MooseRacer

I have an incar vid of you at Coombe - just uploading to my site now...

Gutmann pug

How did you manage that then mooseracer? You haven't been in my car. ahhhhhh unless you found it on one of the other peugeot sites of course.

MooseRacer

Downloaded it when you first posted it - still sat merrily in 'My Documents'

Gutmann pug

Good effort matey.

There were a few vids from memory. There was one which showed all the cars I passed. Bit boring and 6 mins long. There was a quickish lap 1 min 30 long vid and a lap of me following the CSL. The quickish lap is probably most relevant.

MooseRacer

Got there in the end:

http://www.mooseracer.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/quicklap.wmv

rb5_336

not bad, so mine was 2 secs up with a passenger. So i think that concludes your original point that an 8v will give an mi16 something to worry about.

Touche!

Sean

davyboy

.....well were you using r rated tyres though?

rb5_336

yes

davyboy

There's 2 seconds then...........

rb5_336

i'm not convinced, as many of the corners at CC are 'slow' therefore such tyres wont provide a massive advantage in my opinion..comments welcome of course

And adding to this, to get back to Gutmann's original point, in my opinion, at CC he's better off with an Mi16 than sticky tyres to reduce his times; not taking driver improvements into consideration of course

davyboy

I would think on most circuits they would be worth a couple of seconds a lap, maybe a second a mile as a rule of thumb?

rb5_336

I think a circuit like goodwood would benefit more from r rated tyres than CC

Dream Weaver

At least this thread has spurred me on to sort mine

Last night went from this:





to this



Bloody aching today, but it will be worth it when done

c_w

I think the driver does make a big difference, and if you start out with a quickish car then I find building up a big spec list makes less difference than you might expect (relatively). Ie you're never going to half your lap time, but each modification may shave a few tengths here and there (and theoretically those few tengths can be made up/masked by a more experienced driver)

Gary, I think lightening the car makes a big difference, so an 8v with nearly 100kg shed may well have the same PTW as a 205Mi16 in full trim, which is heaiver anyway due to slightly heavier engine. Though the PTW doesn't tell you the whole story as lightening the car has the benefit of making the car stop and steer better too.

I use worn road tyres on track and have never used cut slicks etc and find I can lap fairly quickly. Mine is a standard Mi16 engine and the car is in full trim with a fair bit of soundproofing and other additions like 6x9 speakers etc as the car was not originally a track only car though I've done plenty in it.

I wouldn't like to "challenge" anyone at a trackday as I see them as a bit of fun to enjoy and not to take too seriously but it's always nice to have a few laps with someone of a similar speed.

ScoobyJawa

Keep up the good work DW

Gutmann pug

Cheers for hosting my vid again ........

I think my original comment was that I run 1.28-1.29 in a 8 valve with road tyres. That still remains the case. If I had a clear track as RB did then the 1.30 would have dropped by a second. The beemer took me off line as you can see. 'R' rated tyres would have given me an advantage over myself I feel and I would have been quicker. By how much I have no idea. What I was trying to say was that IMHO it isnt all about power. Its about set up, weight, driver, tyres the whole nine yards. The Mi's maybe great engines and great cars but as yet I havent come upon one thats overtaken me on track. Doesnt mean they can't just means they havent yet.

Gary

rb5_336

I'm convinced you've been lucky so far.....but good luck to you!

The Dissadvantage of the mi16 is the weight, thats why ive had to seriously lighten the car to get the full benefit out of it

davyboy

The harder he practises the luckier he gets

Gutmann pug

Ok fair enough the MI16 is by far and away a better track car than my little Gutmann 8 valve clutter. I have publically conceeded this fact.

There is no way my clutter could ever compete with the likes of Mi or GTi 6 conversions. If by chance I happen to overtake one on a track it means they are on their warm down lap, suffering from heat soak or oil pressure lose, or electrical fault etc.

There ya go fella's .... I have said exactly what you wanted to hear. Now you can go back to feeling all warm and cuddly about ya 16V jobbies.



One thing before I go though .... at least if I decide to compete in my car. Something which is probably on the cards next year, either in this country or Germany, at least mine will be in a class where it can compete .....

rb5_336

Oh come on gary, you cant end it like that, your 'Ring videos are the env of the 205 world..come on tell us how your 8v will always be superior ? I did think about going back to 8v when mi had a hickup last week

Oh yeah, special mention of u here in jest..true white van man comedy!

c_w

Forget about the number of valves, the Mi16 makes 30bhp more than the 8v engine, the torque is deabateable as the Mi16 makes more power at higher revs it may just be the 8v "seems" torquier. Though I do admit that it does feel this way on the road, but on the track I use the revs available.

It was a shame I had a blowout at FCS as it would have been good to "compare" cars on track, though I'm not sure what session you were in. I think our power to weight is similar as yours is lightened and mine carries excess ballast! lol

Gutmann pug

rb5 if you were in a caterham over the 'ring' back in may then i probably did flash you and a friend out of the way ...... little white EVO stickers on ya back bumpers.

Mind you saying that the fastest car I have seen on the ring was a caterham playing the middle of a group of fast bikes .....very very useful.


Cw you really are missing the point. What i was saying was that my car would compete with RB's car given the lap he showed. I was then trying to say that had I also been using 'R' rated tyres it would make my car quicker still. I didn't say I could beat every Mi in the world or claim to have seen a UFO.....dear oh dear


anyway christmas is coming

Dream Weaver

Except me, cos mines buggered

ScoobyJawa

8v rules

Gutmann pug

lol at scoobyjawa ........ bit late now ive been beaten to a pulp

c_w

You missed your own point as you said "you had never been passed by an Mi16" at a trackday (ie you were talking generally about Mi16, not referring to RB5's original statement) when it should have read "I have never been passed by Sean in his Mi16"

RRH

Heading up to Croft with my Mi16 this evening- was toying with the idea of driving it but you've put me off now

It was only finished on Tuesday, so I've been driving it like a feckin lunatic trying to get it to break, and it hasn't missed a beat so far.

Suspect it's waiting for the pitlane at Croft tomorrow before it throws its hand in......

davyboy

Could you guys not put S16 or GTI-6 (gearbox issues??) engines in?

Gutmann pug

okey dokey .......

still this is passing the time for sure and its only 13 1/2 hours till I have to get out of bed tomorrow morning ready to go play on a ''real'' track for the weekend.

Funny coz on that day at combe there was a guy trying to sell me a turbo lump for the car. He had taken it out and replaced it with a GTi-6 engine which he said was pushing close to 200BHP (from memory). He was right behind me when we went onto the track and half way into the session I lapped him on the straight .....8 valves rule

Gutmann pug

S16 is heavier than the Mi ........ the GTi6 engine fits but they are pretty rare at the moment and its tricky to fit the 6 speed box i think