MG TF door problems????
08 November 2003, 02:01 PM
#31
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just quoted some figures which picture the sad decline of a motor manufacturer
Oh and can you name any manufacturers that increase their volume on a particular model year on year ?? usually during run out the stage the R25 is currently at they reduce volumes considerably.
I have a spot spot for the MINI having been a design engineer on the project from concept to QP build...
08 November 2003, 05:42 PM
#33
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You really haven't got a clue about business, the motor industry and dire situation MG Rover was left in 5 years ago, I not going to waste my time writing as I'm banging my head against a brick wall, MGR are doing some good things as the moment in very short spaces of time but you cannot see it, new models need 5 years d&d and a **** load of money, money which MGRover hasnt got yet, clearly you see what MGR are doing with a massively blinkered view and think they can make money and develop a new car without touching their current range, having worked for various motor manufacturers for the last 13 yrs IMO they have done some amazing things given the situation so give them a chance...
09 November 2003, 07:25 AM
#34
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree totally with most of your last post (apart from the bits about me not having a clue). I genuinly hope they can pull something out of the bag. In the meantime though are we supposed to blindly praise or ignore the crap they are producing?
NO I think it is our duty to keep saying the truth as we see it rather than being sentimental and hypocritical.
NO I think it is our duty to keep saying the truth as we see it rather than being sentimental and hypocritical.
09 November 2003, 02:59 PM
#35
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I take on board everything you say and agree with a lot of it, apart from your assertion that current Rover products are anything other than cr*p. Not one is the best car in its class, in fact a long way from it.
As from my comments being damaging in some way to MGR, I can't see it myself, nobody cares about talk on some niche BBS. My vocal decrying of MGR and its products is a direct reaction to the softly softly approach adopted by the media and people in general who seem to be happy to ignore the dross that MGR produce and give it an easy ride, soley because it is a British manufacturer. I can't condone that. If it was non British company I imagine that everyone would be sticking the knife in and twisting it.
As from my comments being damaging in some way to MGR, I can't see it myself, nobody cares about talk on some niche BBS. My vocal decrying of MGR and its products is a direct reaction to the softly softly approach adopted by the media and people in general who seem to be happy to ignore the dross that MGR produce and give it an easy ride, soley because it is a British manufacturer. I can't condone that. If it was non British company I imagine that everyone would be sticking the knife in and twisting it.
09 November 2003, 03:22 PM
#36
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, we will have to agree to disagree on your point that "current Rover products are [anything other than] cr*p. Not one is the best car in its class, in fact a long way from it"
They may not be best in class (although that is in debate in some areas - Auto Express gave the R75 best ride and best comfort in a recent survey), but I still don't know where you get this idea that they are so bad!! IMHO they're far from the worst, and "crap" is certainly unfair! You still haven't said what your experience of the products is - yet every time an MGR thread comes up you have to jump in with your 2p, which doesn't seem to be based on any real experience!
As for "nobody cares about talk on some niche BBS" - you would be surprised, there have been several Auto Express stories that have appeared directly from the pages of www.mg-rover.org, and I believe many so-called reporters are just sitting at their computers and getting their stories from boards succh as this.
"My vocal decrying of MGR and its products is a direct reaction to the softly softly approach adopted by the media and people in general who seem to be happy to ignore the dross that MGR produce and give it an easy ride, soley because it is a British manufacturer." -
That's right, the press are soooo supportive of MGR aren't they!? Sadly most of them seem stuck on the 80s and only to happy to think the worst.
"If it was non British company I imagine that everyone would be sticking the knife in and twisting it" - you have this about face, the British seem to *love* to put down their own car industry, and then complain that we don't have one!
Please tell us what your personal experience is of MGR, and the overriding evidence of why they are so bad??
They may not be best in class (although that is in debate in some areas - Auto Express gave the R75 best ride and best comfort in a recent survey), but I still don't know where you get this idea that they are so bad!! IMHO they're far from the worst, and "crap" is certainly unfair! You still haven't said what your experience of the products is - yet every time an MGR thread comes up you have to jump in with your 2p, which doesn't seem to be based on any real experience!
As for "nobody cares about talk on some niche BBS" - you would be surprised, there have been several Auto Express stories that have appeared directly from the pages of www.mg-rover.org, and I believe many so-called reporters are just sitting at their computers and getting their stories from boards succh as this.
"My vocal decrying of MGR and its products is a direct reaction to the softly softly approach adopted by the media and people in general who seem to be happy to ignore the dross that MGR produce and give it an easy ride, soley because it is a British manufacturer." -
That's right, the press are soooo supportive of MGR aren't they!? Sadly most of them seem stuck on the 80s and only to happy to think the worst."If it was non British company I imagine that everyone would be sticking the knife in and twisting it" - you have this about face, the British seem to *love* to put down their own car industry, and then complain that we don't have one!
Please tell us what your personal experience is of MGR, and the overriding evidence of why they are so bad??
10 November 2003, 03:30 PM
#37
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 456
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NACRO
Okay, you're right all MGR vehicles are totally crap and no-one should even consider buying them...
Funny how so many people each time this is brought up get riled by your far from subtle opinions. Seems that not many people are of the same opinion as you. If you think MGR's motors are crap then okay, fine.
Okay too that many others take the snob approach and simply assume that all of their products are crap too - that is the top and bottom of MGRs problem and anyone who knows anything about cars knows that.
The point is that your overall arguments generally contain very little fact. Kind of a "they're crap 'cos I said so" sort of tone. Its quite clear from this that you haven't much of a clue about MGR at all. You simply have your opinion (theat you are perfectly entitled to) that they make crap cars... kind of limited.
I post on here because I am a car enthusiast that likes Scoobs and generally find the banter on here fun. I have owned MGR vehicles and feel that I know a bit about them and can offer an educated opinion if someone asks for it.
I think its only normal to expect that genuine car enthusiasts on here that might actually have some proper experience of these vehicles and/or may actually know something about the brand too are going to pick holes in your argument if they feel fit.
Just seems strange that you feel the need to fill 2+ pages on this BBS trying to force your opinion upon them. Surely they are entitled to their opinion also...
Its also more than a little sad that you feel the need to resort to petty, childish insults simply because someone diagrees with you.
<Cue some petty, smart-alec, NACRO response that shouts "GEEK !" to everyone on here>
Okay, you're right all MGR vehicles are totally crap and no-one should even consider buying them...
Funny how so many people each time this is brought up get riled by your far from subtle opinions. Seems that not many people are of the same opinion as you. If you think MGR's motors are crap then okay, fine.
Okay too that many others take the snob approach and simply assume that all of their products are crap too - that is the top and bottom of MGRs problem and anyone who knows anything about cars knows that.
The point is that your overall arguments generally contain very little fact. Kind of a "they're crap 'cos I said so" sort of tone. Its quite clear from this that you haven't much of a clue about MGR at all. You simply have your opinion (theat you are perfectly entitled to) that they make crap cars... kind of limited.
I post on here because I am a car enthusiast that likes Scoobs and generally find the banter on here fun. I have owned MGR vehicles and feel that I know a bit about them and can offer an educated opinion if someone asks for it.
I think its only normal to expect that genuine car enthusiasts on here that might actually have some proper experience of these vehicles and/or may actually know something about the brand too are going to pick holes in your argument if they feel fit.
Just seems strange that you feel the need to fill 2+ pages on this BBS trying to force your opinion upon them. Surely they are entitled to their opinion also...
Its also more than a little sad that you feel the need to resort to petty, childish insults simply because someone diagrees with you.
<Cue some petty, smart-alec, NACRO response that shouts "GEEK !" to everyone on here>
10 November 2003, 04:51 PM
#39
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Twitching with a camera
Posts: 22,177
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No, don't think so. Seems to be one of the parts on the MG TFs that is (in general) fitted properly. 
Maybe the car was a Friday afternoon job...
Maybe the car was a Friday afternoon job...
10 November 2003, 05:17 PM
#40
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What door problem? Oh you mean the original thrust of the thread? I thought we'd moved on since then. No doubt they are misaligned fresh from the factory.
10 November 2003, 05:28 PM
#41
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OK, I'll bite (again!)
NACRO, you have *still* provided absolutely no backup whatsoever for your "truths"!! I doubt anybody on the board would deny that everybody has opinions and they have a perfect right to them - however, it's unfair to state your opinion as fact as you do, when it's so subjective!
You're not "outlining" any "truths", you're simply restating your opinion, but as fact. The reason I feel the need to respond is because there are weak minded people who will read it, and not having brains of their own will then go and regurgitate it to their mates down the pub (and in the pages of our esteemed motoring publications). If the trend continues it could well be damaging to a small company like MGR, and all based on completely unfounded rubbish, or at the best the bad experience of one disgruntled person (not even a previous owner by your own admission!).
Being insulting to their owners does you no favours either - I am not stupid, I know a fair amount about cars, I do not own a pipe or a tartan rug, I enjoy spirited driving, and i am under 30. Neither am I a kid who is sticking up for his first car.
I'm not humourless, I have a sense of perspective, but I fail to see why you can't distinguish between fact and opinion!
OK, you think they're crap! Well done, have a medal! That doesn't mean that, by default, all MGR cars are crap, though - surely you can see that?
And, please, let us know what this horrific experience of MGR cars is that has turned you against them so...
NACRO, you have *still* provided absolutely no backup whatsoever for your "truths"!! I doubt anybody on the board would deny that everybody has opinions and they have a perfect right to them - however, it's unfair to state your opinion as fact as you do, when it's so subjective!
You're not "outlining" any "truths", you're simply restating your opinion, but as fact. The reason I feel the need to respond is because there are weak minded people who will read it, and not having brains of their own will then go and regurgitate it to their mates down the pub (and in the pages of our esteemed motoring publications). If the trend continues it could well be damaging to a small company like MGR, and all based on completely unfounded rubbish, or at the best the bad experience of one disgruntled person (not even a previous owner by your own admission!).
Being insulting to their owners does you no favours either - I am not stupid, I know a fair amount about cars, I do not own a pipe or a tartan rug, I enjoy spirited driving, and i am under 30. Neither am I a kid who is sticking up for his first car.
I'm not humourless, I have a sense of perspective, but I fail to see why you can't distinguish between fact and opinion!
OK, you think they're crap! Well done, have a medal! That doesn't mean that, by default, all MGR cars are crap, though - surely you can see that?
And, please, let us know what this horrific experience of MGR cars is that has turned you against them so...
10 November 2003, 05:54 PM
#44
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"So you think they have a fresh up to the minute product line of market leaders then?"
No, the R25 and R45 have been around for a while in various forms, as has the MGF. However the R75 has been considered a markey leader in several areas. Nobody's saying they're perfect, Nacro - but are you saying that every company without a "fresh up to the minute product line of market leaders" is crap? That's a lot of companies you're calling crap there....
"Or do you agree with me that they are old, tired and therefore crap?"
No - agreed, the designs are old. You know why, enough people have explained it enough times - it's to do with money, or a lack of it, and development time, and a lack of it. I doubt any car company could do any better given the time/money restraints. And why does age of a design denote crapness? Is the Mk.1 Impreza crap because it's old? No! The two things are totally different! MGR are just as keen as you to replace them, but there's no magic wand, and if you could be bothered to open your mind just a tiny, tiny bit, you might find they're not as crap as you think!
"I think it's fair enough to say their products are outdated as they are all well past their intended product cycles."
Perhaps - but still not a justification for calling them crap!
"My experiences of MGR products are irrelevant here, suffice to say I've driven a few, been given pool cars and known people who've had them. All these experiences have led me to believe they are carbage (LOL)."
It's of *every* relevance what your experiences are, as this is what you're basing your binning of the brand on! What is it exactly that has been so bad about them? Pool cars aren't exactly reputed for their good treatment, and everybody "knows somebody" who had some problems with any type of car.
"Edited to add: don't include the 75/ZT in any of these comments."
Oh, I see, it's not everything MGR now!
1) You don't like MGR products (R75 derivitives excepted) for whatever reason.
2) You have never lived with one day to day
Why such animosity? Why not just say "The MGR cars I have driven have been rubbish in my opinion because x"!?
Is it so difficult to qualify what you say!?
You've still given no real justification, just an all encompassing "they're all crap because they're a bit old, and a friend didn't like his" Come on, if you're going to rubbish the lot of them lets have some justification and facts to back it up!
No, the R25 and R45 have been around for a while in various forms, as has the MGF. However the R75 has been considered a markey leader in several areas. Nobody's saying they're perfect, Nacro - but are you saying that every company without a "fresh up to the minute product line of market leaders" is crap? That's a lot of companies you're calling crap there....
"Or do you agree with me that they are old, tired and therefore crap?"
No - agreed, the designs are old. You know why, enough people have explained it enough times - it's to do with money, or a lack of it, and development time, and a lack of it. I doubt any car company could do any better given the time/money restraints. And why does age of a design denote crapness? Is the Mk.1 Impreza crap because it's old? No! The two things are totally different! MGR are just as keen as you to replace them, but there's no magic wand, and if you could be bothered to open your mind just a tiny, tiny bit, you might find they're not as crap as you think!
"I think it's fair enough to say their products are outdated as they are all well past their intended product cycles."
Perhaps - but still not a justification for calling them crap!
"My experiences of MGR products are irrelevant here, suffice to say I've driven a few, been given pool cars and known people who've had them. All these experiences have led me to believe they are carbage (LOL)."
It's of *every* relevance what your experiences are, as this is what you're basing your binning of the brand on! What is it exactly that has been so bad about them? Pool cars aren't exactly reputed for their good treatment, and everybody "knows somebody" who had some problems with any type of car.
"Edited to add: don't include the 75/ZT in any of these comments."
Oh, I see, it's not everything MGR now!
1) You don't like MGR products (R75 derivitives excepted) for whatever reason.
2) You have never lived with one day to day
Why such animosity? Why not just say "The MGR cars I have driven have been rubbish in my opinion because x"!?
Is it so difficult to qualify what you say!?
You've still given no real justification, just an all encompassing "they're all crap because they're a bit old, and a friend didn't like his"
Come on, if you're going to rubbish the lot of them lets have some justification and facts to back it up!
10 November 2003, 06:20 PM
#45
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
quote: "2) You have never lived with one day to day"
Incorrect-I had the pool car for a long time, in addition to this I've used quite a few different MGR cars in my professional life. They were all inferior to other alternatives on the market. Also various close members of my family used to be dyed in the wool Rover enthusiasts- used to be. I therefore have had a life of exposure to these products.
It is easy to qualify what I say and I have done- you just choose not to accept it. You talk of magic wands etc- who cares what the reasons are- the cars are outdated and crap. The designs were never market leader in the first place, they led MGR to the sorry state it is in now. We can't ignore that or make excuses about how good things are in the pipeline.
The facts to back it up are the state of the company and its history.
Incorrect-I had the pool car for a long time, in addition to this I've used quite a few different MGR cars in my professional life. They were all inferior to other alternatives on the market. Also various close members of my family used to be dyed in the wool Rover enthusiasts- used to be. I therefore have had a life of exposure to these products.
It is easy to qualify what I say and I have done- you just choose not to accept it. You talk of magic wands etc- who cares what the reasons are- the cars are outdated and crap. The designs were never market leader in the first place, they led MGR to the sorry state it is in now. We can't ignore that or make excuses about how good things are in the pipeline.
The facts to back it up are the state of the company and its history.
10 November 2003, 08:04 PM
#46
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I am not going to waste any more time on this thread, it's like banging my head against a brick wall.
Please, anybody who reads this thread: Don't pay any attention to Nacro. What he says is not fact, simply his opinion, whether based on his experience or not. Don't let it colour your judgement, for Gawd's sake make up your own mind!
Please, anybody who reads this thread: Don't pay any attention to Nacro. What he says is not fact, simply his opinion, whether based on his experience or not. Don't let it colour your judgement, for Gawd's sake make up your own mind!
10 November 2003, 08:20 PM
#47
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would also urge people to make up their own minds and read widely on the many superior alternatives to MGR products.
10 November 2003, 09:26 PM
#48
Scooby Senior
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: 52 Festive Road
Posts: 28,311
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This did make me wonder, last weekend there was an MGF in central milton keynes shopping centre as part of an advertising display.. only thing I can remember about it was they had a tray and a load of rags on the floor to catch oil drips.
p.s. It was brand new and un-registered..
p.s. It was brand new and un-registered..
10 November 2003, 11:30 PM
#49
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 1,624
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why do people buy rovers?
As previously mentioned the cars are absolutely ancient and as far as I can see every model they sell has a much better competitor from a different manufacturer.
Who cares how well they have done with what limited resources they have when there are much better cars available for the money?
New Tata thing VS Toyota Yaris
Rover 25 VS VW Golf
MGF VS Toyota MR2
Rover 45 VS anything really!
Rover 75 VS BMW 3 Series
As previously mentioned the cars are absolutely ancient and as far as I can see every model they sell has a much better competitor from a different manufacturer.
Who cares how well they have done with what limited resources they have when there are much better cars available for the money?
New Tata thing VS Toyota Yaris
Rover 25 VS VW Golf
MGF VS Toyota MR2
Rover 45 VS anything really!
Rover 75 VS BMW 3 Series
11 November 2003, 03:44 PM
#50
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 4,935
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I must say that as a used car the 75 is astounding value if your in the market for a comfy mile muncher.
I have driven many and the V6 auto's are up there with Jags for ride comfort. Excellent if you do the miles, the 75 may be in 3 series segment but look at the prices and the equivalent 3 series will cost £1000's more to the same spec. A driver who's thinking of a 75 wouldn't be considering a sporty car like a 3 series IMO.
I think used car buyer has just awarded the 75 best used car 2004 or something.
Rest of the range is in need of major investment, the 25 isn't bad but is poorly packaged and poorly built by modern standards, the 45 has no place in todays market place unless it's a giveaway.
Can't comment on the MG Zeds as I haven't driven them.
Lee
[Edited by logiclee - 11/11/2003 3:50:13 PM]
I have driven many and the V6 auto's are up there with Jags for ride comfort. Excellent if you do the miles, the 75 may be in 3 series segment but look at the prices and the equivalent 3 series will cost £1000's more to the same spec. A driver who's thinking of a 75 wouldn't be considering a sporty car like a 3 series IMO.
I think used car buyer has just awarded the 75 best used car 2004 or something.
Rest of the range is in need of major investment, the 25 isn't bad but is poorly packaged and poorly built by modern standards, the 45 has no place in todays market place unless it's a giveaway.
Can't comment on the MG Zeds as I haven't driven them.
Lee
[Edited by logiclee - 11/11/2003 3:50:13 PM]
11 November 2003, 04:52 PM
#51
Scooby Regular
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Twitching with a camera
Posts: 22,177
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why do people buy Rovers? Good question...
IMHO, I think a lot are bought by people who have always bought them, haven't been too upset by the cars' overall performance. Like Volvo buyers, they keep updating with a new one, every year or so.
They aren't class leaders in general, though as some people have said, the 75 has topped some charts. However, they aren't terrible either. My Old Man has had 2 Rovers (a 200 and 400, both 1.4) and both have been very reliable, cheap to service, economical, comfortable and decent-looking cars. They are also cheap to buy, especially 2nd hand.
The comparison in a comment above, pairs up the Rover cars with several alternatives, but apart from the MGF (or TF now), the alternatives are more expensive to buy new, and hold their value better for 2nd hand deals.
Trying to pair like for like, with the recent Top Gear ranking shown in brackets...
1.4 CityRover = £7000 (N/A)
1.3 Yaris = £8500 (2)
1.4 Rover 25 = £8700 (101) (ZR = 103)
1.4 Golf = £10800 (106)
One of a number of very surprising results, especially the Mercs...
1.8 MGTF = 17600 (MGF 123)
1.8 MR2 = 15900 (33)
1.4 Rover 45 = £10000 (80) (ZS = 47)
1.4 Focus = £10800 (51)
2.0D Rover 75 = £18700 (48) (ZT = 13)
BMW 320D = £21000 (31)
(I've included the Z cars to show (apart from the ZR!) how they seem to have made a significant improvement to the Rover models.)
Hence, if you're in the market for a car and not particularly bothered about class-leading qualities, and initial costs are a factor, then a Rover may fit the bill.
As people who read these sort of threads know, I am slightly in favour of MG-R, and would like to see them succeed. But I also appreciate and acknowledge that they need new products in order to do this.
I wonder if marques currently not doing so well, in say Germany, get as much stick on equivalent BBSs over there? Like Mercedes and VW..?
IMHO, I think a lot are bought by people who have always bought them, haven't been too upset by the cars' overall performance. Like Volvo buyers, they keep updating with a new one, every year or so.
They aren't class leaders in general, though as some people have said, the 75 has topped some charts. However, they aren't terrible either. My Old Man has had 2 Rovers (a 200 and 400, both 1.4) and both have been very reliable, cheap to service, economical, comfortable and decent-looking cars. They are also cheap to buy, especially 2nd hand.
The comparison in a comment above, pairs up the Rover cars with several alternatives, but apart from the MGF (or TF now), the alternatives are more expensive to buy new, and hold their value better for 2nd hand deals.
Trying to pair like for like, with the recent Top Gear ranking shown in brackets...
1.4 CityRover = £7000 (N/A)
1.3 Yaris = £8500 (2)
1.4 Rover 25 = £8700 (101) (ZR = 103)
1.4 Golf = £10800 (106)
One of a number of very surprising results, especially the Mercs...1.8 MGTF = 17600 (MGF 123)
1.8 MR2 = 15900 (33)
1.4 Rover 45 = £10000 (80) (ZS = 47)
1.4 Focus = £10800 (51)
2.0D Rover 75 = £18700 (48) (ZT = 13)
BMW 320D = £21000 (31)
(I've included the Z cars to show (apart from the ZR!) how they seem to have made a significant improvement to the Rover models.)
Hence, if you're in the market for a car and not particularly bothered about class-leading qualities, and initial costs are a factor, then a Rover may fit the bill.
As people who read these sort of threads know, I am slightly in favour of MG-R, and would like to see them succeed. But I also appreciate and acknowledge that they need new products in order to do this.
I wonder if marques currently not doing so well, in say Germany, get as much stick on equivalent BBSs over there? Like Mercedes and VW..?
15 November 2003, 11:19 PM
#52
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 684
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NiceCupofTea WROTE:
>> I am not going to waste any more time on this thread, it's like banging my head against a brick wall. <<
>> Please, anybody who reads this thread: Don't pay any attention to Nacro. <<
"Nice cuppa" .... I came to that conclusion a sometime back.....
Of all the Web Bulletins I regularly visit and enjoy as a motor and transport enthusiast, I now find I visit this once favourite one far, far less frequently now for one simple reason. Has there ever been such a bitterly twisted f1 generation pure Thatcher value bigotted anti-brit, anti-MG-R know-all know-nowt ..... ?? I think not!
>> I am not going to waste any more time on this thread, it's like banging my head against a brick wall. <<
>> Please, anybody who reads this thread: Don't pay any attention to Nacro. <<
"Nice cuppa" .... I came to that conclusion a sometime back.....
Of all the Web Bulletins I regularly visit and enjoy as a motor and transport enthusiast, I now find I visit this once favourite one far, far less frequently now for one simple reason. Has there ever been such a bitterly twisted f1 generation pure Thatcher value bigotted anti-brit, anti-MG-R know-all know-nowt ..... ?? I think not!
15 November 2003, 11:33 PM
#53
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 684
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
logiclee WROTE:
>>Can't comment on the MG Zeds as I haven't driven them.<<
I you have a few minutes to spare sometime pop along to your local MG-R dealership and rectify that with a couple of demonstrations. Not a quick run round the block, but at least 10 miles and really put the car through its paces. Certainly try the ZS120 and maybe the ZT. Then you will be better placed to judge and decide if a certain non-MG-R enthusiast really knows what he's talking about or is simply regurgitating the same old crap he so avidly consumes. My personal favourite is the ZS120. Try one and let us know what you think. You may be surprised. I bought a ZS 120+ for my better half. I enjoy driving it but much prefer my T16 Turbo Rover Tomcat. That too has a fine engine with other qualities I enjoy.......
There are several K series engined cars in my family and they are superb engines with turbine like qualities which I much admire and enjoy using!!!
>>Can't comment on the MG Zeds as I haven't driven them.<<
I you have a few minutes to spare sometime pop along to your local MG-R dealership and rectify that with a couple of demonstrations. Not a quick run round the block, but at least 10 miles and really put the car through its paces. Certainly try the ZS120 and maybe the ZT. Then you will be better placed to judge and decide if a certain non-MG-R enthusiast really knows what he's talking about or is simply regurgitating the same old crap he so avidly consumes. My personal favourite is the ZS120. Try one and let us know what you think. You may be surprised. I bought a ZS 120+ for my better half. I enjoy driving it but much prefer my T16 Turbo Rover Tomcat. That too has a fine engine with other qualities I enjoy.......
There are several K series engined cars in my family and they are superb engines with turbine like qualities which I much admire and enjoy using!!!
15 November 2003, 11:51 PM
#54
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 684
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Consider this: ..... In a recent J D P survey a copy of which I still have, the Rover 75 was the ONLY car to score top place in TWO sections. None of the other numerous so called superior marques, and that's all of them!!, managed to top score more than one section.
So if the Rover is as some would have you believe "crap" with TWO top scores, and the best of the rest only ONE - What are all those over-priced ( correction HIGH residuals, further CORRECTION: Mug UK Punter Treasure Island prices) products then? Yes, just another equally valid viewpoint - mine - only with no twisting of stats or facts.
Safety Fast MotorinG - whatever you drive ...
So if the Rover is as some would have you believe "crap" with TWO top scores, and the best of the rest only ONE - What are all those over-priced ( correction HIGH residuals, further CORRECTION: Mug UK Punter Treasure Island prices) products then? Yes, just another equally valid viewpoint - mine - only with no twisting of stats or facts.
Safety Fast MotorinG - whatever you drive ...
16 November 2003, 12:01 AM
#55
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 684
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
..... and another thing.... IMHO, there has not been a TRULY new car since Issigonis' Mini ..... all those since are merely re-arranged tin or clones in the never ending quest by car manufacturers to part punters from their money ..... and it works!!
Have you noticed how sooo many makers now have their own clone of the Focus? .... is it just me or do they all merge into one Focus clone blob on the roads now? .... hmmmmm..
Oh forget all that.... Now where's those BM brochures ..... must get the latest new shape with all those gizmos..... Must keep up .... I'll show those Jones' next door ...
Have you noticed how sooo many makers now have their own clone of the Focus? .... is it just me or do they all merge into one Focus clone blob on the roads now? .... hmmmmm..
Oh forget all that.... Now where's those BM brochures ..... must get the latest new shape with all those gizmos..... Must keep up .... I'll show those Jones' next door ...
16 November 2003, 12:33 AM
#56
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Notts, UK
Posts: 4,935
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
John,
I'm after a softer car as my wife is struggling with her back problem.
Tried an MGZT 180 Auto and a 190+ this week, a great car but the seats were a little too bucket shaped for my wife.
The suspension was OK but the dealer couldn't tell me if the cars had the old firm suspension, the new softer suspenion or the new sports suspension pack which I think is the same as the old setup.
Interior build quality is first class, way better than a Scoob and the V6 sounded better with the Auto although the manual suited the car better.
So I didn't buy one.
But......
I pick up a Rover 75 2.5V6 Club SE Auto on Monday, British Racing Green and a few options.
Just need to sort out a Caterham for weekend blasts and trackdays next summer.
Lee
[Edited by logiclee - 11/16/2003 12:49:40 AM]
I'm after a softer car as my wife is struggling with her back problem.
Tried an MGZT 180 Auto and a 190+ this week, a great car but the seats were a little too bucket shaped for my wife.
The suspension was OK but the dealer couldn't tell me if the cars had the old firm suspension, the new softer suspenion or the new sports suspension pack which I think is the same as the old setup.
Interior build quality is first class, way better than a Scoob and the V6 sounded better with the Auto although the manual suited the car better.
So I didn't buy one.
But......
I pick up a Rover 75 2.5V6 Club SE Auto on Monday, British Racing Green and a few options.
Just need to sort out a Caterham for weekend blasts and trackdays next summer.
Lee
[Edited by logiclee - 11/16/2003 12:49:40 AM]
16 November 2003, 06:41 AM
#57
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
John you need to try reading what people have actually written-I've said on this thread repeatedly that the 75 is the type of car MGR need to produce across the board, in the meantime they carry on with a load of tired old crap (which incidentally is a description that could be applied to a certain elderly one marque maniac). I'm not the only one of that opinion judging by some comments by others on this thread.
You felt the need to rake this back up again and I'm quite happy to continue it. Where did the rest of MGR's products end up in the Top Gear survey? Near the bottom. Not that I put that much faith in surveys, in the case of MGR all you need to do is look at the old tat they produce.
You felt the need to rake this back up again and I'm quite happy to continue it. Where did the rest of MGR's products end up in the Top Gear survey? Near the bottom. Not that I put that much faith in surveys, in the case of MGR all you need to do is look at the old tat they produce.
16 November 2003, 07:56 AM
#58
BANNED
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Your home is worthless.You can't afford to run your car.Your job is on the line.Schadenfreude rules.
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just for anyone who's interested here are some of Rovers results in the Top gear survey- all positioned out of a possible 137
No. 123: Rover MGF
No. 103: Rover MG ZR
No. 101: Rover 25
No. 84: Rover 200
No. 80: Rover 45
No. 72: Rover 400
and so on until we get to
no. 13: Rover MG ZT the only decent car MGR make along with its sister the 75.
So going by the results of this survey which we shouldn't take too seriously the facts seem to tie up with my assertion that Rover/MG's output is on the whole, below average, underperforming, outdated and subjectively *crap*. A
sk yourself this, who is likely to be biased, some old numptie calling himself MGJohn who owns some of these lackluster products or someone with no axe to grind whatsoever who likes to tell it how it is, regardless of any nationalistic agenda?
No. 123: Rover MGF
No. 103: Rover MG ZR
No. 101: Rover 25
No. 84: Rover 200
No. 80: Rover 45
No. 72: Rover 400
and so on until we get to
no. 13: Rover MG ZT the only decent car MGR make along with its sister the 75.
So going by the results of this survey which we shouldn't take too seriously the facts seem to tie up with my assertion that Rover/MG's output is on the whole, below average, underperforming, outdated and subjectively *crap*. A
sk yourself this, who is likely to be biased, some old numptie calling himself MGJohn who owns some of these lackluster products or someone with no axe to grind whatsoever who likes to tell it how it is, regardless of any nationalistic agenda?
16 November 2003, 01:16 PM
#59
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,867
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Read a sad story in this morning's local Citizen - an MGF driver lost control on the A5 the other day, flipped and it set on fire. Driver badly burnt. I wondered if the engine location make this kind of fire more likely if it turns over ?