chunky_lad

SomeDude - spot on with the statement:

"In my culture, it is somewhat an "unspoken rule" that we don't discuss politics or religion when we go to bars/cafés etc. The moment someone breakes that rule, you have a bar fight."

maybe SN is trying to be all things to all men but I don't reckon a BBS for Subaru and motoring enthusiasts is really a forum for religion and politics. Plenty of other resources on the web for this sort of chat - personally I'm fed up with URL wars and preaching, kick CWE and moderate out this sort of stuff in the future.

Dracoro

I don't think the argument that CWE has little to do with subarus and motoring is good ground for having it removed. You'd have to take the same approach to other forums then - Computer Related, DIY, Sports etc.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Simon's shoes must be spotless when Marcus is about

IMO the lack of RTM'ing is a GOOD thing, and perhaps this a bit much to ask to the mods, but it means they have to go through a thread to get the context of it before deciding to lock it.

The biggest problem with NSR is the high number of RTM's - which is evident, by the mods own admission and threads that get locked straight away due to a "potential" offence when nothing has happend. Or by 1 comment by a troller, which could be deleted. I find it irritating, and my involvement in NSR has gone because of that - it's damaging to the community.

Some threads get lock/moved by simply them not being read when they are RTM'd so IMO the mods have no real idea of what is happening, or any context of the thread. I understand and accept that mods do not have the time (patience ? ) to bother reading every single thread. But perhaps if RTM wasn't used so much then they would either have more time to look at them properly when they do recieve an RTM , or they would have to read through threads on their own intitative to moderate. IMO the latter will always give the best and most justified decisions when moderating a thread.

As for CWE I vote keep it, why? Simple, although I do rarely post on here but I read threads on here quite a bit, and more often than not posting my views would be just repeating what has already been said. But I only go here when I want to read about political events etc. We are bombared with this everyday of our lives from the propagander that is our TV and press.

When I go on to SN, it's normally to get away from the news on the TV. I don't want to go on here and go to NSR and find a load of CWE debates on there that I'm trying to get away from. The CWE forum seperates it, so when I want to look at that kind of stuff - I can.

As a note, perhaps the caution on the RTM page needs to be made more to the point and much larger so people will read it and understand it's intended use. Perhaps a confirmation button that people have to click to remind them that if it is really needed. Afterall, would you ring 999 to report a car parked on the pavement?

chunky_lad

Point I was making is that contention/flaming/name calling/red mist usually results from a political or relogious debate, don't think you'll get the same degree of vitriol on the DIY, Sport, Computer areas of the BBS.

Petem95

I think CWE should stay - its great that difficult issues are allowed to be discussed here, but its a pity that so many threads are totally disrupted and end up getting closed. Mabye the member who is usually responsible should be asked to take his [somewhat fanatical] religious ramblings elsewhere, then sensible discussion could continue here.

Redkop

I must correct you here, not one Mod has mentioned high number of threads RTM'd at all in NSR - Puff said......... Also, as less of the general membership is interested in CWE than in NSR, things tend to get missed. The ratio of RTMs to instances requiring moderating in CWE is very low.


Totally incorrect and a completely wrong assumption to make!!!

Are you aware of actually how many replies are made on ScoobyNet in any one day? A physical impossibility - even if all Mods were online at same time 24/7 so I am afraid you don't understand at all, especially as you mention 'patience' and patience doesn't come into the equation at all.

Just where do you get your misguided ideas from, that the RTM button is used a lot? I can assure you that IF an RTM is received - the WHOLE thread is read and then Moderating Guidelines are followed to decide whatever action is necessary to be taken.

Please get your facts right and don't make such wild, inaccurate assumptions.

I don't suppose you have ever bothered to read this? May I respectfully suggest you do. http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=192395

Jye

I think Ali-B meant CWE not NSR

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

It was mentioned in NSR a month or so back. Unless it was used as a excuse for a mods actions I wouldn't have mentioned it otherwise, I'm not one to make wild assumptons.

So, if the Whole thread is read, why is it locked when it is salvageable? By deleting the offending trolls? Bear in this is not a personalised attack, I do see plenty of edited post from you Redkop. It's a generalised view, perhaps it's someone else?
As for the link...I myself have quoted from it myself on the odd occasion - especially the point where nudity and pornography are classified as the same thing (nuff said ). So yes, I have seen it

I know it's been quoted chapter and verse on many occasions, but I get very confused when some mods regard it as the law, no grey area, it's either right or wrong. Yet I see threads with deliberate swearing and circumvention of the filters. I know its impractical to enforce it, but it sends the message out that the guidelines are not as strictly enforced, so to extent somethings are allowable even though they are mentioned.

I get these misguided ideas from mods explainations, perhaps they were untrue, or made up to cover their own backs. I don't know. But I can only make an assumption on what I have actually seen.

I'd better shut up now as it's going off topic

Redkop

Ali, no two Mods will think and act alike, the interpretation, therefore has to be based on Moderating Guidelines. The threads you mention with deliberate swearing and circumvention of the filters, unless they are brought to our attention will go unnoticed, unless we actually see them ourselves

As explained before, it's a physical impossibility to read ever single post/reply made and this is why we ask people to use the RTM button.

FYI [and I did this especially for you ]

ScoobyNet Statistics Time 14:06pm Saturday
Posts: 3,015,011

ScoobyNet Statistics Time 11:42am today
Posts: 3,016,648

So in 21˝ hours approx - there have been 1637 posts made on SN and bear in mind that SN has much less traffic at a weekend.

I will let you draw your own conclusion to that

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

I feel honoured

jasey

Puff also said "This lack of assistance from the membership in reporting instances that require moderating, whereas in NSR it is high, means that every single thread/post has to be scanned and studied" - Which any non-moderator might assume meant that in NSR the number of times RTM is used is high

Anyway - this line from Puff kind of confuses me - if all the potentially "troublesome" threads are in one place then surely that makes your job easier - Unless you just don't want anyone to talk religion or politics at all - In which case surely you must ban all religious/political talk - banning stuff because it gets people excited is a dangerous road to go down for Scoobynet - Unless Scoobynet wants to go back to being a resource purely for Car Enthusiasts who talk about nothing but their cars - not a serious problem if that's what is wanted by the leadership !

This forum has helped me see that the world is not as Mr Bush and Mr Blair would have us all believe (not that I believed them in the first place )- and that can't be a bad thing !

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Jasey

We have to read all the threads in CWE due to the low RTM count whereas to a large extent, NSR is self-policing with members reporting stuff as necessary.

Therefore, CWE is more time consuming than NSR as we don't have to read absolutely everything in order to maintain efficiency. Granted it has a lower post count, but it requires that every one is read.

Cheers

andrew6321

blimey, there's an admission.

And I always assumed that the moderating was so poor on CWE because you never read the threads....

you have trolls like lostboy/shrek/popeye on almost every thread. their only interest is in de-stabilising the discussion and yet you do nothing about it.

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Well, I do try to read it all but some of it is just so much the same old rubbish that its like trying to run waist high in sticky toffee. Therefore speed reading is the order of the day and unfortunately that misses stuff sometimes.

Tell you what, you send me an RTM on everything that comes up in CWE that you think deserves editing for the next 24 hours.

Thanks

andrew6321

can't do that, because I don't have the time. there's no point in being a moderator and then not having the time to moderate.....

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Didn't say you had to monitor it 24/7 just as I can't - just RTM those instances that you notice that I may not have done (or the other mods)

Thanks

Redkop

so what criteria do you think one should have for being a mod then andrew

No job? No family ties? No social life? Just remain online 24/7 - eh?

Markus

Lynne, you forgot "put up with way to much crap from whinging users"

Jye

^
|
|

Redkop

Markus - you must realise that as a moderator I am not able to always say what I want - and therefore I moderate to the tolerance of the BBS, which may or may not be my own personal tolerance level

andrew6321

For what its worth, I already moderate on a very busy off-road biker forum (with a high 'youth' membership), so in principle I can understand your problems.

However, I was prepared to excuse what I regarded as poor moderating (ie 'under-moderating') because I assumed that you didn't or couldn't scan every single post. However, I can't excuse it now that I realise that you *do* scan every single post.....

I don't want your job thanks.

SomeDude

Puff (can I call you Puff as a newbie ? )

Am I wrong or are you enjoying CWE debates when they are about real life situations, and hate it when it just stoops to abuse levels ?

You are an active participator in the threads, (and with a balanced view IMHO) so I don't understand why you are so fed up with it.

Mind you, not trying to convince you that CWE should stay, I did finally vote "in favor", but I'm still pretty much on the fence.

What I want to say is: I have seen you post on this thread that you are pretty much done/fed up with CWE, yet see you post on another thread in CWE with much intrest etc.

Not a dig, not asking you to justify, I want to use my "anon" user ID as a non-troll one (!), just a bit curious really.

Redkop

Andrew, 'scan' and as Puff has said 'speed reading' has to be done sometimes, especially if you are busy doing something else - but it is a valid reason and not an excuse for missing things. Hence the request that users make use of the RTM button.

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Bit of a dichotomy there eh?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy a GOOD debate of any kind

The thread that you saw me actively participate in was originally in NSR, where it was running along nicely. It was also something about which I feel quite strongly, that of the provenance of guilt prior to punishment, which I feel should be a fundamental tenet of society.

It got moved into CWE and almost straightway the thread deteriorated and before long, needed editing/moderating and has continued to do so

You'll also notice that I don't participate in ALL the threads, just those where I have a knowledge that I wish to impart or an interest, but they could just as well be in NSR.

There is no reason why sensible and reasoned discussion might not continue in NSR without being the focus for abuse and diatribe. I think its fair to say that since the thread I was refering to has moved to CWE, a smaller cross-section of members has felt able to contribute to it. I believe that is a direct result of members not wanting to, or making the effort to, come into CWE to read and participate in the discussions here, because of the type of user that this forum has attracted and allowed to spawn by its very nature.

As I said before, just my opinions.

Jye

Where exactly do you RTM now-a-days anyhow. For the love of me I cant see it anywhere. Must be going blind.

ozzy

There's a wee exclamation mark under the posters username - "report bad post".

Not sure if that's the same as the old RTM link though.

Stefan

Redkop

Yes thats the one Stefan, next to the tick to show if user is online

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

PSML @ Jye (on previous page)

Jye

Just noticed the rather hairy leg, hope RK doesnt take offence

Redkop

First thing I noticed Jye and what a bizarre site you got it from