LG John

I'm using the atkins induction as a kick-start to a better eating plan. I'll get myself a good few pounds below my target weight and then switch to a normal but healthier than before diet and keep up lots of exercise. I'll probably put some back on when my body is shocked with the carb intake again but that'll only take me to target

Tiggs

wrong wrong wrong tel boy,

i have done atkins before, i went from 22 stone to 16.5 and down to a b/fat % of about 16%....i did no exercise until i hit 16.5 then i started to do a bit and held that weight for over 12 months while increasing carbs back to normal levels (although still lower than most curry chompping larger swilling idiots)

i only put on weight when i stopped training and began to eat 3 big macs a day for a year, for no real reason..i was just bored.

Anyway, got back to 20 stone and started atkins again, 3 wks in i am down to 18 and falling.

T

ps- i spent a longggg time in the fitness industry, i measure my fat loss with bio electrical impedence and i know that going from a 44 inch waist to a 35 inch waist is not a bad thing.

ps- dont try to read to much into my weight swing "ohhh, its a reaction to carb depletion!" as i have stated, i love a big mac....not much more to it.

[Edited by Tiggs - 20/06/2003 13:48:21]

TelBoy

Cool Tiggs, but that doesn't make what i've said wrong.

The fact that you've incorporated exercise into your daily routine is a massive factor. At full pelt, i was consuming 7500+ calories a day, and struggling to maintain my weight, so hard was i training.

Your example just demonstates to people the importance of increasing the metabolic rate. I'm sorry you thought it necessary to retaliate with the wrong wrong wrong leg-pull, when clearly what i said isn't at odds with what you've just said.

Tel

dba

Telboy,have you actually read any of Atkins books? He doesn't say that you have to permantently cut out carbs,just moderate them,and the diet you stay on at the forth stage,allows for a moderated amount of carbs,so its easy to stay *slim*.If you put weight on after getting to the forth stage of the Atkins plan,then you are either eating shyte,or not excersising enough

ps someone earlier said you cant have tomatoes in induction,which is wrong,you can

TelBoy

dba, nope i haven't; i couldn't bring myself to read a book about what i consider to be a fad diet, but thanks for enlightening me. As i've said previously, if it helps people get on the weight reduction path, then it's A Good Thing. Actually noticing what food and alcohol is going into one's mouth is half the battle in my opinion, so if people are discussing whether you can/can't eat tomatoes then it's certainly achieved that objective!

Whatever works i guess. Or whatever works well initially, and therefore has maximum chance of increased book sales! God i'm such a cynic..!!

joni

I have reached my goal weight on Atkins and as such am on a far higher carb count than I was on induction. A popular misconception by those who don't read the book (but of course still know categorically that it's all bollocks ) is that it is a "no" carb diet. By the time you have achieved what you aim for, the carb intake is linked to what an individual needs to keep the weight static. This differs and depends on exercise, age, etc.
As far as I can see, as long as you avoid sugar, you could be doing three Roast dinners a day with spuds and as long as your metabolism can hack it, you are still "doing" Atkins

Tim-Grove

Started it on Wednesday and the only thing that is bothering me is the no alcohol rule. I sure could do with a pint or ten.

TelBoy

You mean all those people who haven't said it's carb depletion, but carb eradication, joni..?!

As i've said, whatever works. I just fundamentally struggle with any diet which advocates messing about with specific food groups.

ScoobyWon't

As joni said!

The first two week (more if you feel you nned to) induction is limited to 20g crabs per day.
Then you move onto the phase twom, Ongoing weight loss, where you add an extra 5g carbs per week onto your daily carb allowance.
Stage 3 is the pre-maintenance where you get your weight under control. Stage 4 is the lifetime maintenance, where as the above posts says, you eat what you liek as long as your body can burn it without turning it into fat.

Tiggs

telboy,

you dived in with the wrong, wrong, wrong to my initial comment...which was that you can do atkins and lose weight without exercise....which is correct.

personaly i struggle with the idea that humans into an animal that needs 5 portions of fruit and veg, a balance of food groups, etc, etc.

never seen a fat tortoise yet they get to 100 without much balance of food groups, never seen a slow chetta but never heard of them carb loading....what about a weak gorilla? they down a protein shake for tea?

T

Tim-Grove

[Edited by Tim-Grove - 20/06/2003 15:49:51]

TelBoy

Fair enough Tiggs. I guess everyone needs to be more specific about whether they're talking "temporary" or "permanent". I'm obviously out on my own here, but a carb reduced diet as a long term plan to weight reduction, rather than an overall reduction in consumption, just isn't the way to go, in my very humble opinion. Like they say, you can't teach an old dog new tricks!

dba

Telboy

its a good read,highly recommended

and i don't regard it as a fad diet,imo,the Rosemary Conlay low fat diet is a fad diet,and not substainable

ChrisB

Not entirely on your own Tel.

I've dropped 3.5 stone through going to the gym and a little bit of diet trimming. My regular lunch is one sarnie instead of two and no cake.

I still like to fill my face with food though - lunch yesterday was a pizza and I had four pints of Stella in the pub last night.

My weight fluctuates +/- 1 or 2kg but it's stayed off

No headaches or illness here...

joni

Wait till you're 40 +

ozzy

I still remain sceptical like TelBoy. I've always been slim, but mid-20's I started to fillout and went from 11-stone, 30in waist to 13-stone 34in waits. A non-active desk jockey job didn't help matters.

Then I joined the RMR and went from sod all exercise to training 6 times per week, 2-3hrs a day. I started eating more sensibly (although I've never had that much junk food in my diet) just increasing the amount I ate and keeping in to things like pasta, rice and potato dishes. If I'm eating anything, I only check the labels for excess fat or carbs from sugar.

Even in the Marines, you got 3 square meals including a fry-up every morning and just plain water, but since you're getting thrashed every day you just burn it off.

You just can't beat a nice healthy, well-balanced diet and plenty of exercise to keep you fit an healthy.

I'm now down to 12-stone, my body fat % hovers around 8%. Of course, it's taken me 2 hard years but I love exercise and wouldn't change it for anything.

Needless to say, if it achieves a massive drop in body fat and you're overweight then that's a good thing. I just don't like all the marketing and hype surrounding it. Afterall lots of people are making large amounts of money out of this

Stefan

ozzy

Age is no barrier, only an excuse

The lad that got me into hill running (and still beats me) is 55 in the Senior Vet category.

Stefan

V5

I'm with Telboy, ChrisB and Ozzy on this one. Diets are wrong - they way to lose weight is to exercise and eat properly. It's not rocket science - it's calories in V calories out.

And yes, I speak from experience! Was fat, then fit now fat again but back into the gym and eating healthy routine so will be fit again! Why did I get fat again? Simple - I met my now wife, stopped going to the gym, ate fine foods and drank (a lot of) finer wines! (Kinda like Telboy and his Big Macs )

I can see where you're coming from Saxo Boy in trying to use this to get to a fighting weight but think it'll only stand a chance if you make the lifestyle change of eating healthily and exercising.

Good luck to ya, whatever your method.

Iain

[Edited by V5 - 20/06/2003 17:08:52]

Tiggs

"Diets are wrong - they way to lose weight is to exercise and eat properly."

for you? or for me?

only me and my doc can tell me what is or is not good for my body........how do you know that my diet is wrong.

you dont see me on the hill runners web sites saying "get a life, hill runnings for *****"

this is a post full of ppl happy they are losing weight.....why do ppl have to stick their nose in? is it cause they realise that all that exercising was a waste of time

as someone famous once said "exercise is for fools, if you are not ill you dont need it and if you are ill you shouldnt do it"

joni

What do regard as healthy eating? The 5 portions of fruit and veg a day type of healthy or the low fat processed supermarket stuff with more "E's" than meat. Perhaps it is a vegetarian diet that you have in mind.......What does healthy eating actually mean and can you prove it?
The lower carb diet has been around since the mid 1800's and has come in and out of fashion. Atkins published his first book in the late 60's.It wasn't his idea. He just felt the need to explain his personal success.
This was about the time when the low fat, "5 portion" type of stuff most of us have been brought up with came into vogue and is what the vast majority of people out there consider to be healthy. Hence few took notice.
A lot of modern nutritionists pour scorn on lowering carb in-take and ignoring largely fat and protein consumption. There has, to my knowledge, been no scientific evidence to back up this ditrust......plenty of theories about kidney damage and rising Cholesterol which are simply not born out in the real world.

We have been taught to count calories...that is the gospel according to dieticians. What they won't tell you is that almost everyone fails at the low fat, calorie controlled diet because it is unsustainable...you just get hungry and eventually quit.

We believe what we have been brought up with...but our Grandparents didn't have low fat blah blah food and since the sixties despite a general lowering of calorie intake by some 20% (because we have been told to) Diabetes is on the rampage and levels of obesity are dramatically increasing. Coincidence or have the "experts" got it wrong?

Me I'm happy with a large steak, salad and a couple of glasses of red wine followed by some cheese and maybe Strawberries and cream. I have lost a stone and a half, my bad cholesterol has reduced and I feel like exercise because I have energy rather than seeing it as necassary purely to keep fit.

V5

I didn't say your diet is wrong? How could I? I don't know it! Mine hasn't been great - mucho vino - so I'm now fat. I know that if I eat sensibly and take some exercise (am a desk jockey at w*rk) then I will lose weight.

Have a read of Survival of the Fittest by Mike Stroud. (It can be found here on Amazon.co.uk) It's a fascinating book about human physiology; about how our lifestyle has changed dramatically over the last couple of hundred years, but we haven't, and how this leads to things such as obesity. His explanation of what happens when we diet is particularly good.

If people are losing weight, that's great (thought I'd made that clear in my previous post). I was just agreeing with some of the others and saying that if you want to keep it off, you need to balance what you eat and how much energy you expend.

Iain

V5

Ok, what I should have said is a balanced diet. Everything in moderation. You need carbs and fat and protein......just the right balance (and amount) of them.

joni

Couldn't agree more

dba

but unless you are a Doctor,then not quite as experienced as Atkins,he IS a Doctor,or was,i think he died

10 years ago he was derided,but not any more

V5

ozzy

Atkins diet can't be that good for you, look what it did to the poor Doctor

Hey Tiggs, I've been telling my m8 at work that hill running was for tw@t for years He just finally convinced me it would get me fit and keep me from becoming a fat l@zy b@stard

I never said dieting was for tw@ts or anything similar. I still remain unconvinced that it's the long-term solution - that's all.

You need to be fit and healthy to experience some of the more exciting things in life, so I'll always try to convince everyone to stick with exercising.

Stefan

ScoobyWon't

As I've already said (in this and other threads) I still manage to put in 2.75 - 3 hours in the gym 6 days per week. Probably more than most of you criticising the program.

I can limit my carb intake, even down to the 20g per day of induction, and it does not affect my excercise/energy negatively at all. Even at 20g carbs I suffer no headaches, cravings or even tiredness despite the amount of excercise I do.

Even under induction when your body switches to burning fat you have just as much, if not more energy and my performance even increased.

I've heard people say that the weight is down to muscle deteriaration but I find this untrue - if not I wouldn't be doing and constantly improving:
Lat pull downs, Chest press, Shoulder press, Inclined press, Declined press, Flys, Seated Rows, Bicep curls, tricep curls, tricep pully, hammer raises, leg press, lying leg curls, seated leg curls, calf extensions, tricep dips, press ups before moving onto an ab circuit consisting of abs crunches, reverse ab crunches, perfect ab crunches, back extensions, oblique crunches before moving onto a cardio circuit consisting of 35 mins treadmill, 20 minutes cross training, 20 mins rowing, 20 mins cycling. If the diet deprived you of the necessary fuel it needs do you think I'd be doing all of this?

As I pointed out earlier it isn't a 'diet fad' it's an adaptable lifestyle to improve your health. Infact those of you who are sceptical about it, read the book and see how it can even benefit the sufferers of Diabetes.

weapon69

The Atkins diet is just a quick fix. I don't care how much u lot lose, in a year, you'll be back to how you were. EXERCISE and eat healthier food!
Dr Atkins died fairly young btw

Tiggs

ok, lets just clear this one up.....atkins smacked his head on the floor after he fell on ice.

so ANYONE mentioning hs death in connection with this diet is either....a comedy genius, seems he went into a comma and suffered a bloodclot on the brain- nice, add that detail to your stand up act......or you are just making stuff based on your own, inacurate, guess work- so hardly says much about any other comments you may have.

T

ps- atkins did his recidency in cardiology....bit more qualified than a couple of ramblers and a few weightlifters whos muscle mass isnt balanced against the rest of their body...ohhhhh, god forbid, a lack of balance! ohhhh, scary

pps- he was also 72 not fairly young at all, so your facts are as wrong as your implication

[Edited by Tiggs - 20/06/2003 19:46:53]

dba

thats EXACTLY what Atkins suggests,its just he feels that a modern diet is overloaded with carbohydrates,and he feels we should not scared of *fat* etc,just have a balance

human race seemed to manage without Macs and chips and i doubt a caveman craved a bit of sugar on his barbequed Mammoth