ChrisB

Erm, France run standard guage ie 4ft 8.5 inches between the rails.

http://parovoz.com/spravka/gauges-e.html says they have approx 34322km of standard gauge track.

http://www.bueker.net/trainspotting/...-railways.php:

France:
UK:

Senior_AP

You found out?!? PMSL.

ChrisB

Always best to be right before you claim to be a geek

Senior_AP

Suppose it's better to claim and be wrong than to be thought of without saying a thing.....

Account deleted by request

I guess you two have nothing to do at work today if you are arguing over train track width?

Senior_AP

I'm so efficient much of my work is done!! However, a late lunch in this case.

Haven't even had a break all day.

David Lock

Talking of train track width I can't remember the details but there was a major change to track width when Brunel was in his prime and he stopped the network at 5.00 on the Friday, changed the gauge over the weekend and trains were back up and running on the Monday. Anyone know the details - it was a fantastic achievement by any standard?? DL

Senior_AP

Would never happen in England. They'd all stand there with their flasks, scratching their heads saying :

"aoooww, I dunno ya know, sa big F$cking job ennit"

"I tell ya what, f$ck it, let's go pub".

King RA

Thats was England wasn't it??

Suresh

I thought that UK railways are globally recognised as best - or at least as the most efficient, given the performance they deliver compared to the measly government subsidy paid out to them.

I even recall that UK rail consultants were in demand the world over as to how it could be done (final answer : compromise on infrastructure investment & safety).

According to my mate G.Oogle, the UK govt paid GBP 1,000Mio in subsidies in 2001/2002, which compares pretty favourably to what rail systems in other countries receive. e.g. City of Zurich in Switzerland has budgeted GBP 270Mio for just local trains, trams and busses in their city for 2005. So under 4 times that amount for the whole of great Britain seems more than reasonable to me!!

So stop knocking something which isn't all that crap!


Suresh,
Lives in Holland and drives everywhere, so what does he know

darts_aint_sport

The French government is the reason trains are good in France, they have to subsidise it a lot, especially the TGV. Truth is, although French trains may be very good, they lose a lot of money, which I doubt the British govt can be arsed with.

KiwiGTI

What the British government is some radical and perhaps politically incorrect thinking.

If they imported an army of workers, 10,000 - 20,000 from China say, then get them to build lots of new French style railway tracks, they could make an excellent public transport system, in a very short time.

The foreign workers could earn much batter wages than at home (pay then £5 an hour or something), while the government would save heaps and get the jobs done quickly. The workers would then receive a large bonus when they return if they don't breach visa conditions.

Some may say it's exploitation but no more than when we buy electronic goods or clothes made in factories overseas, in fact they'd be getting a better deal over here.

The unions couldn't argue, they wouldn't be taking local jobs because the projects would never be undertaken without the cheap labour.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

Yep, SNCF get a bigger subsidy than our lot.

BUT: the first TGV line, from Paris to Lyon, heavily subsidised by the French Governement during build/equipping, proceeded to make so much money that it paid off the subsidy, and itself, subsidised the Atlantique route, which, when built, subsidised the Nord/Eurostar route, which, in turn, subsidised the Lyon/Cote D'Azur route, which in turn, subsidied the Est route, being built at present, with about 5 more in the pipeline.

Get the picture?

Our lot, under Thatcher, missed the boat then, and we're still nowhere near catching it

Alcazar

KiwiGTI

Most of the time UK railways are functional, but if you commute every day you become less tolerant and when you get the odd occasion where the trains are late/cancelled 3-4 days in a row and you are late for work by hours, that cancels out any goodwill that people ever had for them.

David_Dickson

An Edinburgh guy decided he wanted to go to India for his holidays, but was unsure of how to get there. He went to the station and asked. The guy said he didnt know about that distance, but he could sell him a ticket to York. The guy went to York and asked another Staff member about getting to India. The staff guy didnt know, but said he could seel the guy a ticket to London.
He got to London and asked more employees. They didnt know, but sold him a cross-London ticket. He asked again and was sold anothe ticket to Dover.
This continued all across Europe, untill eventually after weeks of asking people, and short train journeys, he finally got to India.

He had a fantastic holiday there and decided to head home. he asked the guy in the Deli station how he would get back to Edinburgh. The employee asked him if he wanted Edinburgh Waverly station, or Haymarket station.


Yer, ok, its a crap joke that probably wasnt worth the effort of me typing it out or you reading it, but I heard somewhere that although Indias rail system is really ropey mechanically, its one of the best in the word due to the sheer volume of people it successfully carries.

Sith

I'm seeking a job outside London because I am sooo fed up with the trains.

Upto when I stopped using them, I lost count the amount of times they were delayed, cancelled or shortened on my route out of Waterloo.

The Japanese accepted that decent trains were going to cost alot. So they threw the money and said, right lads, make it as good as possible. So they did. And they have the best. I saw a really informative program on the Jap system a couple of months ago.

Suresh

Actually, the reservations system of Indian railways also isn't too shabby, fully computerised and it works too! We travelled around by rail for 3 months on our honeymoon a few years back and don't think we were late once. Ok some of the trains travelled at an average of only 15mph, so that's hardly a surprise.

Indian train catering is wicked too. Piping hot ruby murray and roti served to 800 passengers at their seats.

Suresh

ChrisB

Nice thinking but France has an advantage over us - much more space.

If the Government annouced planes to build a brand new railway on the route (for example) London, Birmingham, Manchester to Glasgow or Edinburgh, the NIMBYs would be having a heart attack. Swampy would be dragged out of retirement to live in some tree for months on end.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

NIMBYs? Know what you mean. They are the reason (well, one of the reasons )that our line is taking so long to build, and has to be in a tunnel for so long.

Unfortunately, the people in France are the opposite: yes you still get those who will live very near any new line, complaining of noise etc, but on the whole, they actually WANT the TGV near them because it brings wealth to the area. The classic case was when they were planning the line from Paris to the tunnel and Brussels.
It was supposed to go via Arras, which is a fairly direct route. The mayor of Lille got involved, pointing out the advantages of Lille and a junction for Brussels, tunnel, Amsterdam etc, and it went that way. Lille has never looked back, it now regards itself as the capital of Europe and the money just keeps on rolling in. The ex-mayor is virtually a saint!

Alcazar

muddy

Ok, The rail width is the same in Europe to here.

It's how we built our bridges and tunnels that's the problem.

In europe their bridges and tunnels are taller so thats how they can build bigger and taller trains (Double deck trains). Hence when your on their trains it feels like there is more room.

Because our bridges and tunnels are built like they are (and cannot possibly be changed) that's why British Train design and shape hasn't changed this century.

Onto European Trains, almost all the European countries are subsidised by their respective goverments. And they can only be built in their country and not contracted out to another country.

When talking about Britains poor trains and comparing them to France etc.
You have got to take into consideration the amount of rail users each country has. The amount of Track each country has, The amount of routes each country has.

You will find that the UK far out strips any other European country with regards to the numbers of people travelling on trains etc.
This makes a massive impact on the rail infrastructure.

Lastly blame our Goverment for completely ignoring the Rail industry for the last 40 years. It's all their fault and nobody else's.

Account deleted by request

Not had chance for a break due to being on SN so much