weapon69

I totally agree with TurboKitty and the other ppl who have shared her views on this subject. I can't believe the moderators have actually let this thread run and run. I have a "friend" who firmly believes that gay people are somehow paedophiles-needless to say it makes my blood boil and many arguements have been had on the subject, as the two are not related at all but it just shows the predjudice and hatred homosexual people face. I know this thread is about marriage but it seems to have brought up other feelings people have about how other people choose to live their lives.
If they're not hurting anyone, then why do you care?

astraboy

<If they're not hurting anyone, then why do you care?>
innit!

midget1500

tk & co - (even to myself!) i think the reason why the traditional family unit is something many of us still have regard for is because back in ye olde days, i.e. 50 years ago (well, even 20 years ago!) society in general was a better place, we had more respect for each other. then PC madness came in, teachers couldn't hit pupils, now look at schools. so many single parent families now and kids run riot. people don't respect the police etc. the more we break away from yesteryear the worse society becomes.

their is no right and wrong, just a balance.

look at EVERY god damn TV advert - they all encourage bad behaviour and selfish attitudes - the VW ad were the dad drives off coz the kid might get icecream in the car. the dulux ad were someone steals something from a kid coz they like the colour, the yaris ad were the guy falls off the ladder and the woman moves her car and doesn't help him, and so on. just watch the ad's next time and you'll see what i mean!!!!

weapon69

The reason some "traditional family units" don't work anymore is because people aren't happy and now have the option of "getting out". Although some people take the p!ss and stay married for a week or so.Divorce please.Err right.E.g. I happen to think that a child is better off in a loving home with a homosexual couple than live in a single parent house with arguements (with the other parent) and the instability that can come along with it.

[Edited by weapon69 - 6/30/2003 2:13:12 PM]

[Edited by weapon69 - 6/30/2003 2:14:04 PM]

unclebuck

Well put. I think all this PC nonsense is undermining society and we are starting to see the net result. The PC brigade are so puritanical with their beliefs that anyone who has an opinion that differs from their's is instantly branded a 'homophobic' or 'racist' or whatever.

They preach 'tolorance' but in reality are actually the least tolerent group of all.

UB

[Edited by unclebuck - 6/30/2003 2:18:00 PM]

TurboKitty

The thing is, was society better years ago *because* of "traditional family units"?

I know single parents who bring their children up to be much better behaved and more respectful than some of the children I know who are part of a "traditional family". I don't think it's as simple as being able to blame the decay in society on single parents and homosexual "marriages".

I agree that things are way too PC in this country, and that it's contributing to the breakdown of society, but I don't think allowing homosexual couples to commit to each other in the same way heterosexuals can is anything to do with being PC.

BMW bikes

First up sodomy over a prolonged peroud can cause deformations and
damage to the 'batty' to me that suggests that it might not be right. One of the major museums in this country even has a 'bum' book available bu special request to show the damage it can do.
Children need a mother and father to have as role models. Countless studies around the world have shown the negative effects of children without both of these role models in life. One program in America showed spectacular reductions in crime in an inner city area by sending various posistive male role models to young childrens schools to give them somthing positive to aspire to. There are countless studies to show the adverse effects on communities of single parent families. The lack of proper role models and clearly defined gender roles quite clearly has a negative effect on society if you can't find info to back this statement up the you are not looking hard enough.


Before the ******** get up in arms I would point out that none of the homosexual people I know regard me as being homophobic but they do know what my views are on same sex couples being allowd to raise children.

weapon69

Well coming from a single parent family myself, I don't see my mum and I as contributing to the decay of society.lol. Commitment is commitment whatever the sexual orientation IMHO.

BMW bikes

btw just becuase not all single parent families produce criminal and disturbed children does not mean it is OK by that logic if I drive home from the pub drunk every day for a week without crashing then drink driving must be OK.

TurboKitty

Accepting a (reasonably large) group of people who happen to be different from the norm, but who, in the most part are not hurting anyone else by their actions, is not about being PC. It's about applying the rules fairly across society.

Banning hot-cross buns in schools is PC madness. Bringing rights for gay couples in line with rights for straight couples is not PC madness. It's interesting to see the backlash against politically correct behaviour being used to try to justify quite blatant discrimination, racism and homophobia.

TurboKitty

BMW Bikes, what a ridiculous leap of logic!

weapon69

BMW-Are you suggesting that everyone brought up in a traditional family unit is perfect? I think not.

bros2

[Edited by bros2 - 7/2/2003 1:40:10 PM]

turboman786

TK....I'm about to make a huge generalistaion.....vear with me...but when I worked in the field of Criminal Law I can honestly say that 90% of the youth crime was committed by those from single parent families....and thats not to disrespect anyone from such a background...but the sheer volumes of offenders from this background was/is astounding.

I very rarely saw youth offenders from 'traditional' two parent/married families, and when I did see them it was alewways for one-off offences, rather than the one person crime sprees the other group were.

Claudius

Agreed I want 4 wives like moses

Kidding! one is too much already

bros2

[Edited by bros2 - 7/2/2003 1:40:39 PM]

MarkO

Have to say, I find a lot of the views expressed in this thread saddening. Whatever your opinion about homosexuality, the references made to it being in any way related to paedophilia are literally astonishing, and so unbelievably stupid I really can't believe they're anything other than a p1ss-take.

Some people find same-sex relationships (particularly the physical parts) unnatural or even perverted. Fair enough. Some people think bondage, swingers, menage-a-trois, prostitution, or even plain ol' sex to be perverted too. It's horses for courses (or, to use a particularly risky euphamism in this context, different stroks for different folks).

However, I don't see why people committed to each other in a long-term relationship shouldn't be treated legally as a couple, regardless of their gender match. It just seems logical to me.

The gay adoption thing is tricky, as there's two sides to the story. Firstly, there's no reason why a loving and monogamous same-sex couple shouldn't be able to give a loving & stable home to a child, particularly when compared to the horrendous examples of 'family life' that go on in some 'traditional family units'. However, I think it also has to be considered that the child will feel odd (to say the least) in future when they have two dads or mums - simply because society will always place a stigma on this. It's like children being adopted by parents from a different ethnic group (e.g., black child, white parents) - it's becoming gradually more acceptable, but can still be uncomfortable for the child or parents.

But what scares me most about this thread is not the different opinions about the subject (to which everyone is entitled) but the undercurrent of hatred and spite that seems to be beneath it. Okay, so you may not agree with same-sex families, single parents, or whatever, but why the aggression and bad feeling towards them? Surely 'live and let live' is a rather more generous way to approach this?

Oh, and lastly, I was from a single-parent family - my mum & dad divorced when I was 4. It's not done me any harm; I got into as much trouble as all the kids who had married parents, but have also been just as successful in terms of my life-goals, education, career, and family life. Sure, some kids from single-parent families cause trouble, but they're far more publicised by the likes of the Daily Mail, et al. There are plenty of examples of 'traditional family units' being the centre of crime, abuse, etc.

I really think people would do well to be a bit less judgemental, and a little more open-minded when approaching subjects like this - regardless of what your own personal opinion might be.

TelBoy

Mark, it's just a reflection of the population of the board in my opinion. Young (under 25) males do tend to have a very low tolerance of anything not 100% bloke.

Over time, opinions mellow and people do adopt the live and let live mentality. It's just a natural process of humans maturing.

BMW bikes

Is anyone capable of reading and understanding my words. Just becuase many people are raised in non traditional family units and turn out ok does not discredit the amount of evidence and statistics to suggest that you are far more likely to be a criminal/unemployed/waste of space/audi TT driver if you come from a non-traditional family unit. Are you really saying that you see no advantages for children raised in a traditional family units compared to single parent or same sex relationships.

Are you saying you disbelieve evidence to suggests that children need male and female positive role models ?



My logoc is flawless TK if you think not please tell me why so I can explain better.

bros2

[Edited by bros2 - 7/2/2003 1:40:59 PM]

weapon69

MarkO-the paedophile reference was no joke by this person. He was born and brought up in Zimbabwe and its a common attitude from the few people ive met from that area. Im NOT saying ALL people, just the few ive met at least.

Chip

Just seen the news on BBC. It does seem that I'm not the only one that thinks its wrong giving these rights to homosexuals and not to heterosexuals that are cohabiting.


Seems it's the younger generation that are more tolerant to these things happening. Probably due to the case of them being brought up in this crazy politically correct world.

Chip.

class_A

Just seen the news on BBC. It does seem that I'm not the only one that thinks its wrong giving these rights to homosexuals and not to heterosexuals that are cohabiting.

Chip,

I agree that it's wrong giving these rights to homosexuals and not to heterosexuals that are cohabiting. It doesn't make sense.

If you want the rights of a married couple, you should go and get married. All that homosexuals want is the ability to do this.

[Edited by class_A - 6/30/2003 4:21:51 PM]

BMW bikes

Bros 2your own personal experiences don't really count in the wide scale of this debate yours is just one example I have never said it is impossible for single parnet families to raise non-deviant children. There is also the argument that your mother carried on being a role model for you afeter her death but that is another discussion completely.

weapon69

BMW why don't you just shut up.

CarpetCleaner

always makes me laugh this stuff.

At the end of the day we are talking about 2 blokes tossing each other off and sticking things where they shouldn't

feckin 'orrid if you ask me

CarpetCleaner

you can always count on the cleaner to tell it how it is

BMW bikes

This is a discussion board and I am currently bored and posting here. If you find you disagree with the points I make then present a rational argument as to why you disagree. If you find my posts offensive please explain which bits so I can look at editing them. Just saying shut up doesn't achieve much does it.

[Edited by BMW bikes - 6/30/2003 4:30:28 PM]

TelBoy

CC - b0llox. Not long ago you came over almost all sincere about your mate who you thought was gay, wondering if you should talk to him.

Would now be a good time to admit that was a load of BS?

CarpetCleaner

twaz only teasing to see who'd react