Mr evolution

Basically people should actually try to see things from the point of view of the people involved on all sides. The trouble with the western world is that many people especially Americans believe the propaganda their governments churn out. The fact is as the victors the USA writes history as it sees fit not as it happend. This all builds up to a population that in the most part actively supports actions by its government that are totaly wrong and unjust. I consider this kind of stupidity a crime that should be punishable by death so I fully support the likes of Hez bollah Hamas and AL queda whenever they attack israeli or American targets I was with a friend watching TV when 9/11 happend and we both cheerd again and againh as the planes hitting the towers was replayed.

johnfelstead

there is so much crap spouted in this thread it's unreal.

You sick *******. How can you cheer the death of inocents, no matter what side you are on? Those buildings were full of people from almost every country and religion.

Yes, there are two perspectives to the way the USA conducts itself abroad and they have not yet understood why 9/11 happened IMHO. But that doesnt excuse this kind of act.

rich1231

Mr Evolution,
so you believe that nations like Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Iran, North Korea etc have a free press and methods by which citizens can express beliefs that differ with their governments? And as for your comments regarding 9/11, you are a muppet. You need locking up in a padded cell.

TelBoy

Mr Evolution, that is possibly the most offensive thing i have read on this or any other bbs.

I can only hope you are merely playing devil's advocate for the sake of the attention it will temporarily gain you.

Either that, or you have never experienced true human grief.

I know people who were killed on 09/11. Please ensure we never meet, for your safety.

Terry

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

Twin towers??? Hmmmm, no, can't condone that, BUT, and it is a big BUT, the USA has been actively supporting terrorism in Northern Ireland and Britain for decades now, and we still find it hard to make them understand.
Who was it who said that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter?
And b4 anyone starts abt Ireland, no, I can't condone what was done there, or continues to be done, either.:
I do, however, fail to see why it's our business, or the USA's for that matter, just because a particular country hasn't got freedom of speech/press.
All the Iraquis that we see on TV demonstrating for Saddam seem happy enough? There are republics all over Africa with unenviable records on human rights, but we're not even thinking of attacking them. No oil? Or don't our black friends count?:
And I have to say, once again, the Israelis are perhaps the worst offenders at the mo, but the wonderful USofA vetoed a motion at the UN to make them tone it down a bit, only last week. How come they get supported, saddam gets threatened?[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] Oh yeah, USA has plenty of Oranges of it's own.:
Alcazar

hotsam

Two Words: Jewish Voters

Claudius

I suppose he meant the symbol of the US's economic arrogance falling to pieces, not the death of the innocent people in there? I read it that way at least.

dba

Besides, what did the Romans ever do for us eh ?

hey Theo,they invented the Catholic church,don't be ungrateful!




[Edited by dba - 12/27/2002 6:26:24 PM]

DocJock

watch out, Dave's back !!

yoza

Mr Hanley,
What have you done......

Ive never heard or read of anyone cheering when those two planes hit the towers,just shows you how radical some people are.

Some very dangerous people out there.

Astounded Yoza

dsmith

Very funny thread - I only wish MarkO wasnt too tight to pay for his own Internet access so he too could enjoy it

My own 2 pennies....

Terrorism is a point of view- One mans freedom fighter is someone's elses criminal. Whilst I watched in abject horror as the Trade center was attacked there was a tiny little voice at the back of my head praying that it might be enough for the stupid americans who have supported and donated to the IRA to finally "get" it.

Even now I can't understand why America didn't publicly (via the UN) support us over the Falkands to match the private help they gave. In an almost eriey echo of WWII they publicly did nothing whilst behind the scenes did all they could. Anyone who believe America only started playing a role in WWII after Pearl Habour is clearly of below average intelligence. Without the support in terms on material we were recieving from them then we wouldn't have survived until they did join "Publicly".

And yet still in general it seems Americans are unable to take the crucial step back and view their countires actions dispassionately, take a wider look at the world and think perhaps that there might be ways to do things differently....

Was 9/11 a tragedy ? - of course ! - the greatest the world has ever seen ? - sorry I dont think so. For me that would be Hiroshima and Nagasaki - not the bombings in themselves - as tragic as that was - but the fact that they were deemed necessary to end a "World War" - one in which so many people were dying every day that those nuclear weapons were considered the best option to end it. Six years of horrendous human losses - not one day

Deano

SCOSaltire

The US think they are the worlds biggest military power.
and they are. No terrorism will change that.

Tho there are countries in this world who could also kill every living thing on the planet.

They are also the worlds worst polluter.
and they are not changing that - or even wanting too

if they do not sort out israel (the real 51st state - or indeed the homeland of the US - coz they certainly dont act like its europe) then more of the world will hate them. there will be more 9/11 (actually, for international peeps its 2001/09/11 ).

they dont seem to grasp that connection - israel, bully, hate, terrorism.

if they dont grasp it soon enough then something of the likes of Sum of all Fears will happen.

however, this N Korea thing is worrying - and we would all look to the UN (and hence the US) to help sort that.

And if the US was looking internal and never international - then the world could well go into a world war - neighbour attacking neighbour, allie attacking axis.

So - u cant live with them and u cant live without them.

as for ww2. shut the F*CK up about that. Millions died. Some of my family died. It was a dark time. We were all in it together. We are all part of this world. All our actions have consequences. Stop pissing against the wall.



[Edited by SCOSaltire - 12/27/2002 9:35:56 PM]

EvilBevel

edit: wrong thread/wrong alcohol level...

[Edited by EvilBevel - 12/28/2002 9:45:00 AM]

Claudius

If Germany had won WW2, there wouldnt be any problems with Saddam or the like because they would actually have killed him. And I'm pretty sure they would have been able to find whoever they want. The US "intelligence" services not being able to find OBL is a fvckin joke!

dba

Claudius

why is it a joke? Its a bloody big country and they sleep in caves ffs,and perhaps the bloke is buried under a trillion tonnes of rock (i.e dead).

Mr evolution

Who is innocent no one I know and even children are potential sinners so killing them in case they turn out to be bad, evil or stupid is a top plan nothing wrong with pre-emptive strikes ask George. All the people who died were probably those who would support corrupt governments any way and those that don't would have been happy to die for the cause. All of which is not that important since the world will be destroyed soon and I can re build it 'properly' with good American values not like those nasty Islamic values. We are good they are bad just incase you forgot.


Don't worry when you all die rest assured that the world Evo version two will be much better as all the opinions in will be mine failure to agree to this policy will result in death.

EvilBevel

Black Lebanon, right ?

johnfelstead

[religious mode on]Isnt that what being a human is all about and why we are here and not directly accepted in heaven. God gave us free will, and being on earth means that everyone has the potential for good and evil.[\religious mode off]

So based on your statement that people should be murdered because they have the potential to sin, that means you want to kill every human being on the planet. What a thoroughly sick individual you are.

I am an athiest, i dont believe in any god or religion. People like you reinforce my belief that religion has way too much potential for hatred and evil and the world would be a better place without any organised religions. I still respect everyones rights to practice any religion as long as that does not harm or put in danger people who do not agree with those religios beliefs.

I supose you want to see me dead now? because i think you and your kind are utterly dispicable.

GaryCat

The US has a culture of fear and violence, you only need to look at the numbers of gun deaths per year to see that.

Germany - 381,
France - 255
Canada - 165
United Kingdom - 68
Australia - 65
Japan - 39
The United States of America - 11,127.

The US knows no other way of solving problems that to shoot & bomb them.

johnfelstead

Germany - 381, population 83,251,851 0.000457%
France - 255, population 59,765,983 0.000426%
Canada - 165, population 31,902,268 0.000517%
UK - 68, population 59,778,002 0.000113%
Australia -65, population 19,546,792 0.000332%
Japan - 39, population 126,974,628 0.000030%
USA - 11,127. population 280,562,489 0.003965%

Dont you just love statistics

So 0.003965% of the population of the USA died due to firearms in a country that has legalised gun ownership. That makes the other 99.996% of the population barbarians doesnt it. Get real.

It's a good job you are not Japanese, then you would be judgeing the UK population with the same rediculous thought processes.

There are some very interesting stats out there if you care to look. You are more likely to be a victim of violent crime in the UK than the USA for example. Belgium has the highest rate of increase in crime of the entire EU.

http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs/hosb601.pdf

[Edited by johnfelstead - 12/28/2002 5:50:19 PM]

Mr evolution

Well possibly but its not personal its just that I want to see 90% of the worlds population dead. The world is currently a nasty place full of nasty people and if they were all to die it would be easier for me to become the world leader and shape it as I see fit making the world a better place. I see it as my duty to mankind.

NOS nova

steady on Adolf!

GaryCat

John - the figures you calculated still shows that there are approximately 10 times as many gun deaths per capita in the US as the nearest 'competitor'. Hardly something to be proud of.

Gary

johnfelstead

and i bet there are more than 10 times as many guns in use than in the UK, more like 100,000 times as many. You could say they are better at controling their use of firearms than any other country.

Statistics can be used however you wish, you are more likely to be a victim of crime in the UK than the USA for example!

Mr Evolution, do not ever introduce yourself to me after that threat. Stating what you state may be a criminal offence in the UK.

Mr evolution

I have not made any threats to anyone just shared my opinion on the future of the world. How is that illegal and why do you have a problem with it. Of course there is a possibility that I want to see you dead as there can be with anyone on this earth that I don't know and have never met you might be a paedophihle for all I know . Its not a descion I can make without introducing myself to you and you've just said don't introduce myself to you should we ever meet so it looks like we will never know.

hotsam

What's even more interesting is that Canada has just as many guns per capita as the United States, but their death rate is lower. It turns out that guns aren't the entire problem. Much of the difference is caused by cultural attitudes.

johnfelstead

You are one very sick individual.

GaryCat

The Swiss have twice as many registered guns than people in their country and they don't even make it into the top ten of gun deaths. The problem is that the US have the right to bear arms and they are going to use that right.

We are talking about automatic weapons and handguns. These guns are designed to kill people, not for hunting or sport shooting.

What kind of gun control allows a six year old to take a gun to school and kill another six year old, allows sniper shootings, schools shootings, postal depot massacres? What kind of control is that?



[Edited by GaryCat - 12/28/2002 7:57:51 PM]

NOS nova

the thing is guns don't kill people, people kill people!

guns just give them the means to do it, let them get on with it i say.
the less Americans in the world the better!

johnfelstead

thats called sloppy parenting, kids dont have the right to own a gun, they took it from where they should not have had access to. Unfortunately there are some very irisponsible people in the USA, just like anywhere else.

Comments like the more Americans killed the better are rediculous. They are no diferent to you and I. Dont you think you are generalising a little when there are 280 Million of them.

Could you look any of them in the eye and say your life is worth less than mine? Having lived there i know i couldnt. Then again, i couldnt say that to anyone because i see life as something very precious.