
If you do not live in the country, try not to pretend you know how it all works!!!!!"
__________________________________________________ _______________
Mr NeVeTas, very valid point Matey my view entirely.
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17 September 2002, 04:43 PM
#203
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Read this at page 2, cant be arsed reading rest.
If they kill the foxes, then that means less foxes on the road to then get hit by a car
Which would you rather have, it killed in a field or stuck in your FMIC or radiator
Just my 2p worth
If they kill the foxes, then that means less foxes on the road
to then get hit by a carWhich would you rather have, it killed in a field or stuck in your FMIC or radiator
Just my 2p worth
17 September 2002, 04:44 PM
#204
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Bravo, mate, I was playing devil's advocate - I have occasionally fished meself.
I have no desire to see fishing or foxhunting banned. But as MarkO says, there will be no easy resolution to this discussion.
I have no desire to see fishing or foxhunting banned. But as MarkO says, there will be no easy resolution to this discussion.
17 September 2002, 04:45 PM
#207
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But squirrels are cute. You can't kill them
(10 points to anyone who can identify the quote)
[Edited by MarkO - 9/17/2002 4:46:07 PM]
17 September 2002, 04:47 PM
#208
Scooby Regular
Ah, Albino squirrels; they operate a bit like Knight Rider, a mysterious organisation who operate above the law. By day they mostly hide and by night come in force in high powered American cars to steal nuts from Asda.
On a Ch5 documentary last night.
On a Ch5 documentary last night.
17 September 2002, 04:48 PM
#209
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**** me, its 4.45 and I've done bugger all this afternoon except post on this thread - I'm off to do some work...LOL>
Wonder how many pages there will be tomorrow
D
Wonder how many pages there will be tomorrow
D