Bubba po

What if you fought back, and another chav drove around the corner in a Burberry-upholstered tank? What then, eh?

ozzy

Every situation is different and someone with fight training is possibly going to stand a better chance than the mugger (or his m8's). I just hope it gives you more of an actual fighting chance than just an increase in your confidence. You'll never know until it happens and you may be unlucky and only ever get one chance.

I still say use your common sense and judge every situation sperately. Also a good idea to look past the one guy staring in your face in case he's got some m8's with him

Stefan

imlach

To be honest, most of the examples given on here seem to indicate fighting back was not the best option!!!

Just goes to show.....

akshay67

The experience gained from a couple of streetfights is worth about 10 years of martial arts training.

I'm sorry, martial arts are pretty useless when it comes to a streetfights because when you train you never followthough and you're always padded up. In addition most moves are quite predictable - so in your training you know what to expect.

I have a friend who is a bouncer and he says from experience that martial arts types who he has had fights with are the weakest and usually not capable of doing any damage. They spend too much time doing choke holds etc by which time he's chinned them and they're out like a stone. Raw strength, size and a psychotic mentality is the order of the day if you want to be well 'ard!

Having said that, I would still do a martial art because I think they look cool and generally a good/exciting form of exercise and confidence building.

SiPie

If outnumbered, then run away 1st and then only if cornered and under direct threat then fight and even 5th degree black sashes would back that one up

imlach

Does a good kick in the bollocks still hold favour?

ozzy

Well, dominating your enemy has always been the name of the game. Simplest way is to be bigger and stronger than them. Funny thing that most martial arts are from civilisations that are genetically smaller than your average Westener.

No Viking martial arts spring to mind

Stefan

ozzy

Imlach, that's one of the first techniques I was taught and has stood me in good stead a couple of times when I was younger

LG John

These martial arts types can't have been very good at choke holds then as they will put you out cold very quickly if applied correctly! The brain cannot remain active enough for conciousness without a good supply of blood.

ozzy

I'd like to see a 5' 10" 12 stone my average choke hold a 6' 6" 20 stone bouncer. I'm not denying is could be done, but you've got to get to him first.

imlach

In a class perhaps....surely a wriggling & writhing real-world situation may make things happen a bit more slowly, and hence give the assailant the opportunity to retaliate before it takes effect?

Tiggs

if you were bullied at school and now want to show the world you are better than those that bullied......go on friends reunited and laugh at the suckers with no jobs.....dont get stabbed!

SiPie

By the time the bouncer has time to react the speed of the other guy if trained correctly would have his fingers/arms/knees broken, then see how well he'd fair with all that bulk... he'll have to try and smother you to death with his bulk

ozzy

Yeah, right

LG John

Most chokes involve going to ground so are utterly useless unless 1:1 unless you can take being kicked to crap by the guys mates. If applied correctly wriggling and writhing will only increase the force of the choke and in any event when applied with the purpose of putting someone 'out' it doesn't take long at all.

In fact a single chop to either side of the neck into the muscle strand behind which is your main atery is enough to cause a good pressure drop to the brain bringing about disorentation or putting you out. Don't believe me? Try it! Right now at your desk get someone to give you a light but definate strike and you'll feel yourself go wonky. Imagine that done at full pelt!!! I had it done lightly to me just the other day and near lost my legs from beneith me

This is another advantage of martial arts is that many of them teach you the science behind the human body and therein its weaknesses. You can be the biggest git in the world but a swift punt in the ***** will put you down or an attack to soft areas like the neck, arm pits, etc. Do you think Mr 20 stone bouncer can take a side-kick through he knee?? Do you know how easy it is to kick at knee how quickly and powerfully? You don't need any fancy jumps or mental stretches just a straightfoward boot in the knee and he'll be lucky to be walking again for the rest of the week.

LG John

Funny you should say that but one of our more 'mental' black belts used to work doors and got in a scuffle with a few lads. He ended up going to the ground and somehow had some massive fat guy land and sit on his face. He didn't use any fancy technique or training but instead bit the guy on the ***** and it had the desired effect

ozzy

You don't need to be a martial artist to know weakpoints of your body.

Bollocks, windpipe, knees are just some of the crudist. You don't need any fancy choke holds. You want quick, painful attacks that will get the other party on the deck as quick as possible.

Everything's sounds good in theory. When some 20 stone guy is screaming in your face and rushing towards you I hope for your sake your bottle holds.

If anyone's ever had to do "milling" in the forces they'll know how nerve racking that is and you know the guys your fighting. I've seen a few amateur boxers hit the deck just coz the other guy went for it.

Stefan

SiPie

I find Ozzy's (a guy who I normally agree with in most topics ) remark hilarious.....

The guys I enjoyed sparring with for easiness to beat and humiliate (and admittedly only sparring..) were the bigger the better brigade.... and the bulkier the muscle the better.... oh how quickly the pumped up 20st ones react ...... NOT.. and they are such a lovely big target

Go figure

LG John

What if the guy you are fighting feels no pain or can take it?

I think its useful to know what will medically put a person down. Every ned in the country punches because it does external and obvious damage, broken skin bruises, etc but the punch is actually a very weak weapon. A palm strike does far more internal damage as is focuses its energy into the internal organs and can disable an aggressor far quicker if used correctly.

ozzy

That's fine in a controlled environment. It's much different in real-life, that's all I'm saying. If you've got the space and freedom to dodge his attacks, then you're gonna stand a good chance. Just hope you can punch your weight and know where to hit them

Talking's one thing, doing it in real-life's another matter.

As far as I'm concerened it's all talk, unless you lads have a reputation around Edinburgh

LG John

Got to agree with sipie - the people I fear most are about 6' 2" and 85kg of pure muscle as these guys are bulky enough and tall enough to be useful but also not too large that they are slow.

LG John

At no point have I indicated or said I'm hard - I'm takling about the attitude that martial arts are worthless in general. Please feel free to come to class ozzy and I suspect you'll see they do actually have a practical application and its not just a bunch of fairys

ozzy

A kick in the ***** will take down the vast majority of blokes. You could always go for the windpipe, but you'll probably kill them.

I never mentioned what techniques to use when hitting them hard or fast. I'm sure the boxers out there might disagree that a good punch is very weak.

LG John

If they are holding a knife to you do you really care if they die!!!

Boxers are different in the same way that a £1 coin dropped on your head from a metre is different to one dropped from 2 miles! These guys could be hitting you with anything attached to the end of their arm and still put you out such is the force generated. If a boxer scored a clean palm strike to the ribs with the force they generate it could very well be fatal!

ozzy

I've never said that martial arts was good or bad or that you were appearing as some hard man. All I'm pointing out is that in the real-world it's not always as easy as it is in a class.

I've had hand-to-hand combat training of my own, but I'm under no illusions that I'm indestructable. I'm confident and aware of my own abilities and weaknesses, but since the majority of the training involves actually killing someone I don't feel it's very practical in every day use.

I'm too easy going a guy to allow a situation to get out of hand, but if I was cornered at felt my life threatened then I'd certainly defend myself.

Unfortunately, martial arts gets a bad name because a lot of people take it up and then use it to impress m8's and try to prove they are tough.

Stefan

ozzy

Erm, yes actually.

Stefan

LG John

Its you or them stefan when you boil it down. Clearly nobody normal wants to kill another person but I could live with myself if I felt is was what was required to ensure my safety in a life/death situation.

Tiggs

"If they are holding a knife to you do you really care if they die!!!"

some NONSENSE on here now!

the poster got mugged for £30...he's fine today.

the blokes had every possible "what if" thrown at him and told how the SAS, Navy Seals and Arnolds dog would have done it better.

Now we have the "so what if you kill him" approach.

If David had killed his mugger the only PC he'd be sat near today is the one taking his shoelaces of him!

T

ozzy

The problem is you need to be damn sure it's a life threatening situation in real life. If someone pulls a knife you can't be 100% sure they intend on using it rather than just being threatening. If they actually come at you with it, then that's a different matter.

Like I say, if anyone felt their life threatened I'm sure they'd defend themselves in whatever way necessary. It should still be the very last resort and watching someone choke to death in front of you would'nt be very pleasant in any circumstance.

Stefan

ozzy

Tiggs,

Spot on. That's why I commented on people watching too many movies several pages ago.

Stefan

I've completely forgotten how Special Forces managed to find it's way onto this post.