RJMS

iTrader: (2)

That's exactly what does happen on one of the roads near me (see the opening post) - it is about 2 miles long and on a couple of occasions in the morning rush hour recently it may as well have been a single carriageway !

Bubba po

In my view, merging should be done in a way that doesn't wind up other drivers. Courteous, forward thinkers merge early, say, within 25-50 metres of the point where you simply [have] to merge. If I have got into the correct lane early (left-lane etiquette, as it is taught in modern driving lessons), I have no problem with letting in people who use the right -hand lane but who are making an attempt to merge before the cutoff point. My gripe is with those drivers who override all the courteous behaviour of other drivers in the situation, drive right up to the merge point as fast as they can, then try to bully their way in. Whichever way you look at it, this way of driving is going to make people bristle.

Diesel

All this 'it's OK' chat seems to be all about 'concept' rather than our individual journey reality... If letting in a sucession of 'queue jumpers' is going to make me an additional ten minutes later than I would have been anyway, then screw you!

We all need to merge reasonably and as advised early enough by the start of the lane closure signs - that is what the countdown signs are all about. If you are still there trying to 'stuff' through and 'gain ground' at 400 & 200 yards forget it, unless you pick on a granny or a mobile phone chatterer of course and nip in smartly (guilty!)!

Selfishness mixed with the impacience of youth will NOT be rewarded; merging courteously and timely will. Hey I might even flash you in at 600yds (that's if I've already moved in myself by then and I too am not chancing it..)

Some of the arguments put forward here are on par with the balloney spouted by the government about speed cameras. You just cant pull the wool guys & I think my approach is basic UK human nature & our traffic reality? By all means start a pressure group and a website, but, till then...

D

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

Diesel

You're right to an extent - but what would you do in the situation I found myself in, overtake 1.75 miles - say 2800m - maybe 300-400 cars until you reach the point (not marked on this particular road) 200-400 metres from the end and then attempt to merge. You're still going to be looked on as a "queue jumper" whiuch you are of course. The alternative is to join the queue at the beginning and hence make the problem even worse.

It's been an interesting discussion and the thought of a "pressure group" is an interesting one - I was going to write to the DOT or whatever officialdom could comment on this asking for their views, IMO it's more of a problem than "middle lane hoggers" - at least in terms of the stress levels and potential road-rage generated.

RJMS

BTW Does "Some of the arguments put forward here are on par with the balloney spouted by the government about speed cameras." refer to my contributions if so which ones - I'd love to know!

Diesel

I just think that after the usual 800 yd sign you should at least consider merging mate... That's all.

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

Positively my last post on this one (for tonight) - this is not road works - just a stretch of dual carriageway on a mostly single carriageway road, the dual carriageway section is significantly slower than the single carriage bits - how can this be acceptable!

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Roadspace is there to be used - use it

Any ****** that goes out of his way to NOT let you in - feckhim

If you are polite and "reasonable" then there is no reason why it shouldn't be a painless exercise & allow people to progress in a reasonable way.

Anyhow, what you give me, you get back in spades

Leslie

It is bad manners to jump the queue, it also means that the ones who formed an orderly queue get unfairly delayed by those who dont merge early. The single lane will only pass so many cars of course-not a double line. Those who jump the queue are taking an unfair advantage.

It is an old driving convention at a junction with queues on each of the seperate roads to allow merging one for one and this is a different situation.

Les

Diesel

What's your method Puff - do you isolate a pensioner in a Micra at 200yds, stare her out and then barge left whilst ripping a few cones up???

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

OK it's a different situation but wouldn't it be more sensible to apply the same convention?

Leslie

Not when it causes extra delay for those who were responsible enough to form a queue before reaching the restriction.

Les

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

What about if everyone was responsible enough to form two queues that merged properly - feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall on this but what the hell!!

Dracoro

OK OK OK. To all those that don't like 'queue jumpers', please inform me at WHAT POINT does the road stop being a 2 lane road and become one? At the cones? If so use both lanes up to near the cones. Or is it 500 yds back? 1000? 5 miles? WHAT??? If everyone never passed on the outside lane then then the 'queue' could go back 5 miles with a 5 mile clear lane on the outside. This is what causes more tailbacks. Why overtake either on the roads, is this not 'queue jumping' too? NO, all it is is people making swifter progress than you.

I can just imagine you travelling in rush hour on the tubes in London. Would you adhere to the 'queue' mentality then? Of course not (you'd never get to where you are going!). Also, do you take the longest queue in the supermarket? Of course you don't, you take the shortest you see.

The fairest way is for EVERYONE to use BOTH lanes and merge in turn safely before the lane shuts off. Personally I like the previous suggestion that the cones should not favour one lane or the other. i.e. 2 lanes merge into 1 rather than lane 2 merging into lane 1.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter 'too' much whether you join the queue early or late but to get cheesed off with others wanting to make better progress is silly.

scatter_wrx

Had a situation the other day where I was in the left lane of a short queue to merge into one lane. The car in front decided to move out into the second lane to block anyone getting past. As I was bored I decided to zip up the inside so the car ended up in the "dreaded" outside lane. Don't think they saw the funny side.

Jap2Scrap

The thing is, the law states you have to give way to overtaking traffic, therefore if I'm coming down the outside lane and indicate to merge (be it 800yds or 80yds) you HAVE to give way by law.

ajm

Why not use massive "MERGE IN TURN" flashing illuminated signs (for the less observant motorists ) as the road necks into one lane and have "USE BOTH LANES" signs stretching back at least 1/4 before where the queue starts? The message should hit home then!

druddle

I used to travel from Thurrock to Benfleet down the A13 every day. In the evenings, this was particularly busy because the Pitsea flyover was being resurfaced, which meant the A13 went from 2 lanes to 1.

The right hand lane was always used by me and many many others every day right up until it merged with the left hand lane, and the traffic always kept moving in both lanes (maybe very slowly sometimes though !!). The point is, the traffic was kept moving, everyone mergied in turn and no one got wound up about it (that I saw). The only time the traffic was jammed there was when a lorry was straddling both lanes to stop people "queue jumping". This made the jam far worse further back.

At the end of the day, as has been mentioned, cool down, chill out and dont get wound up about it. There are far too many better things to focus your energy on.

Dave

Diesel

Looks like it’s Leslie and Diesel v impatient queue jumpers with false hopes of merging in turn being the actual UK reality (catchy ehh!)



Dracoro asked

may I refer the learned gentlemen to my previous answer I am very happy for this to become law if the merge in turn suggestion fails (good luck with that btw – its a nice concept )



Until we meet at the cones bye for now

D

Drunken Bungle Whore

Roadworks aren't everywhere (although it seems like they are sometimes). The REALLY annoying people are the ones on busy motorways who decide that rather than join the queue for their exit in the left hand land they queue jump in the next lane before having to practially stop to jump in where they need to thereby forcing people to break hard and swerve suddenly behind them and causing a traffic queue in 2 or 3 lanes instead of just the one!

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

Diesel

Try this

http://www.iam.org.uk/Pressroom/News...ve/nr0115.html

Just spoken to the author of this piece and found out what has occured since then - will be emailing various Agencies that the proposal was passed onto to investigate further.

Diesel

Interesting link mate, and pretty definitive I think (and me a member too).

DaveD

iTrader: (2)

I remember my daily treck round the Derby ring road. There are several places where the road merges from 3 to 2 lanes and 2 to 1 lane shortly after traffic lights.

You couldn't win.

If you took the nearside lane cars would try and barge in from the right, and if you took the right hand lane cars on the left wouldn't let you in!!!
This was all while trying the 'merge in turn' rule - ie; I was only wanting to let one car in front of me from the right, or, I was trying to create a gap to the left between two cars in the LH lane.

It was only on the rare occasion that I was at the front of the queue at the lights that I could get ahead of all the traffic and avoid all the arguments.....

andypugh2000

Let me throw my piece into this, now there has been talk for many years about trucks being confined to the nearside lane only of motorways/dual carriageways to help traffic flow, now these trucks take up four times more carriageway than your *average* car, lets say that there was a two lane carriageway and all the trucks confined to the inside lane (100's of them) stayed there and all the *queue jumpers* stayed in the outside lane and every body merged in turn when it came to the roadworks.

The truck lane would move four times faster than the car lane but it would still be fair, but I bet how many of you lot who jump queues would try and jump into the truck lane instead of waitng like most of us do most of the time then we have to put up with the likes of you being impatient ********.

andy

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

Sorry Andy - one hole in your theory - it assumes that the entire inside lane would be made up of trucks - I know there are a lot of them on the road but not I'm afraid 1 for every 4 cars - unless of course cars were to be banned from the inside lane. I would also like to point out that I - and probably a lot of the other people who you label "queue jumpers" are only expressing an opinion that things could and should work better than the ridiculous situations that occur at the moment. If you have looked at the link in my previous post you will see that the IAM have the same view.

andypugh2000

Yeah but what does that prove, advanced driving doesnt make you a better driver just more arguementative over points like this as they think they are know alls

I wonder how many WRC drivers have advanced certificates

Dracoro

You can be a very fast track driver but still a crap road driver. A lot of road driving skills is inherent in ones attitude. WRC etc just requires you to be the fastest.

Leslie

The basic point is that those who are in the left hand queue arrived first so it is unfair for others to go down the right hand lane to jump in front of them and causing them to be further delayed. Just a matter of good manners and fair behaviour all round. If you feel you have to go through life walking over others and taking advantage of them, that is down to you but nothing to be proud about really.

Les

skiddus_markus

Have seen 2 examples of this lately.First is off J31 of the M1 heading towards Anston.Two lanes merge into one with plenty of warning.A woman in a Laguna pulled out of the left hand lane in front of me in the right but we both still had time to get past a Citroen Plumbers van.He decided she wasn't coming past and violently swerved without indicating right towards her as she was drawing level with him.She stamped on the brakes and swerved to the right,narrowly missing the central reservation.God knows how they didn't collide.
Second was today on the A38 in Derby near the Mackworth turnoff and McDonalds.The lanes went briefly down to one and it looked like a van and 4x4 didn't make it across into the left hand lane in time as the 4x4 was embedded in the van's rear chassis with a fire engine attending.

RJMS

iTrader: (2)

OK - I know I'm going to regret this but had the following from the DSA (Driving Standards Agency) today ....

"Thank you for your e-mail regarding merging in turn, if has been forwarded to me for reply.

The link that you provided is referring to Zip merging. There is no current official view on this. There are questions in the current Highway Code consultation document, but it is not up to DSA to decide what goes in the code. We submit comments from the public, and other interested parties which are then looked at and assessed by those who have the relevant spheres of expertise on particular issues. However, the final say is down to the Department for Transport and we have to comply with their decisions.

If you wish to submit comments for consultation regarding this subject, forward your comments to Karen Lees at DSA's publications unit at:

Driving Standards Agency
Publications Unit
Paul Waller Avenue
Cardington
BEDFORD
MK44 3ST

or e-mail karen.lees@dsa.gsi.gov.uk"

Love the bit about "there being no official view" and there does seem to be a certain amount of buck-passing going on