jon hill

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Disco:
<B>
Fiat 146's are from italy it doesn't make them great!!!!

[/quote]

great italian cars ?

my wife has a fiat 500 - now we're talking

Adam M

when did this become about the cars?

All of my comments were aimed at the senseless and insulting comments made at the expense of impreza drivers.

Barry, You can apologise for the evo bbs, but in two years I have never known anyone on this bbs to take pleasure (or merriment) at the prospect of another enthusiast damaging his/her car.

Aside from that, thanks for coming on and attempting to represent the other side. I think an impreza/integrale track day would actually be a fascinating proposition, so long as magazins dont get involved. Perhaps we should call on Stef for an official SIDC bent on the whole thing.

Disco

LOL @ Jon Hill

Rant Mode off (at last)
A dual track day sounds like a good idea, I'm sure we would all be enlightened by the experience and perhaps correct our prejudices about each others cars.

Blow Dog

Can I come?

Evotion

Fiat 500.. great fun.. Indeed a classic.
Those Italians sure can make snmall cars with plenty of character..
And 0-5 mph as fast as any scooby or Grale.

Adam M

Sorry cem, at the moment you have the wrong type of evo.

DazW

iTrader: (1)

I had an Evo Grale a few years ago and even took it to 'Bazza's' once . Great cars let down by a few niggles:

1 Fragile (Interior and Suspension)
2 Horrendous Service Costs (2 Services in 1 year - Whalleys and Walkers £1700 incl 1 cambelt change)
3 Lack of specialists, especially here in the midlands
4 You drive on the left - not a great problem out on its favourite twisty but a nightmare in town!
5 Took me 12 months to find a good 'un
6 Boy Racer magnet
7 Copper magnet (esp. red ones )
8 Mine got nicked!

DazW

PS 'Huggybear' is that you Mr Owens???



[This message has been edited by DazW (edited 05 September 2001).]

Tiggs

maybe its just me but....

some people seem to assume that the world is full of people who use car bbs's and buy autocar every week. but its not... most people think an intergrale looks like an old golf.

Tiggs

adamrj

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Adam M:
<B>...at the expense of impreza drivers.

...to take pleasure (or merriment) at the prospect of another enthusiast damaging his/her car.
[/quote]

This is not the case. As I've said on Evo forum there was no personal motive whatsoever, and it was not at the expense of any individual. I was purely commenting about the *car*.

Would you not laugh if you saw a crashed Reliant Robin (and knew the driver was OK)? Very much the same thing.

No offense was intended.

Andy Tang

iTrader: (3)

I guess I don't need to come to the track day, as I have an appreciation for both cars! (And other cars besides!)

A good friend of mine has wanted one since he was a kid, and has recently bought one. We are both car nuts and I love the look of the Lancia, but I like the power of my car! (Although he has spent a lot less money than I have!)

Oh well!! As we are all friends now, can we pick on the Cossie owners???

If the trackday goes ahead, I hope there is a high standard of driving from both sets of owners, as I can picture the carnage with people trying to prove their car is the best!!

BTW my girlfriend is sick of me pointing out Integrales and telling her about the rally history! They are a little more common where I live!!

Andy

14,500rpm

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by adamrj:
<B>OK, OK, OK. This is a public apology. I'm sorry. It was a crass comment and no, I didn't mean it. I'd have hoped that anyone who read it would have taken it in the vein it was intended, but then I didn't realise half of Scoobynet would read it.

As I've said on Evoforum, I don't know anything about Imprezas, but from what I've seen and read of them I'm not particularly impressed. This is just personal taste, what this whole thing is all about in the end.

And yes I'd be delighted to be enlightened. I may be biased, but I'm nevertheless always open minded. So many people can't all be mistaken, and if they all drove Grales, it would make the Lancia a far less special car.

One thing this has done is possibly brought Lancia owners and Subaru owners a little closer together. I'm sure you'll find that never before have so many Lancia owners joined this forum and vice versa on the Lancia forum!

So once again sorry.

Adam[/quote]

fair enuf, now everyone kiss and make up

14,500rpm

crono331

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chris L:
[B]Not going to get into this debate (much ) except to say that when owners of probably one of the most fragile cars ever snip

tut tut boy

i have always been an integrale freak, and since i am italian, i have seen loads of them. saying it is a fragile and unreliable car is totally wrong. i have many friends who had it as everyday car and made 100k+ miles on them without problems.

on the other side, most of the guys in UK who choose to buy a grale have already in mind at least 10 mods, all aimed at improving power and speed.

don't forget also that the average age of grales on the road is 8 years.

now take a 3rd hand 8 years old high performance car, heavily modify it and let's see how reliable it will be.

now, considering that my grale is currently in a garage with 16 bent valves, due to a washer some mechanic forgot inside the engine years ago, i am not considering to buy a impreza, or any other car. grales are special, and u cannot buy one in a car dealer. i bought a grale because despite the running costs, the HIGH fuel consumption, the difficulties in finding spares and their costs, and all the rest, i love this car. this is not only a car, is a legend, is part of car's and rallies history, is going to be a collector item soon, it looks great, it gives me great feelings, things i never experimented in any other car, no matter how powerful.

i am sure scoobies are great cars. sure they can be as fast as a grale, or even more, and they are way more reliable, quiet, cheap to run. they are also 10 years younger. still they will never be a grale.

that's maybe why the only two folks i know who own a impreza, don't even know how many bhp their car have.

u cannot really compare a scooby and a grale. they are two completely different pieces of hardware.
the grale is a no-compromise special car, built in small series, discontinued 8 years ago, built to win a world rally championship when rallycars had to be modified road cars and which did his job extremely well.
the impreza wrx is a modern mass produced car, built for everyday use, easy to drive, reliable, quiet, and for sure very fast. still, probably in 20 years time there will be a lot more grales around than scoobies.

gm

bigrex

I'm used to biased comments, I ONLY drive a Legacy, but I love it. I also LOVE Integrales (delicate as they are) Evo 1 to 7, Imprezas, in fact ANY proper car. I love cars, but I HATE narrow minded drivers who seem to thrive on slagging off other cars. Just enjoy them for what they are.

ptholt

Two of my mates that i attended trax with are grale owners and thoroughly nice chaps

I know one of them owned a subaru and he does have a soft spot for them still.

It tickles me tho that we get upset when people accuse of us being maxp brigade, yet posts on scobynet not long ago took great delight in slagging nova drivers off for the same thing etc.

Perhaps this is just a good time to have a new collective catch phrase 'performance car enthusiasts'.

HuggyBear

PS 'Huggybear' is that you Mr Owens???

It sure is!!
Is that you Mr Wakeman?!

I've had my 'Grale over 2 years now and you're the only (Ex)owner i've ever known not to have an alarm or immboliser fitted to his car!

Give me a shout and tell me what you've been up to all these years!

Derrick.

fast bloke

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by crono331:
<B>...quiet, cheap to run. they are also 10 years younger. [/quote]

LMAO -
quiet scooby - must be a 1600
cheap to run - have you been stealing petrol and driving without insurance again boy?
10 years younger. IIRC they stopped making grales in 93/94. What does a MY03 scooby look like?

Adam M

Adamrj,

thanks for the apology, I didn't mean to rant after you posted it, my screen hadn't refreshed for some reason so it has only just arrived.

No hard feelings, and I hope we can all meet up at this potential track day being organised.

To the italian guy whose post is above and whose name I have forgotten, sorry .

You arent comapring like with like at all. There are more bread and buter impreza turbos, in the same way there are lancia delta hf turbos. In the same way you have intergrales, we have stis, and further you have evos, we have versions 1 to 6, v limiteds and type rs.

Our special editions are certainly not common cars, many of them inteded fro homologation purposes for rally group n rallying. These are not particularly happy cars on the road, being ultra lightweight, having low gearing and no sound deadening at all. cars such as these can be directly compared with your intergrales.

I would say know your enemy, but I dont want it to be seen like that.

PS. I think you wil find the intergrale is a classic already, there is no question of that.

BarryWaterhouse

So let's get the track day under way.

Oh and watch out you Impreza drivers - we have a secret weapon in the shape of 'Stealth' - our own 16v Integrale (non EVO) which has about 300BHP and is pretty well sorted!

Glad to see that things have settled down.

SUNDAY DRIVER

The reason why I went over to Evocorner and hence started this post is that I had an Inregrale before I bought my wrx.I loved the Integrale and would love another one sometime as a weekend car.The cars are beautiful and I did not mean this in any way to become an Integrale slating post.
It was just the attitude in all posts where Scoobs(and it seems to be only scoobs) were mentioned that pissed me off.

Blow Dog

Can I come now?

jon hill

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Blow Dog:
<B>Can I come now?[/quote]

only if i can bring the fiat 500

nyssa7

do you do typos on your BBS or are you all too clever for that?????

yeah, some of our guys do typos, some are just crap at spelling - we take the **** out of them too!

can't get over how busy this forum is, wouldn't dare go on holiday cos it would take weeks to catch up again

nyssa7

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BarryWaterhouse:
[B]So let's get the track day under way.

I could be wrong, but I am under the impression that the forthcoming LMC track day at Castle Combe might be a little under-subscribed? Maybe some of the Scooby guys might like to come and play with us?

Says he who doesn't have anything to drive that day! (Barry, seeing as you andJames are both away, can I borrow Stealth!!)

pacenote

BarryK
Surely any track day timed or not can invalidate your warranty, however I’m talking about a track day at a sprint venue were times can be recorded for comparison only with no official results posted after the event. I did an event like this at Curborough sprint course near Lichfield awhile ago - great fun - abit like the 0 to 60 sprints at track days but longer and with a few bends thrown in

HuggyBear

Daz,
Is it DarrenW@XXXXXX ?

Ork,

Please read the word 'track' in your quote. I don't know what track you've been to, but out the 3 tracks i've attended none of them have speed limits.

cheers.

Al Cook

SUNDAY DRIVER and ALL

There's no problem in bringing the news across at how other people perceive 'us' (Scooby Drivers). It can be healthy and constructive to bring things like this into the open and discuss opininions.
That's where the main differences lie. This BB seems far more respectfull and polite to others' views and way of life. The users here all appear to be responsible owners and genuine enthusiasts. The MaxPwr tag associated with the grale BB can be aimed directly at the high number of non-grale owners strutting their stuff and leaking testosterone!

But I still get the feeling that grale owners are out prove something. Inferiority complexes abound, hence the language and defensive nature of their comments here.

I think I speak for everyone here (flame me if I don't! :rolleyes , that we are all enthusiasts of two great marques. One is a classic and undoudtedly a cult car, and the other has taken over that mantle. Grale owners should enjoy their cars, as we do. But they should not loose sight of the fact that this 'new kid' has pushed the envelope they they started, and should be appreciated in its own right.

Man, I should be a diplomat!!

BarryWaterhouse

"But they should not loose sight of the fact that this 'new kid' has pushed the envelope they they started, and should be appreciated in its own right."

I wonder what the situation will be in ten years time - history shows that mass produced cars do not become classics. There were barely more Integrales made than there are members of this forum. I am sure that some of the rarer editions of Imprezas will achieve the cult status of the Integrale but I think it is far from certain that the more run of the mill versions will ever be regarded in the same light.

One member of the Evoforum has both a P1 and a Martini 5 Evo - he uses the P1 for everyday driving and the Evo for weekend fun. I asked him which he would sell first if forced to and without hesitation he said the P1. The Subaru is undoubtedly more reliable and more suitable for everyday driving but in my opinion, lacks the style and involvement that the Lancia has. It is, perhaps the very fact that the Subaru is suitable for everyday use that condemns its chances of reaching the cult status of the 'Grale which will always remain an affordable (just) toy.

Adam M

Barry,
i think you are being nieve.

How about the beetle? highest production volume? or the mini or the morris minor? all cult cars! Hence the way they wave at eachother.

pacenote

This thread has certainly made a few newbies register.

I am in the fortunate position of owning both an Integrale (Evo 1)and an Impreza (MY98 WRX). I have the Lancia because I’ve always wanted to own the road version of a classic rally car and the Impreza because I wanted a modern version of the Integrale (at least IMHO if you have the 5 door).
Which is the best ? - thats hard to call but one things for sure they both give driver satisfaction and for me thats what it’s all about at the end of the day.

The track day thingy sounds like a good idea or how about a competition at a sprint venue where times can be recorded and compared.


[This message has been edited by pacenote (edited 06 September 2001).]

BarryK

Mr Note, bear in mind many Imprezas are still under warranty from Subaru UK (aka International Motors) and that specifically excludes them from taking part in timed speed trials and the like, unless thay wnat to void said warranty.

Therefore I am sure no such event will be carried out or recorded as that would be plain silly.

Presumably not a problem for the Lancias though.