My Eyes have Been Opened
18 April 2004, 10:04 PM
#61
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Sounds like this is a horses-for-courses thing. I had BMW 3-series for 8 1/2 years (325td then 328i) before I got my MY03 STi last September. There's no way I'd got back to the 3-series - the STi would leave it standing in a straight line, round corners, in the wet, in the dry, on snow, ...
I tried the new 3-series 330Ci and it was still nowhere near as good as the STi (or the WRX for that matter, IMHO). The only issue I had with the Scooby was the harsh ride - and changing the tyres to 18" Eagle's changed that. The understeer is far less than the BMW, and if it starts to bother me, I can change the springs or get it dialed out.
Finally, the local dealership was simply not interested in accommodating my needs as a customer. The only way I could test drive their 33Ci with semi-auto box (which I found is cr@p, by the way) was to go on a weekday. Weekends and Xmas week were no-go because the sales manager used it as his company car, and the salesman didn't have the guts to tell him to take a 316i home instead as a customer wanted to try it. Apparently most BMW customers don't do test drives...
The Subaru dealers, on the other hand, could not have been more helpful - apart from one very well-known dealer who wanted to charge ridiculous amounts for fitting extras (like 4 times as much!).
The final smile for me was when I picked the STi up and drove up the A1 to Yorkshire the same day. All the white vans got out of my way without me even asking - after 8 1/2 years of having them dive out in front of me, because I was in a BMW, it was wonderful.
I tried the new 3-series 330Ci and it was still nowhere near as good as the STi (or the WRX for that matter, IMHO). The only issue I had with the Scooby was the harsh ride - and changing the tyres to 18" Eagle's changed that. The understeer is far less than the BMW, and if it starts to bother me, I can change the springs or get it dialed out.
Finally, the local dealership was simply not interested in accommodating my needs as a customer. The only way I could test drive their 33Ci with semi-auto box (which I found is cr@p, by the way) was to go on a weekday. Weekends and Xmas week were no-go because the sales manager used it as his company car, and the salesman didn't have the guts to tell him to take a 316i home instead as a customer wanted to try it. Apparently most BMW customers don't do test drives...
The Subaru dealers, on the other hand, could not have been more helpful - apart from one very well-known dealer who wanted to charge ridiculous amounts for fitting extras (like 4 times as much!).
The final smile for me was when I picked the STi up and drove up the A1 to Yorkshire the same day. All the white vans got out of my way without me even asking - after 8 1/2 years of having them dive out in front of me, because I was in a BMW, it was wonderful.
18 April 2004, 10:06 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by Simon Lines
I have 3 friends with 330's 2 x 1 year old and one new. One is US spec, one UK and one LHD EU. To be honest all three have had build quality issues, the US one has sent more time at the dealership that on his drive and the last time I drove the LHD one in France bits of roof lining and door casing surround ware falling on me!
Me? I would not want any BMW that did not have that little “M” badge lol
Me? I would not want any BMW that did not have that little “M” badge lol
After then looking at a few BM's in our price range, ('99-'01 type stuff ) I was absolutely dissapointed and unimpressed.
One drive in a good Scoob was all it took, and we had'nt even thought of them at all up until that point !!!! And I have not stopped smiling since when driving it !!!! .... LOL.
People seem to go on about build quality on cars like the BM's because thats what they've heard about them for so long, but I'm not sure they all know what they are on about at all.
Build quality has moved on massively on all production cars, just look how good the fit and finish is on even a new Ford or Vauxhall. The 'prestige' cars just are not that far ahead anymore IMO.
Go look at some new Jap stuff, 350Z, new Legacy and the like, I'd say thats build quality .... the Japs have got it sorted !!!!
Last edited by Fidd; 18 April 2004 at 10:32 PM.
18 April 2004, 10:10 PM
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Thrust,
Hear what your saying, and glad that you're giving an opinion having lived with both and that you're happy with the STI. Just wish more people had ownership experience before slagging off either the Subaru or the BMW in equal measure!
Both you and I are more than happy with our choices, so that's cool
Matt
Hear what your saying, and glad that you're giving an opinion having lived with both and that you're happy with the STI. Just wish more people had ownership experience before slagging off either the Subaru or the BMW in equal measure!
Both you and I are more than happy with our choices, so that's cool
Matt
18 April 2004, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by 6 pot
Fidd,
Not cancelled the WR1 yet, still in the land of decisions, mpg is not much of an issue, its just that coming out of a roundabout onto a section of dual carriageway I had my **** wooped my a 330d
and it made me think why am I doing less than 20mpg with lots of noise and little luxury, when in fact I could do it with more refinement and much reduced fuel bills, I plan to do 20k miles over the next year, as follows:
Average Mpg WRX 19 = 4776 litres @ £0.849 per litre = £4054
Average MPG 330D 40 = 2270 litres @ £0.79 per litre =£1793
Also take into account that in 20000 miles the scoob,if I go for the WR1 would need 4 services + lots of tyres and brakes, even in the wrx it would need 2 services 2 lots of brake pads and tyres.
With the saving that I make I could have a free holiday in the caribean every year.
Not cancelled the WR1 yet, still in the land of decisions, mpg is not much of an issue, its just that coming out of a roundabout onto a section of dual carriageway I had my **** wooped my a 330d
and it made me think why am I doing less than 20mpg with lots of noise and little luxury, when in fact I could do it with more refinement and much reduced fuel bills, I plan to do 20k miles over the next year, as follows:Average Mpg WRX 19 = 4776 litres @ £0.849 per litre = £4054
Average MPG 330D 40 = 2270 litres @ £0.79 per litre =£1793
Also take into account that in 20000 miles the scoob,if I go for the WR1 would need 4 services + lots of tyres and brakes, even in the wrx it would need 2 services 2 lots of brake pads and tyres.
With the saving that I make I could have a free holiday in the caribean every year.
18 April 2004, 10:21 PM
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Cheers, Matt. I particularly take your point on taking the car to places you'd rather not leave it - my sister's place in London cost a stupid amount, but it's still not somewhere I'd take the STi. Enjoy the diesel - at 30k miles a year my head says I should have bought one. But I was single at the time, and my now-fiancée does like the Scooby
I should have said, I had my first BMW at 26. I never saw it as an old-man's car, and like all these things, there were things I loved and things I hated.
I should have said, I had my first BMW at 26. I never saw it as an old-man's car, and like all these things, there were things I loved and things I hated.
18 April 2004, 10:24 PM
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Simon,
good posts, pretty much agree.
E30 M3 - fabulous handling car - was going to add it to my list and forgot! Also would add the Exige - drool - and even the new Mazda RX thingy is a pretty special handling car!!
AWD LM car - I think there was one - McLaren LM
Rannoch
good posts, pretty much agree.
E30 M3 - fabulous handling car - was going to add it to my list and forgot! Also would add the Exige - drool
- and even the new Mazda RX thingy is a pretty special handling car!!AWD LM car - I think there was one - McLaren LM
Rannoch
18 April 2004, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by MattOz
Geldy,
RWD is better than AWD if you're a purist.
RWD is better than AWD if you're a purist.
Had several BM's, something appealing about rear drives, yes, but if you loose them on a public road ... phew !!!!
Had one moment in particular in a 5 series on a damp road, missus was in the car and went absolutely nuts thinking I was larking about while I was struggling to gain control while preparing to go into the ditch / tree / hedge / .... LOL .... and I was not even going that quickly.
AWD all the way if you like to use the performance.
19 April 2004, 07:47 AM
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The current 3 series has some pretty impressive dynamic stability control stuff on it. Obviously it can't defy physics but it has a bloody good go...
I've only had the stability control kick in once when it was wet, other than that the traction control sometimes comes in when accelerating too agressively in very wet weather. Neither have ever come in during dry conditions
You can also turn them down or totally off if you want to.
Steve
I've only had the stability control kick in once when it was wet, other than that the traction control sometimes comes in when accelerating too agressively in very wet weather. Neither have ever come in during dry conditions
You can also turn them down or totally off if you want to.
Steve
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