Need Advice (Law/Police Related)
06 November 2004, 07:13 PM
#31
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Originally Posted by anc-sti
If you purchased online Insurance, check you history files for the day of purchase, assuming you don't delete them. This will help you in your attempts to prove you thought you had taken a policy out. But to be honest the fact you didn't do something after you didn't receive a conformation email means its going to be your liablity me thinks.
06 November 2004, 07:19 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by floods
I have them, never delete history files etc... It's got the pages I filled out the details, but remember the security will be 128BIT, so you won't be able to check the bit where I filled out details and it said I was insured. I recieved an email with the confirmation of my quote etc and my number for usage on the site but i didn't get anything saying i was insured EXCEPT when i was filling it out. I filled it out saw the "congratulations" page and sodded off. But surely this can easily be faked...and How do I prove this to the police or the courts? a screen shot? These things can be messed with surely...so they won't believe me.
06 November 2004, 07:20 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by Beastie
Have you checked that you were not insured on any other policy that you hold? Even a motorcycle insurance may cover you 3rd party for the car you were driving?
06 November 2004, 07:21 PM
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Hows about scanning your current insurance certificate in and doing a little editing to the dates and printing new papers off.
Highly illegal but would the police catch on? If your caught you can plead you were desperate to hold onto your license as you knew you would be banned. It may be worth thinking about!
Did i say that out loud? It may be your best bet, cheat the system!
When i was given a producer, they never phoned up my insurance company to check. Can't see why they'll do it to you.
I bet you've learned a lesson however. You'll know next time to phone and ask for confirmation.
Highly illegal but would the police catch on? If your caught you can plead you were desperate to hold onto your license as you knew you would be banned. It may be worth thinking about!
Did i say that out loud? It may be your best bet, cheat the system!
When i was given a producer, they never phoned up my insurance company to check. Can't see why they'll do it to you.
I bet you've learned a lesson however. You'll know next time to phone and ask for confirmation.
Last edited by Mitchy260; 06 November 2004 at 07:24 PM.
06 November 2004, 07:24 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by Beastie
does it let you drive vehicles that dont belong to you 3rd party only? check smallprint.
perhaps you can see where i am going with this...
perhaps you can see where i am going with this...
06 November 2004, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Mitchy260
Hows about scanning your current insurance certificate in and doing a little editing to the dates and printing new papers off.
Highly illegal but would the police catch on? If your caught you can plead you were desperate to hold onto your license as you knew you would be banned. It may be worth thinking about!
Did i say that out loud? It may be your best bet, cheat the system!
When i was given a producer, they never phoned up my insurance company to check. Can't see why they'll do it to you.
I bet you've learned a lesson however. You'll know next time to phone and ask for confirmation.
Highly illegal but would the police catch on? If your caught you can plead you were desperate to hold onto your license as you knew you would be banned. It may be worth thinking about!
Did i say that out loud? It may be your best bet, cheat the system!
When i was given a producer, they never phoned up my insurance company to check. Can't see why they'll do it to you.
I bet you've learned a lesson however. You'll know next time to phone and ask for confirmation.
And when I was talking to the clerk he was getting confused and said "so you had no insurance on that date?" a couple of times, just clarifying the fact I'm going to get ****ed royally.
06 November 2004, 07:28 PM
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Hows about producing at a different station?
When you produce documents, you go up to the nice little old lady at the desk and she just checks documents, i very much doubt the charging policeman to be there. You can always tell them you were indeed insured after a battle with the insurance company.
Your probably right, by opening your mouth youve probably buggered this idea up.
When you produce documents, you go up to the nice little old lady at the desk and she just checks documents, i very much doubt the charging policeman to be there. You can always tell them you were indeed insured after a battle with the insurance company.
Your probably right, by opening your mouth youve probably buggered this idea up.
Last edited by Mitchy260; 06 November 2004 at 07:30 PM.
06 November 2004, 07:29 PM
#43
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Originally Posted by Mitchy260
Hows about producing at a different station?
Your probably right, by opening your mouth youve probably buggered this idea up.
Your probably right, by opening your mouth youve probably buggered this idea up.
So it will be a totally different station.
However it has on the producer...Forward to station (where the bobby resides.) probably so he can check it and laugh
06 November 2004, 07:30 PM
#44
Only thing you can do is speak to police then and explain your case. IMHO
I very much doubt that your current insurer would issue you a cover note for the period in question as they dont know if you had a serious accident then that you are trying to stick on them. However, if you can find something on your computer that you can send to them you may be in with a chance.
In a similar case with a motorbike that my brother sold, the buyer managed to get an Irish company to issue a cover note for the period he was stopped. However, think we are clutching at straws now.
I very much doubt that your current insurer would issue you a cover note for the period in question as they dont know if you had a serious accident then that you are trying to stick on them. However, if you can find something on your computer that you can send to them you may be in with a chance.
In a similar case with a motorbike that my brother sold, the buyer managed to get an Irish company to issue a cover note for the period he was stopped. However, think we are clutching at straws now.
06 November 2004, 07:32 PM
#45
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Originally Posted by Beastie
In a similar case with a motorbike that my brother sold, the buyer managed to get an Irish company to issue a cover note for the period he was stopped. However, think we are clutching at straws now.
The bobby knows I was not insured, I was telling the truth, and maybe secretly hoping I'd be let off considering I had absolutely no clue I wasn't insured.
06 November 2004, 07:38 PM
#46
Just because you thought you were uninsured when you attended the police station does not mean that you could produce evidence later to the contrary that you didnt realise you had.
I think you have handled the whole situation very honestly and this may hold merit with the police. Good Luck i really feel your predicament.
I think you have handled the whole situation very honestly and this may hold merit with the police. Good Luck i really feel your predicament.
06 November 2004, 09:00 PM
#47
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me begs the question....
why did you get a tug in the first place?????
i had similar, the ins co *******s had noted my phone comments stating i would not be taking the offer etc...
i had to produce for another non legal reason.. after a quick call to find out why i hadnt got my cover note, i found out the above..
i just said, i handnt actually cancelled, and the guy agreed and started my cover as per the day it ran out.........
phew!!!
if you have a copy of the internet pages showing your details entered, the ins co will have to..
just demand they go through there records for that date.. data protection etc...
mart
why did you get a tug in the first place?????
i had similar, the ins co *******s had noted my phone comments stating i would not be taking the offer etc...
i had to produce for another non legal reason.. after a quick call to find out why i hadnt got my cover note, i found out the above..
i just said, i handnt actually cancelled, and the guy agreed and started my cover as per the day it ran out.........
phew!!!
if you have a copy of the internet pages showing your details entered, the ins co will have to..
just demand they go through there records for that date.. data protection etc...
mart
06 November 2004, 10:50 PM
#48
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Hi
I have just been reading these pages and am very, very alarmed at some of the responses. I have worked in Insurance for many years and can say for certain that you must NOT try to falsify any documentation. these days around 95% of documentation is checked with the insurers - not necessarily at the time of producing, but they do check and if you are found to have produced false documents, you will possibly be done for forgery and/or perverting the course of justice - which carries a mandatory jail sentence.
All I can suggest is that as you have been totally honest, stick with this and ask for the case to go to court. You can drive up until the day you attend court but if your renewal is due in this time, you will have to state that you have a prosecution pending.
When in court, produce as much documentation as you can and write down as much as you can remember NOW. Includes names, times etc af any online activity and/or conversations.
Did you check with the bank to see if there was any activity on your account from the insurance co? Also, the insurance co that you were/are insured with - did you not have a current policy with them on another vehicle (if so does this have driving other cars? - although I think this is unlikely if you are a relatively new driver).
If you really, REALLY need the car - such as for work, you may be able to plead your case to just get fined and IN10 plus points but no ban. You need to explain that you need to continue working to pay fine.
Whatever you do, and assuming you do go to court over this, plead guilty - as the facts clearly show that you are "guilty" of the offence as this will go in your favour.
Finally, I would query the reason why you were stopped as I am not aware that police have a way of "scanning the reg plate" to see if the vehicle is insured - I am sure this is not the case. If so, the whole incident could be "vaped" by the courts if the police officer stopped you for no reason?
Good luck
I have just been reading these pages and am very, very alarmed at some of the responses. I have worked in Insurance for many years and can say for certain that you must NOT try to falsify any documentation. these days around 95% of documentation is checked with the insurers - not necessarily at the time of producing, but they do check and if you are found to have produced false documents, you will possibly be done for forgery and/or perverting the course of justice - which carries a mandatory jail sentence.
All I can suggest is that as you have been totally honest, stick with this and ask for the case to go to court. You can drive up until the day you attend court but if your renewal is due in this time, you will have to state that you have a prosecution pending.
When in court, produce as much documentation as you can and write down as much as you can remember NOW. Includes names, times etc af any online activity and/or conversations.
Did you check with the bank to see if there was any activity on your account from the insurance co? Also, the insurance co that you were/are insured with - did you not have a current policy with them on another vehicle (if so does this have driving other cars? - although I think this is unlikely if you are a relatively new driver).
If you really, REALLY need the car - such as for work, you may be able to plead your case to just get fined and IN10 plus points but no ban. You need to explain that you need to continue working to pay fine.
Whatever you do, and assuming you do go to court over this, plead guilty - as the facts clearly show that you are "guilty" of the offence as this will go in your favour.
Finally, I would query the reason why you were stopped as I am not aware that police have a way of "scanning the reg plate" to see if the vehicle is insured - I am sure this is not the case. If so, the whole incident could be "vaped" by the courts if the police officer stopped you for no reason?
Good luck
06 November 2004, 10:57 PM
#49
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The courts hear these stories all day, ever day - I'm afraid that you will get lumped in with those who make these tales up and have the book thrown at you.
Driving without insurance is one of the biggest no-no's with insurance companies ..... and let me tell you, once ONE Ins.Co. doesn't cover you none of the others will either!
It's a sad state of affairs if you are telling the truth and I think you may become a victim of ignorance, but ignorance is no defence - sorry mate!
Pete
Driving without insurance is one of the biggest no-no's with insurance companies ..... and let me tell you, once ONE Ins.Co. doesn't cover you none of the others will either!
It's a sad state of affairs if you are telling the truth and I think you may become a victim of ignorance, but ignorance is no defence - sorry mate!
Pete
Last edited by pslewis; 06 November 2004 at 11:00 PM.
06 November 2004, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by yvette296
Hi
I have just been reading these pages and am very, very alarmed at some of the responses. I have worked in Insurance for many years and can say for certain that you must NOT try to falsify any documentation. these days around 95% of documentation is checked with the insurers - not necessarily at the time of producing, but they do check and if you are found to have produced false documents, you will possibly be done for forgery and/or perverting the course of justice - which carries a mandatory jail sentence.
All I can suggest is that as you have been totally honest, stick with this and ask for the case to go to court. You can drive up until the day you attend court but if your renewal is due in this time, you will have to state that you have a prosecution pending.
When in court, produce as much documentation as you can and write down as much as you can remember NOW. Includes names, times etc af any online activity and/or conversations.
Did you check with the bank to see if there was any activity on your account from the insurance co? Also, the insurance co that you were/are insured with - did you not have a current policy with them on another vehicle (if so does this have driving other cars? - although I think this is unlikely if you are a relatively new driver).
If you really, REALLY need the car - such as for work, you may be able to plead your case to just get fined and IN10 plus points but no ban. You need to explain that you need to continue working to pay fine.
Whatever you do, and assuming you do go to court over this, plead guilty - as the facts clearly show that you are "guilty" of the offence as this will go in your favour.
Finally, I would query the reason why you were stopped as I am not aware that police have a way of "scanning the reg plate" to see if the vehicle is insured - I am sure this is not the case. If so, the whole incident could be "vaped" by the courts if the police officer stopped you for no reason?
Good luck
I have just been reading these pages and am very, very alarmed at some of the responses. I have worked in Insurance for many years and can say for certain that you must NOT try to falsify any documentation. these days around 95% of documentation is checked with the insurers - not necessarily at the time of producing, but they do check and if you are found to have produced false documents, you will possibly be done for forgery and/or perverting the course of justice - which carries a mandatory jail sentence.
All I can suggest is that as you have been totally honest, stick with this and ask for the case to go to court. You can drive up until the day you attend court but if your renewal is due in this time, you will have to state that you have a prosecution pending.
When in court, produce as much documentation as you can and write down as much as you can remember NOW. Includes names, times etc af any online activity and/or conversations.
Did you check with the bank to see if there was any activity on your account from the insurance co? Also, the insurance co that you were/are insured with - did you not have a current policy with them on another vehicle (if so does this have driving other cars? - although I think this is unlikely if you are a relatively new driver).
If you really, REALLY need the car - such as for work, you may be able to plead your case to just get fined and IN10 plus points but no ban. You need to explain that you need to continue working to pay fine.
Whatever you do, and assuming you do go to court over this, plead guilty - as the facts clearly show that you are "guilty" of the offence as this will go in your favour.
Finally, I would query the reason why you were stopped as I am not aware that police have a way of "scanning the reg plate" to see if the vehicle is insured - I am sure this is not the case. If so, the whole incident could be "vaped" by the courts if the police officer stopped you for no reason?
Good luck
I don't feel like saying I'm guilty mate, because in my view I am Not guilty...and I ain't lying to get off a lighter sentence. If I say I'm guilty I get banned...if I say I'm not guilty maybe I get banned, but I keep my dignity.
I am not guilty. I THOUGHT I WAS INSURED. Therefore I AM NOT GUILTY. I Don't intend to be put into the same category as those who don't pay for insruance because I DO pay for insurance, since the day I passed my test I have always done so on the 3 cars I have owned.
As far as I know the police CAN scan a cars registration and check if it is insured. The car appeared from no where and pulled me over and in a matter of seconds he told me I was not insured.
I won't be doing any forging. I will tell the truth all the way upto and including in court. And if I am sent down I will kick and scream like a complete baby, because no way they are taking my license off me when it was the Insurance company who fuct up. I mean really....I am PAYING insurance this very second and they have the cheek to bring me to court? I won't go down without a fight.
06 November 2004, 11:43 PM
#51
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haven't read all the thread, but what if you had crashed into me, breaking my neck and leaving my kids to live in poverty instead of getting stopped and given a producer???
Your story may well be true, but seems incredibly unlikely.
Your story may well be true, but seems incredibly unlikely.
06 November 2004, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
The courts hear these stories all day, ever day - I'm afraid that you will get lumped in with those who make these tales up and have the book thrown at you.
Driving without insurance is one of the biggest no-no's with insurance companies ..... and let me tell you, once ONE Ins.Co. doesn't cover you none of the others will either!
It's a sad state of affairs if you are telling the truth and I think you may become a victim of ignorance, but ignorance is no defence - sorry mate!
Pete
Driving without insurance is one of the biggest no-no's with insurance companies ..... and let me tell you, once ONE Ins.Co. doesn't cover you none of the others will either!
It's a sad state of affairs if you are telling the truth and I think you may become a victim of ignorance, but ignorance is no defence - sorry mate!
Pete
06 November 2004, 11:46 PM
#53
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Originally Posted by fast bloke
haven't read all the thread, but what if you had crashed into me, breaking my neck and leaving my kids to live in poverty instead of getting stopped and given a producer???
Your story may well be true, but seems incredibly unlikely.
Your story may well be true, but seems incredibly unlikely.
06 November 2004, 11:57 PM
#54
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I got insurance from Elephant on Friday morning - They e-mailed me a cover note withing about 30 seconds, with confirmation in the post today. even if it was a genuine mistake, iirc it is an offence to drive while not in possesion of insurance documentation. That is why you get a 14 day cover note before the schedule arrives. unfortunately there is probably not much point in getting a solicitor. The offence is not 'driving while being unintentionally insured.' It is driving while being uninsured, and as you have pointed out, you had no insurance, so you are 100% guilty
06 November 2004, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by fast bloke
I got insurance from Elephant on Friday morning - They e-mailed me a cover note withing about 30 seconds, with confirmation in the post today. even if it was a genuine mistake, iirc it is an offence to drive while not in possesion of insurance documentation. That is why you get a 14 day cover note before the schedule arrives. unfortunately there is probably not much point in getting a solicitor. The offence is not 'driving while being unintentionally insured.' It is driving while being uninsured, and as you have pointed out, you had no insurance, so you are 100% guilty
07 November 2004, 12:00 AM
#56
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And give me a sodding break mate, you telling me you wait for the cert to come through? No one does that, because everyone presumes you are added to the database at the time of you paying online...
07 November 2004, 12:07 AM
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I am not saying you are morally right or morally wrong, but in the eye of the law, you were driving and you did not have any insurance. What would you have done if you had paralysed someone???? Said sorry? That is the view the magistrate will more than likely take. A solicitor might be able to plead extenuating circumstances for you to keep your licence, but that would be a best case scenario
07 November 2004, 12:09 AM
#58
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You are saying that you couldn't POSSIBLY be guilty as you bought Insurance the second you realised you had none ..... that won't wash with the courts as it only proves that you did the legal thing AFTER the event.
Its a hard rains gonna fall - I'm sorry to say!
And if you plead NOT GUILTY, you will end up worse off for wasting the courts time ....... all you can do is offer your story in mitigation and hope they will be lenient - but you ARE guilty!
'Thinking you were legal' is no defence, but a good solicitor could do you wonders!
Good luck!
Pete
Its a hard rains gonna fall - I'm sorry to say!
And if you plead NOT GUILTY, you will end up worse off for wasting the courts time ....... all you can do is offer your story in mitigation and hope they will be lenient - but you ARE guilty!
'Thinking you were legal' is no defence, but a good solicitor could do you wonders!
Good luck!
Pete
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