yoza

Unfortunatly the harder you try the more he will rebel.

You must not try to push him into doing something that he is not interested in.

Show him what could happen if he carries on down this road, take him to a re-hab clinic or needle exchange, or young offenders institute, and show him the people there. Dont do it like a punishment, just do it matter of fact style. After the vist just say "is that what you want" and leave it at that.

Does he hang around on the streets, or in mates houses, or has he reached the stage of going to the pub and clubbing it.

I believe he would be better off in the pub at the weekend, as this may broaden his circle of friends, rather than hanging about on the streets, or going to mates houses for parties.

You will find that he will not want to do anything with you, because its not cool, but if his mates decided to join the gym, or go to the snooker hall or whatever, he would go for it all guns blazing.

No disrespect but doing things with your dad is not cool when your his age, sad I know but its true.

If you want me to introduce him to the gym, maybe wright him a workout. Or meet him in your local gym to show him what its all about, let me know.

Later Yoza

PS. Dont let him read this topic, or mention the fact that you have aired your worries on here, because he will go ballistic.

Freak

or show him and he will see all the replies saying how much of a prat he is being and seing peoples past experiences....could work either way...

Katana

Meh, my way worked..

astraboy

Your son will not stop the drugs on yours or anyones advice. The only people who give up are those who *** up on them and dont want to repeat the experience. Sorry but its a fact you will have to deal with.
If he is getting moody and irritable and is taking pills then he is suffering from serotonin depletion. Pills dump the entire body's supply of serotonin (the body's happy drug) into the blood stream, hence the term Ecstasy. However what happens is that as there is none to release for the rest of the week then you son will get miserable and moody as there is nothing left to feel otherwise. What you need to do is get to a Holland and Barrett ask for some 5HTP (they will have it behind the counter) Expect to pay £15 for 60 capsules. This stuff is a precursor for serotonin, it helps the body to produce more of it. it also contains Valerian Root which will help him sleep.
Although I dont take pills myself, I use 5HTP as I find it helps me recover quicker after a night out. I have tried this stuff myself when I am feeling down and it does make you feel better and really helps you sleep longer and deeper.
Your best bet to get him to take them will be explaining that you know what he's up to and you know that you cant stop him as it is his decision. However explain what I have said and tell him to take two before bed every night as it will make him feel less irritable and sleep better. After a week reduce this to one a night.
If he's smart then he will take one for his own good. if he refuses then take one yourself to proove it to him. (You'll find yourself feeling happier the next day, thats all)
As I've said, you will not make him get off the drugs, thats something that only he can do. 5HTP will help repair the damage they do.
Hope this helps.
astraboy.
P.S. if he does manage to kick the pills in the head then make sure he takes 5htp for 6 months after his last one.

sillysi

Si,

I have to agree with Astraboy on this one. I went down this route and saw some of my best friends **** up on H, it gave me the shock I needed to straighten my life out.

YHM.

Si.

[Edited by sillysi - 10/07/2003 16:15:17]

Tiggs

crickey, if id smoked dope at 15 my parents would have grounded me for 6 weeks!

if my son is caught with dope he will be in MASSIVE trouble.....just because your not naive doesnt mean you have to set your standards so low.

Tiggs

Jamie2003

if he is taking e's n all from my own experience it dont matter what ur friends or family say u'll still do it. it actually took something which (i use the term loosely) fell in love with to stop me from taking them. she pointed out that i was turning nasty and she didnt want anything to do with me. after that i knew what i had to do and stopped. she never really talked to me for ages and now we're kinda friendly with eachother but im glad of what i done. but i have to admit once every so very often i tend to have a wee dabble to remember what i was missing. actually i believe it has been 3 dabbles in about 9 months.

now i dont speak to most of my friends, im quite depressive and a tw@t lol but what can ya do. i bought myself a set of turntables which seem to keep me out of trouble tell him the error of his ways and get him a hobbie or a girlfriend it'll do him wonders. thats what im doin anyway

Poor Guy

tell him to get out until he can behave right. that should do!
with no fresh clothes, no money etc he may just see how ood hes got it!

Jamie2003

u'd think that would work but it just makes situations worse. plus he'll just get a sheeite jobto fund whatever it is he's doing and never become anything and as soon as he can go on the dole he will. ya have to be smart with these sorts of things ya just cant chuck people out n all.

his son probably feels like a disappointment and disloved as it is, as this no matter what any says i believe is one of the main causes for people taking drugs. and by chucking him out ur just making him feel even worse about himself.

RS2 JIM

iTrader: (5)

RRH,

I can't imagine what it would be like to be in that situation and i really hope things can be sorted for you all soon.
As suggested above i would try to get him involved with a decent hobbie. Even something as simple as RC car racing would be a great hobby for the pair of you to start. You are obviously a car enthusiast and this may be a decent way of getting him back on the rails. I know he's not really listening to you or any advice you have to offer but is there anyone he would listen to? Grandparents, neighbour or even someone he knows well enough to listen to and hopefully take heed of? i know there are organisations of ex addicts who can speak to your son and pass on their experiences of drugs and hopefully deter him from continuing the abuse. Unfortuantely i can't remember the names of these groups but i'm sure a web search would turn up a few local to you.
In addition to this have you tried sitting him down and speaking to him about the future? This may make him think about the longterm rather than what's happening in his life right now. It would certianly scare me if my parents painted a mental picure of me in 30yrs with no money and a blood disorder. It's harsh but could help.
As Astraboy said, once a drug user starts taking drugs regularly they won't stop unless they have a real scare.
Obviously it's in everyones interest to stop him having anything more to do with drugs immediately but i reality thats going to have to be a longer term goal. As asked above, where does his cash come from? If you were to take the hard line and throw him out, is he the type of person that would completely excommunicate himself from you and your family? If so then the last thing you want is for him to disappear for good. Does he still want to be a part of the family or is he drifting apart from you all? Would his little sisters understand what is happening and might their opinions/fears be listened to by him?

I really do hope there is something to help him pull himself out of this rut before the consequences are made too permanent.

James

RRH

Thanks again for all the advice and experiences guys. We had a visit from an outreach worker earlier. He says that in his experience kids will talk to him, as a stranger, more often than not.

Paul has agreed to speak to him, although still denies any involvement in anything more than weed.

Not sure where he's getting his money from- nothing has gone missing for a while, pocket money ceased a long time ago as he was, at the time, spending it on ciggies.

This can't be doing much for his self esteem, but then again he did throw in a damn good job to doss with his mates in the park.

Still want to get him away for a couple of weeks so looking for some outward bound type suggestions if anyone has any. Would ideally like him to come back after it, think of all the things he'd been doing for that couple of weeks, and lose interest in the tossers in the park melting their brains.

Wife spoke to the police again- the guy she saw hadn't heard of ketamine. Would really like them to pick him up under the influence and hopefully give him a short sharp shock, but unfortunately the little sod knows they can't do much to him at 15.

worley

As requested try these people for climbing activities.

These people can tailor courses to the group's level of skill and fitness. They are highly disciplinarian and are skilled teachers (basically don't take any ****).

I personally have seen problem youths thrive in such surroundings. Climbing and rope skills require due dilligence as mistakes are unacceptable and the consequences obvious.


Nik

PS good drive up to Scotty from your place

Mufasa

Sorry to hear of the trouble you are going through at the moment.
It sounds like you are already doing what to can to try and change his daily routine. That is obviously the most important thing to take care of when he comes back from any outward bound type thing you can get him to go on.

As for where to send him, tall ships sail training gets my vote.

Good luck,

Muf

http://www.sta.org.uk/

GTI

At this age (i know from experience - not mine tho) that if they are stealing they are very very deep into the hard drugs. Do not be surprised if he's into things like Coke. Some how you need to get him to realise what he's can **** him and his life up!
Get him to go cold turkey and move area (you say he has no school - which should make it easier). And way I say move area I mean a big area change.
Plus kids at this age slip in and out of these crowds and take pills and smoke canabis for fun, because theres nothing better to do (just go in a local park on a friday/saturday night).
Don't throw him out he will fuel his addiction via stealing, and it will get worse, plus he may move away and you may loose all contact and never know what could happen - i'm sorry to say.

All the best mate,
Good Luck

Jamie2003

just one thing though, are u sure he's taking drugs? cus i know people that hang about with other people who take e's n all recreationally as i did but never touched them. its something to think about just cus his mates are doing it doesnt mean he is. also at 15 we were all little ***** like.

astraboy

<Do not be surprised if he's into things like Coke. >
nah if he was doing Coke he'd be paranoid, not moody. Besides which, sleep would be the last thing on his mind when he came home if he was a coke head!
astraboy.

unclebuck

And *mega* skint.

If not much is disappearing I doubt he is. In fact, are you sure it's not just the odd pill. I mean, one (or two) of those will keep you up all weekend no probs. Also explains the moody stuff too.

Make sure to tell him not to touch Speed (sulphate) that *will* **** him up.

UB

In fact, thinking about it a bit more... I think it maybe speed your lad is into.



[Edited by unclebuck - 10/07/2003 23:10:59]

moses

im so so sorry to hear that rrh


i feel sad after reading your story
its sad mum and dads do everything for their children when their young and this is what they get back, dont blame yourself mate, i bet u tried hard bringing him up the right way, but u cant control peoples minds, if he listens to u take him out and make him meet your friends who are decent maybe spend a week out somewhere and discuss things without arguing and just give him the best advice u can and how u care for him, tell him how u want him to sort these problems out bit by bit coz it will destroy him at the end and will make your family split.


i hope all gets sorted mate and my prayers are with u and your family.

this is what society now holds for us, break up of families, tv generation , people are at work and mum and dads are working hard and families dont get to spend time together and when the kid is older he takes it out on the parents, im sure yours wasnt the case mate, i see some families in my own asian society , thats what hey have suffered daddies working 24/7 mummy's too busy and grandma babysits the kids and kids want their mum and dad and not their granny or aunties, we kill the bond of the parents and kid by doing this and letting others bring up your children or even to let the tv to bring up your children, this is what happens nowadays , mummys just switch on the tv and the kid is watching that till later instead of the mummy spending time with the kid and playing games with them when their small.


all the best buddy, i feel bad coz i have a lil baby too and she is 11 months old and i hope nothing like this happens to anyone, too see your pride and joy your lil kids going through all this

Jamie2003

drugs are a bigger problem that i think u lot know, alot of parents are just unaware that there children take them but i'd say boarder line in northern ireland anway about 40% of the youth if not more are on them. and as for taking one or two and keeping u up all weekend load of rubbish that'd last about 4 hours at the standards of pills today. i once took 20 of them in the space of 10 hours and that slightly fecked me up good like. and i still went to be bed easily.

what suprises me is that most people blame clubs on drugs but i have a quite a few friend in rock and compared to there counterparts in the club scene. the clubbers are bloomin angels in comparison

JayPSC

If all his mates are doing drugs then he'll continue to do so as long as he's hanging round with them. I did exactly the same thing every weekend when I left school (cept I was working part time to pay for it). I calmed down eventually (but not totally lol).
There is no way he'll be doing coke as it is far too expensive, but if you know he's doing pills then probably speed too.

You really need to get someone to find out exactly what he is taking then take action from there, smoking weed is no big issue but anything else is starting to get more dangerous (& possible addictive).

Pills are a bit of a worry because you have no idea what you are getting, took me 8 years till I finally had enough of them when I realised the comedown just wasn't worth it. Unfortunately at his age he'll be immune to any after effects, I know I was. They will deffo not last all night, as Jamie says 4hrs max.

I really think the only thing you can do about it is to get someone who has done all this before to have a chat with him, if he wants to do all this **** then there's no way you'll stop him but you can at least give him the info to be sensible about it.

Jay

Turbohot

Simon,I know it's not easy.Even if you try to talk to him,rather than being at him,he may not co-operate.You may have to lay down ground rules,be strict verbally what you would accept and what you won't.It might happen that he won't react well to it but may realise he can't take it for granted.Try to keep yourself together.Don't get depressed about the situation.Email me to my address if you want to.I really understand.I have a 16 year old myself.At this age,they are very difficult.I was too when I was 16.All hormonal changes and everything else....But please,keep cool and take it easy.All the good luck,mate.

John Catlin

He is lucky to have a Mum and Dad like you that care for him.

In days gone bye he would be sent to do Army for at least three years, not so sure these days.

What about trying to arrange a visit to a re-hab centre or some thing like it.

It may just shock him enough to come to grips with any problem.

All the best and hope things work out, never never give up on him.

JC

Pikey Tramp Layabout

Have you consider pointing him in the direction of Army cadets with a view to joining the TA when he is 17 18 ish, this will teach him self discipline, respect,comradeship and hopefully pride aswell.

He will also get the chance to go away on exercise at the weekend and shooting etc which is bound to be better than hanging around with drugies and bum mates that just dos around.

I was in the scouts at 11 venture scouts at 15 the TA at 18 and the reular army at 20, I have had an amazingly cool early life thanks to these organisations.

Cheers

Steve

Leslie

I am sorry to hear about the problem. Your mistakenly liberal attitude has got you and him into a very difficult situation. It is going to be very difficult to retrieve it now, he will not want to listen to you or to anyone who tries to set him on the right road since that will not suit the degrading lifestyle he has chosen for himself. We are all responsible for bringing up our own children and that includes the use of discipline to guide them through the bad bits of life. This guidance should start right from the beginning. Difficult to imagine a 15 year old being allowed to stay away from home with no kind of supervision for the whole weekend for a start. Allowing him to get into the Cannabis scene with no attempt at parental control is even worse. What can you expect but that he would graduate to something even more nasty. Don't think that Cannabis is harmless either.

I realise you asked for advice, but this is a very difficult situation. It is not much good looking for some magic organisation to sort the lad out for you. It is down to you as his parent to get the situation under control and start making up for the too soft guidance you have shown him so far. If you let children do just what they want and don't keep them on the right track from a young age, they will grow up with no feelings of respect or love for you. All you are is an "irritation" who might try to restrict them from what they want to do. However your authority means nothing to them so why should they listen?

I would think that your idea of talking to him is a good one, probably the only chance in fact. He probably knows perfectly well that his way of life is wrong but he will want to continue just for the hell of it. I dont think there is any point in you actually mentioning it to begin with. You need to gain his confidence and his respect so that eventually you can persuade him that getting out of the drug scene and the bad company he is keeping is actually much better for him. No good trying to order him around now, that will lose the battle instantly. It will take an awful lot of patience on your part. I wish you all the success with the problem, I can understand the heartache you must be feeling.

Les

Apparition

iF ITS ANY HELP, MY OTHER HALF GOES ON WEEKEND SKIRMISHES IN wALES, RUN BY EX sas GUYS. tHESE REALLY GET THE OLD ADRENALINE GOING AND ARE TEAM BUILDING TOO. THEY USE bb GUNS WHICH ARE FAIRLY HARMLESS AND THEY PLAY THESE GAMES INTO THE NIGHT (WHICH GETS AROUND THIS FEAR OF SLEEPING AT NIGHT PROBLEM). Oops sorry about the shouting ! I can't think of a better way to build a bond between you and your son. They run from friday night until sunday late afternoon. You can hire the guns on site. If you want any further info email me and I'll get t'other half to give you the low down.
Good Luck mate, I had the ideal prevention to drugs in the household when my two were growing up . Their Dad is a Diabetic and they saw him inject twice a day they grew up knowing that there are good drugs and bad drugs , seeing the bad side of this condition was enough to steer them well clear of anything bad.
Have you considered taking your boy to a rehab centre ? maybe if he saw the results of drug abuse first hand, he'd have a re-think.
Cheers Yve

NACRO

I think of all the ideas mentioned the rehab center has to be the way to go. If he can talk with some people of his own peer group he might see the decisions they made have affected their lives adversly.

However I also think a realistic attitude will pay dividends. If you go too hard on him you may find he will resist any attempt to help him. It isn't long before he'll be out on his own and he needs to come to his own conclusions about his attitudes and drug use.

I can't condone the idea advised by some others regarding his cannabis use being a gateway to other drugs. The "gateway" theory of drug "escalation" is a hotly debated topic without any real proof either way. If you don't have a problem with him using it then as long as you don't actively condone it/allow it in the house, then you have done your duty as a parent. Whether or not a 15yr old boy should be smoking cannabis at all is another matter. Cannabis is a notorious demotivator and if he is inclined to be feckless then it isn't really going to help.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

ProperCharlie

Leslie - i think your attitude is a bit patronising and not necessarily that well informed. I'm sure you speak in good faith though. You can't generalise that kids with *liberal* parents will grow up into no good jail bait junkies. As a parent you are only one part of a bigger equation.

ahh well, maybe I am just too influenced by *the cannabis scene* even though I packed up smoking the stuff years ago...

Charlie

RRH

And how, exactly, does one control a 14 stone aggressive and angry teenager leslie?

I do not, and will never, condone physical violence in my house.

I have two young daughters and i am determined that it will not play a part in their life.

What do you do when he doesn't come home, doesn't phone, and you can't find him?

Would you advocate locking him in his room, or chaining him to his bed? How would you suggest i control him?

Sorry if this post is a little abrupt. I know you mean well. The boy has been given a fair amount of leeway as he has always been respectful and sensible until approx six months ago when he fell in with this new crowd.

I have spoken to him today, very gently, telling him I know whats going on. I have told him that he will have to make up his own mind, but when he wants to talk or he needs help, I will listen and help.

[Edited by RRH - 11/07/2003 17:41:49]

super_si

end the day, if it was me. The situation you are in now would never have happened.

Really tricky situation you have.

ProperCharlie

I can't understand how people can say that if it were them the situation would not have happened? How the hell do you know that? You can't possibly predict what would have happened if you had lived in a different area, your kids gone to a different school, met different people etc.