milo

Waste of time as 30 reps will not hit *any* fibers that cause the muscle to grow significantly. Stick to your pyramid sets, lift as heavy as you can (even going to 1 or 2 rep maxes) and then REST!

To me, 30 reps is cardio anyway and will burn off the muscle rather than building it!

TelBoy

Ken, that biceps routine is fine, for starters. Good weights, sensible reps. But for me, barbell curls would be the *first* exercise. Seated dumbell curls, preacher curls, concentration curls, hammer curls, reverse curls - they're all options. I used to do about three exercises per small bodypart, four for larger ones. Do you think Arnold did six sets then move on to another bodypart? No, absolutely not, even when he was starting out. Bodies hate changing, you have to force it to, make it surrender (how's that one Chris?! )

Strip sets are merely taking off one plate after you've done as many reps as you can, and continuing to failure, then taking another plate off, and so on, until you're left with nothing much more than the bar.

Forced reps are simply when a partner assists you with completing a repetition. And i don't just mean the last rep. I've done whole sets of forced reps. If it's too easy, it ain't working. No pain, no gain, however you want to say it.

As for the girlies - you gotta let that go, seriously. Move gyms. Guys do themselves more injuries impressing the talent than anything else.

milo

Mine aren't

What you're saying is spot on tho - bis are a small muscle group and if you want the illusion of oversized arms, it's best to work on tris - with close-grip bench.

A lot of builders don't even work bis and feel that heavy deads and other back exercises work them enough. Personally I think that heavy barbell curls are a great mass builder tho.

milo

It is well accepted that Arnie overtrained considerably, spending 2-3 hours training *twice* a day.. Hitting the same bodypart day after day. The man is genetically gifted (not to take away from his hard work and dedication).. but 99.999% of the world could *not* grow on the training plan he had.

The number of sets does not matter as much as the intensity does.

Low volume training... even as little as *one* work set for each of say three exercises for a bodypart is enough to make some people grow.

LG John

Ah, destruction basically I've done that a few times and it burns!!!

The problem with 1-2 reps is it really feels like you've done nothing at all! I could probably go to the gym just now and pick up a 20kg dumbell (maybe a little more) and curl it twice max. If I did that over 4 sets would that honestly be doing trick?!!

So it would seem that the best compromise for muscle building is around 4-6 reps over say 4 sets?

Cheers for the ongoing advice lads - the gym I go to I see guys that have been going for years and have made no gains at all, so assuming they haven't been off for the last 9 months like I have, I can only assume they are just their to look pretty - I don't want to get a year down the line having done nothing but move some weight about and pay out £54 a month For this reason any advice that you give me is greatly appreciated

LG John

So what exercises REALLY beast your tri's?

On the topic of arnie: considering the picture of him all fat on a beach a year or so ago he did fecking well at his age to get in the shape that he did for T3

milo

You're probably not lifting your 1-2 reps heavy enough in that case. Are you sure when you lift your 1-2 reps you could not manage another rep, even if someone held a gun to your head?

Certainly when I do a 1rm squat, dead or bench, I am done, and I can sure feel it.

Remember - you have to find what's right for you. If you'd rather stick with 10 rep sets or whatever and feel that's giving you the best growth then that's great. Personally pyramid and HEAVY weights make me grow like crazy. 4 sets of 6-10 did not work well for me. Experiment!!

TelBoy

Milo, agreed, but in my experience, and your's too i'm sure, the really BIG guys are the ones who've done more than they "should", not less.

I still maintain that you can't overtrain within a workout, but you can overtrain if you don't allow sufficient rest before working the same bodypart again.

milo

Any of the following (in my order of preference):

close-grip bench, weighted dips (also hits chest if you lean forwards), pushdowns, jm press, skullcrushers

remember good form on these.. way more important that the weight you're using.

DO NOT DO KICKBACKS.. they do NOT hit all three heads of the tricep muscles.

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

Sorry to butt in but what sort of training is required to achieve a body like this bloke?

LG John

I'm pretty sure that I can't do any more. I recon if I picked up say 22kg I'd be able to get it up once at a push but then the second time I think I'd get my arm to about 90 degrees and for all the screaming, digging deep, etc it will not go any more.

Is there any way to DIG deep, any method of getting that last little bit? Last night for example I had an arm wrestle with one of my mates (it was to decide who got on the pool table next ) He was a big boy but I managed to hold him pretty well. He started to get me over and then I held him again. At this point I wanted to win soooo bad and I tried so hard to get some extra power/strength but it would not come. I couldn't offer any more - how do you guys get that last little bit??

If I do experiment with different rep systems how long should I give each system before concluding on its results?

LG John

I'd have thought that to look like that you'd have to do shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit loads of cardo and eat 100% properly. He's got some good muscles for sure but the most impressive thing is the utter lack of body fat

super_si

16" 1/4 Terry why

Just remember size doesnt matter for me hehehehe

Tri's weighted dips till failure and Close grip press. I also do skull crushers

Si


[Edited by super_si - 8/22/2003 10:00:25 AM]

milo

Totally agreed, but maybe in different contexts. If you mean "more" in terms of intensity, I agree with you 100%. If you're talking about volume then I can't necessarily agree.

I think you can overtrain in a workout. After 45 mins or so, cortisol will kick in. Not to mention your glycogen stores will be depleted. You'll be working with no calories in your system. Most builders don't go over an hour in a workout. If you can handle over an hour, then in my opinion you're not training with enough intensity.

Another point is that if you workout for 2 hours, then you've just gone over 2 hours without a meal!

super_si

I wouldnt say training over an hour is bad, I never lift less ever. Also train harder every time. Sometimes it is over an hour.
Also take into consideration i can do my day in an hour. If my mates supporting me and also training obviously the time doubles.

So do as long as it takes to finish what you set out to do also take food that extra intake carbs may prove usful

Si

TelBoy

More in both terms to be honest. But then that's my nature i guess. I see so many guys walking away from whatever exercise they've been doing as if the bead of sweat on their foreheads is an inconvenience - i could NEVER be like that!

Every once in a while, a truly MENTAL workout is an excellent kick-start.

Si, is that centimetres?

super_si

Oi terry 60kg to go and your wallet will be lighter mate and ive still got 15 months hehehehe

milo

I think of how I feel when I get home after a workout where I didn't get that last little bit.

milo

I would say 4 weeks minimum (given a 3 or 4 day split).

However, you do need to change up your routine regularly (I would say every 8-12 weeks TOPS) as your body will adapt and your gains will stop.

TelBoy

Hehehe, i know that feeling. Sometimes i've even almost gone back to the gym to do a few more sets, before coming to my senses! That's when you know you're addicted!!

TelBoy

I don't think i ever did the same workout twice. Chaos theory - worked for me!

milo

which is why you only have 16.25" arms

seriously tho, try low volume high intensity sub-one hour workouts.

how many sets are you doing that it takes more than an hour? or are you doing a full-body workout?

super_si

Which is why im not a body builder and couldnt give a flying ****

Thats the good thing about strongman i can walk into the gym and out lift all the blokes who look like ballons and think because they are big they are strong.

lol get real

TelBoy

LOL, give him a break, Si's our 21 y.o. BSM in the making!

super_si

Not now.

just bent down for a sock and lower back pulled its killing lucky im off training till tuesday.

Did you see Darren and Tim they were awesome. Hopefully ill be in there possition on 3 years hehehehe

Si

milo

lighten up - i was kidding around!

nothing wrong with 16in guns....

...if you're about 4 foot 8

seriously tho - it's a great base - well more than a base even.

the fact that you even measured them means that you do give a flying **** tho

id be interested to know why you aren't following more of a powerlifting (wsb for example) type of program? (or are you?) huge strength gains are to be had off that.

and fyi, i'm more of a powerlifter than a bodybuilder. well, maybe i consider myself a fat bodybuilder.. or a shredded powerlifter. can't decide which

and yes - size does not always equal strength.

super_si

Powerlifting has being in the back of my mind but being long limbed bench press is never going to be my friend is it.

Theres just something about lifting cars and logs stones etc that appeals. Its different really + getting advice from ex WSM competitors does help.

Also power lifting is very strict isnt it?

Si

milo

to me, powerlifting is about strengthening your weak points. which would carry over to strongman.

certainly most of the US strongmen competitors i've trained with or been in contact with follow a powerlifting type program (4 day split - max effort and dynamic effort days) and use this to improve their weak points. for example - for me, grip and lower back used to be my weak points. by targetting them i can cause something else to be my limiting factor at a higher lifting weight.

and yeah - i have the same "problem" as you - im over 6' tall and have long limbs. which is a nightmare for all lifts as my rom is greater. my *** almost touches the floor when i squat to get to parallel!

however, for example, on bench, i use a wider grip than most (which reduces my rom), tuck in my elbows, and try to make the best of what i have.

Defiant STI

Go for it Super_Si

I like the idea of power lifting too as I don't think i'll ever be strict enough to seriously body build.

Just measured my arms, 18" dead Now to crack the 20" barrier!

super_si

Whats your name by chance?

couple forums i use chat to the European Champ. He's sorting me a new program

Si