Dream Weaver

You can say that about anything Senior.

Some folk cant believe the selfish attitude that performance car drivers have with mods, loud exhausts, driving fast etc, other people dont really like people drinking and socialising, others dont like music etc.

You can say that smoking is bad for people around you, but you can say the same about anything else. Driving fast can be bad for other road users, getting festered and being noisy can be bad etc etc

You cant stop everything that is unhealthy/socially unaceptable - you will never please every single person.

Dracoro

Hence we have laws of the road, harassment laws, asbo's, noise limits depending on time of day etc. Why not a law for smoking.

Senior_AP

Do you blame me? I cannot believe there is any debate on the issue.

It SHOULD be banned in public places. Period.

Alcohol only (from a health point of view) affects the person consuming it, cigarettes on the other hand is the single most vile/anti-social thing one can do in public.

Remind me to fart in peoples faces....or is that wrong perhaps??? Hmm.

Senior_AP

Exactly, and also justifying something based on something elses merits is not valid.

"Oooohh cannabis isn't as bad for you as nicotine" - YEAH, BUT IT'S STILL F$CKING BAD FOR YOU !!!

davegtt

exactly, there are laws on stuff like speeding and if u break them your punished for it. smoking directly effects my health so Im glad its banned in public places, might live an extra few years now

cant see what the problem is, its not like they are saying u cant have a *** when you feel like it, they are just preventing you from intoxicating others who my occupy the same table/bar/pub etc

Senior_AP

Davegtt - thank you!!!!!!! Sense at last.

davegtt

no worries, Im suprised at the amount of people throwing their toys out of their prams now they cant contribute to somebodys death

Dream Weaver

There are laws, exactly. Driving is not banned, its just has set rules.

So why not have smoking and no-smoking areas, completely separate, rather than just ban one group? They have this in my local and it works well, even though the no-smoking room is usually either quiet, or full of geeks.

I WANT the ban, smoking is bad for you and stinks, and it will help me to give up, I just dont agree with how they are proposing to do it- "here, buy some £5 **** and give the gov't 80% in tax, but dont smoke them when you're on a night out in the pub, or on the street"

Jap2Scrap

For the record (AGAIN) I have no problem whatsoever regarding the law. I have a problem with holier-than-thou attitudes.

End of.

Senior_AP

It's called progress. There are many issues in this world but we cannot tackle all at the single same time.

Smoking is an obvious and blatant issue that is fairly clean cut.

Start there then we can make laws against other issues afterwards. Something has to come first and I think smoking in publkic is an excellent place to start.

Senior_AP

Ditto. So me not wanting to breathe in this ****e is holier than thou???

Or was that aimed at someone else? If so, I apologise.

Senior_AP

Clean cut isn't it.

Selfish *******.

Dream Weaver

Nobody really gets the point do they???

I smoke, but smoking should be banned and made illegal, i'm well up for that. What the gov't are proposing is just plain wrong.

They dont mind smokers sat at home, smoking themselves to death as it provides lots of dosh for the NHS, which is what allows you to go to a GP or hospital, but they dont want you to smoke in public.

So they are basically saying "its bad for you, smelly, and nobody wants you to smoke", then they metaphorically place a hand over their collective gov't mouth and whisper "but please continue to smoke at home on your own cos the revenue is great".

Its just plain wrong, they should just make it illegal full stop, I'd love to see what happened then.

Senior_AP

What the govenment is proposing is a compromise.

No smoking in public (E.g. affecting others). However keep it in your own home and it becomes your decision.

Making it illegal will cause uproar - and will promote blackmarkets etc etc.

I don't care if people smoke - I'm sure we're all capable to choose whether we do or not but as I don't - I don't wanna be forced to breathe the ****.

davegtt

I think you'll find thats what theyve done.

Smoking area = in your home or outside

Non smoking area = nowhere in pubic places where people might be eating or something etc.

logiclee

They have bottled it.

There should have been a total ban in public places.

Senior_AP

Or simply having it blown in your face/loitering towards you etc.

<vomit>

Senior_AP

Agreed.

Gotta think of those votes though!!!

Dream Weaver

Its still taking choice away though. I understand your point, as even I dont particularly enjoy smokey pubs etc, but lets say a guy wants to open a smoking bar, where only smokers are allowed to go and smoke/drink.

You (as a non-smoker) dont *have* to visit that establishment, but smokers could if they want, yet he wont be allowed to do it. Bar owners (in particular) should be given a choice to opt as a smoking place, or no smoking place - that would then give everyone the choice they want - smokers could visit the smoking bars, and vice versa, problem solved!!

Senior_AP

As long as other peoples peasant habits don't affect my health I honestly couldn't give a flying **** what they do.

lem0ncurd

Just a few interesting facts about smoking in the UK:

- The UK Government should raise £8.9bn from tobacco duty a year.
- More than 12 million adults in the UK smoke cigarettes, roughly 28% of men and 26% of women.
- There are wide differences between the different socio-economic groups; only 16% of men and 12% of women in professional groupings smoke compared with 40% of men and 34% of women in the unskilled, manual categories.
- Smoking is highest among those aged 20-24, 38% of women and 40% of men in this age group smoke.
- About 450 children start smoking every day.
- 30% of the UK's 15-year-olds are regular smokers. Teenage smoking, particularly among young girls, is the one area where statistics appear to be on the increase.
- One in four smokers who continue to smoke will die before they reach 65.
- In 1995 more than 28% of all deaths between 35 and 65 were estimated to be as a result of smoking.
- A 35-year-old man who smokes can expect to die more than seven years earlier than a man who has never smoked, while women can expect to die six years earlier than non-smoking women.
- About 50 million working days are lost as a result of smoking-related illnesses.
- Smoking kills more than 90% of lung cancer patients.
- Tobacco smoke contains over 4,000 chemicals.

super_si

next they'll be banning all the drunks from pubs and clubs eh

Senior_AP

"...compared with 40% of men and 34% of women in the unskilled, manual categories".

lol.

Senior_AP

Unless they start a fight, drinking affects nobodies health except their own.

Dracoro

And, in this case, rightly so. Burglary being illegal is taking away the civilians choice of whether or not to nick someones stuff. There are some choices that it's good not to have.

darts_aint_sport

I kinda agree on this, but the problem is that this is what we already have, and it isn't working. Pubs can voluntarily impose a no-smoking ban but they believe it will be at detriment to their profits (regardless of patron's and workers health), so it wouldn't work.

It's nanny state because we need nannying and can't look after ourselves properly.

Dracoro

The ban (however lightly enforced) for this is already in place. It's illegal to sell alcohol in pubs/clubs to someone who is drunk, I kid you not.

Senior_AP

Exactly. There are alot of incapable thicko's.

darts_aint_sport

Lol! Word on the street is that it's illegal to do over 70 on a motorway too! Those jokers!

Jerome

I think many people have missed the fact that this proposal is to ban smoking in bars (as well as other places) that sell prepared food - not all pubs. At least then smokers and non-smokers, not to mention the landlords themselves, have a choice.

I am quite happy about smoking being banned from just about anywhere in public except dedicated sections of bars.