Ok, Fox Hunting.
15 September 2004, 03:41 PM
#62
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"Hunting foxes with dogs is cruel". I can kind of agree with that. Certainly more cruel than a good head shot from a well aimed rifle or a close blast from a 12 bore.
However, the fox leads a great life up until those few minutes/hours he is chased down and then ripped apart.
So, for all those people who do think hunting foxes with dogs should be banned, do you also want the production of (massed produced) chicken banned? They lead a crap life from day one but are then killed fairly humanly.
I would prefer a great life, then some pain for a few seconds rather than pain and suffering all through my life then a split second of more pain.
Doesn't matter what you say in this discussion, someone will have an equally valid opposite viewpoint. There is no right answer.
But whatever you are discussing, do remember that most of the words like "cruel", "barbaric" etc. are human words. They are words that are applied to events based on your own opinion. Cruel to one person is OK to another.
And on top of that, animals do not have this concept. For all we know (and I'm only making the point), the fox may actually enjoy the chase and only becomes fearful for a few seconds when he is caught and killed. Think about it.
Anyway, I'll get off the fence. I do believe hunting foxes with hounds should be banned. But the only reason I don't support the ban is because it is being pushed through for the wrong reasons. In addition, I can see other country sports (that I take part in) coming under threat once this ban goes through.
Cheers
Ian
However, the fox leads a great life up until those few minutes/hours he is chased down and then ripped apart.
So, for all those people who do think hunting foxes with dogs should be banned, do you also want the production of (massed produced) chicken banned? They lead a crap life from day one but are then killed fairly humanly.
I would prefer a great life, then some pain for a few seconds rather than pain and suffering all through my life then a split second of more pain.
Doesn't matter what you say in this discussion, someone will have an equally valid opposite viewpoint. There is no right answer.
But whatever you are discussing, do remember that most of the words like "cruel", "barbaric" etc. are human words. They are words that are applied to events based on your own opinion. Cruel to one person is OK to another.
And on top of that, animals do not have this concept. For all we know (and I'm only making the point), the fox may actually enjoy the chase and only becomes fearful for a few seconds when he is caught and killed. Think about it.
Anyway, I'll get off the fence. I do believe hunting foxes with hounds should be banned. But the only reason I don't support the ban is because it is being pushed through for the wrong reasons. In addition, I can see other country sports (that I take part in) coming under threat once this ban goes through.
Cheers
Ian
15 September 2004, 03:50 PM
#63
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I heard that foxhunting was actually a CIA conspiracy.
These so called 'killed' foxes are actually taken to a secret airbase in Nevada and trained to fly passenger planes into civilian targets.
These so called 'killed' foxes are actually taken to a secret airbase in Nevada and trained to fly passenger planes into civilian targets.
15 September 2004, 03:52 PM
#64
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So, for all those people who do think hunting foxes with dogs should be banned, do you also want the production of (massed produced) chicken banned?
the only reason I don't support the ban is because it is being pushed through for the wrong reasons. In addition, I can see other country sports (that I take part in) coming under threat once this ban goes through.
UB
UB
15 September 2004, 03:56 PM
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The interesting thing is the reatively high percentage of people on here who do not want a ban, which would seem to imply the "market research" is incorrect.
By the way having been a fox in a previous life I can confirm that they love the chase, and the death is quick!
By the way having been a fox in a previous life I can confirm that they love the chase, and the death is quick!
15 September 2004, 03:57 PM
#67
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Get a life if all your interested in is Labour bashing and the political process on how they are getting it through. Its so the bunch of geriatric w@nkers in the Lords can't chuck it out because the majority those old codgers probably take part in a hunt so harldy fair to leave it down to them to decide!
I absolutely detest Labour as much as you UB but animal cruelty in my mind is just a little more important to me than my opinions on Labour!
As for battery chickens, yes I do think they should be outlawed and free range chickens should be the only option on the sheleves of shops! So that accusation with me doesn't stick i'm afraid.
I absolutely detest Labour as much as you UB but animal cruelty in my mind is just a little more important to me than my opinions on Labour!
As for battery chickens, yes I do think they should be outlawed and free range chickens should be the only option on the sheleves of shops! So that accusation with me doesn't stick i'm afraid.
15 September 2004, 03:59 PM
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Well I think that it should be banned.
Got chased in the summer by one of them snarling *******, cute! **** me thay can run.
Got cornered in a small copse and nearly **** myself when I got surrounded by 4 or 5 of the *******. Managed to find a large rabbit hole and ducked down there. Big bonus to find 6 bunnies, tasty dinner. Had a nap and by the time I woke up it was dark and the dogs had p1ssed off.
My mate wasn't so lucky, got chased across a field and some little cvnt took a potshot with a 12 bore, took a hit in his ****. Anyway a week later the hunt was out and the poor guy was n't as quick as he had been, got ripped limb from limb.
Got chased in the summer by one of them snarling *******, cute! **** me thay can run.
Got cornered in a small copse and nearly **** myself when I got surrounded by 4 or 5 of the *******. Managed to find a large rabbit hole and ducked down there. Big bonus to find 6 bunnies, tasty dinner. Had a nap and by the time I woke up it was dark and the dogs had p1ssed off.
My mate wasn't so lucky, got chased across a field and some little cvnt took a potshot with a 12 bore, took a hit in his ****. Anyway a week later the hunt was out and the poor guy was n't as quick as he had been, got ripped limb from limb.
Plus if I did i'd make sure I had a proper meal such as venison which wont have been battery farmed
15 September 2004, 04:07 PM
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The whole 'sport' seems a bit one-sided to me. They need to liven it up a bit. Let them carry on with their funny games, but add a little twist - put a Rambo character out there on the side of the fox and tell them they'll need their wits about them or they're dead. I would gladly watch that.
I don't know whether it is actually cruel or not; I don't know the facts, but it looks like it is. What I don't like about it is that's it's unfair. It's basically bullying. They need a taste of their own medicine.
I don't know whether it is actually cruel or not; I don't know the facts, but it looks like it is. What I don't like about it is that's it's unfair. It's basically bullying. They need a taste of their own medicine.
15 September 2004, 04:09 PM
#72
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Originally Posted by **************
Get a life if all your interested in is Labour bashing and the political process on how they are getting it through. Its so the bunch of geriatric w@nkers in the Lords can't chuck it out because the majority those old codgers probably take part in a hunt so harldy fair to leave it down to them to decide!
I absolutely detest Labour as much as you UB but animal cruelty in my mind is just a little more important to me than my opinions on Labour!
As for battery chickens, yes I do think they should be outlawed and free range chickens should be the only option on the sheleves of shops! So that accusation with me doesn't stick i'm afraid.
I absolutely detest Labour as much as you UB but animal cruelty in my mind is just a little more important to me than my opinions on Labour!
As for battery chickens, yes I do think they should be outlawed and free range chickens should be the only option on the sheleves of shops! So that accusation with me doesn't stick i'm afraid.
My point is that the real issues here - the erosion of our civil liberties and democratic rights that are taking place under this government - far outway the issue of whether is is cruel to hunt foxes with dogs. The people who are duped into going along with this sort of social engineering, by having their emotions manipulated by the 'cruelty card', are as much victims as the people who's lives will be ruined by this legislation.UB
15 September 2004, 04:13 PM
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In fact with a small leap of the imagination you can see the same people arguing that this was a case of Ethnic Cleansing that breaches the human rights of those affected, and in that case I would probably agree.
UB
UB
15 September 2004, 04:15 PM
#74
Im not sure where I stand on fox hunting. Im not for the foxes getting ripped apart but then Im against the constant and progressive infringements on our freedoms.
As has been pointed out, fox hunting is cruel, theres no doubt about that, but then what about poisons, battery farming, fishing etc.
Again as has been said how many of those who are anti hunt indirectly support mass production of meat, fish and dairy produce for our consumption? I buy organic eggs, and meats where possible and if given the choice will pay considerably more for organic or free range animal products. Having said that I, like most people nowerdays, live a busy life and its not always possible (and Im not so **** to have the motivation ) to get the food Id like to buy and I just dont have the time to hunt round for all pc foodstuff.
As has been pointed out, fox hunting is cruel, theres no doubt about that, but then what about poisons, battery farming, fishing etc.
Again as has been said how many of those who are anti hunt indirectly support mass production of meat, fish and dairy produce for our consumption? I buy organic eggs, and meats where possible and if given the choice will pay considerably more for organic or free range animal products. Having said that I, like most people nowerdays, live a busy life and its not always possible (and Im not so **** to have the motivation ) to get the food Id like to buy and I just dont have the time to hunt round for all pc foodstuff.
15 September 2004, 04:17 PM
#75
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UB the point is it doesn't matter what political party was in power currently, it would be an issue they would have to vote on at some point due to public feeling. So I don't agree with this one particular issue being part of a bigger picture. Fox hunting and banning it has been on the cards for years and each time its gone to the Lords they have dismissed it. My beliefs on the reason for that is because the Lords are a bunch of out of date geriatrics and toffs who have a severe lack of reality about living in the real world and should be got rid of as far as I am concerned, or at least replaced with a much younger membership who are more in line with modern day issues and views.
Yes if it was about the car tagging scheme or any of the other big brother policies I would totally agree with you. However in my opinion this has nothing to do with that, its about outlawing the final cruel sport left after badger baiting etc had been banned. It should all have been done at the same time!
Yes if it was about the car tagging scheme or any of the other big brother policies I would totally agree with you. However in my opinion this has nothing to do with that, its about outlawing the final cruel sport left after badger baiting etc had been banned. It should all have been done at the same time!
15 September 2004, 04:25 PM
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Someone brought that up earlier. But all those bloodsports that have been banned have just gone underground (and no I'm not in favour of them before anyone starts). They still go on behind closed doors so the banning has solved nothing. All banning things achieves is to resrict the Liberties of the law abiding.
15 September 2004, 04:31 PM
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So anyone who continues to particiapate in those blood sports will be dealt with by the law if caught. The same will apply to fox hunters who defy the law if its passed. Just because they don't agree with the law doesn't mean they can carry on doing it without punishment. I don't doubt fox hunting will continue illegally, but the thats upto the police to deal with illegal hunts.
15 September 2004, 04:34 PM
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Hunting with hounds is for toffs and morons from the country who don't know any better so would rather keep the status quo than even think about chaning anything, there are probably the same people who think the earth is still flat and things were better in the 'good old days'.
Hunting with hounds is really about nothing more than these blood thirsty riding about like the lord of the manor and jumping things on horses.
Saying its about controlling vermin is a load of rubbish, if I have a problem with mice in my house I don't get dressed up in my Sunday best get all my mates round and hunt them down with a pack of cats!
Hunting with hounds is really about nothing more than these blood thirsty riding about like the lord of the manor and jumping things on horses.
Saying its about controlling vermin is a load of rubbish, if I have a problem with mice in my house I don't get dressed up in my Sunday best get all my mates round and hunt them down with a pack of cats!
15 September 2004, 04:41 PM
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Hunting with hounds is for toffs and morons from the country who don't know any better
www.chavscum.co.uk
UB
15 September 2004, 04:45 PM
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maybe they could introduce chav hunting as an alternative?
get a load of guys in subarus with baseball bats...
....and then get some toffs to mow them down with machine guns.
ba booom tsh.
get a load of guys in subarus with baseball bats...
....and then get some toffs to mow them down with machine guns.
ba booom tsh.
15 September 2004, 04:45 PM
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Well there has been another exemplary show of security at the commons, this time animal activists managed to reach the front bench of the commons lol so doubt a result will be reached by the end of today now.
Does this country actually know what security is? Its a joke, so far this week we could have had Buckingham Palace blown up and now the Houses of Parliament
Does this country actually know what security is? Its a joke, so far this week we could have had Buckingham Palace blown up and now the Houses of Parliament
15 September 2004, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by **************
Well there has been another exemplary show of security at the commons, this time animal activists managed to reach the front bench of the commons lol so doubt a result will be reached by the end of today now.
Does this country actually know what security is? Its a joke, so far this week we could have had Buckingham Palace blown up and now the Houses of Parliament
Does this country actually know what security is? Its a joke, so far this week we could have had Buckingham Palace blown up and now the Houses of Parliament
UB
15 September 2004, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by **************
Well there has been another exemplary show of security at the commons, this time animal activists managed to reach the front bench of the commons lol so doubt a result will be reached by the end of today now.
I could undersand the pro-hunt doing this but really...
Class!! Now that I'd like to see
15 September 2004, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by **************
lol Brendan. UB they were animal activists so that would suggest they were perhaps anti hunt?
Apparently Blair's riot police are now beating up on the old folk outside. Disgraceful.
UB
Last edited by unclebuck; 15 September 2004 at 05:05 PM.
15 September 2004, 05:04 PM
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Hmmmm public opinion alledgedly wants hunting banned, although I have grave doubts in opinion pollsters!
However seem to be very few MPs in the Commons. Typical!
However seem to be very few MPs in the Commons. Typical!