RB5_245

That's fair enough, I do understand the need for torque in a luxury barge. However for what I want the car for I can't get a lighter one than the impreza, which with some time and effort could get down to 1150kgs I hope (i still want an interior ).

As a starting point 1500 is just too much, and the extra power/low down torque isn't going to make it match up to the impreza for what I want, which is a target going of 400bhp.

When the 300zx has enough power to match that, it's going to be difficult putting it down through the back wheels.

I'd have to say the zx is the poorer performer here. However it's an unfair comparison I think when looking at my point of view of using the stock car as a base to be improved upon, rather than just leaving it be. They're obviously 2 cars designed for completely different things.

Back to the original point, I'd still say the mitsi GTO is the better car (although I don't like the driving position). My personal preferance would be the newer supra, although it's really too expensive to compare to these two.

Anyway, what a ramble... and way off topic now. Sorry!

Dave

CC

Mine had no probs putting the power down 255's on the back and some people go wider. It's a very well balanced car imo.

Cosworth427

And 2 litres is too small for 1230 kg car. That's 610 kg+ per litre. Too much weight for displacement capacity.

The 300ZX is 520 kg per litre, the potential power-to-weight is still higher, power per PSI of boost is higher, and there will be more usable power off-boost for drivability.

Acceleration wise, the ZX will always be quicker than the Impreza given equal set ups. And that the 4WD loses more power, which would widen the performance gap against the Impreza's favour.

You have completely mis-applied the advantages of a smaller engine, lighter car theory. Leave it for small race tracks where packaging and chassis balance is more important than raw power.

The Impreza doesn't compare to the 300zx, it's a budget performance saloon, unless extensive work is done, it will perform and behave like one.

SteA

Horses for courses and all that.......

Even a milldy modded 300 zx can be very very quick once rolling

Scooby's are very good at what they do, but dont do the same thing as the 300zx

fatherpierre

I once owned a tweaked (330bhp - fly) MR2T and was taken all the way by one of these (to 110). Turned out that it was a fettled example, but my Mr2 was quicker (moving) than my brother's P1, by a good length. Yet the Supra realed me in and went passed.

Not motors to laugh at (if improved) as they can put out serious power. The one that gave me a go had 400bhp (claimed) but was like your clean, normal version.

RB5_245

I really don't understand how you think. From my perspective it's like trying to compare a horse to a snowflake

Dave

john banks

Weight per litre of displacement tells you a lot about the overall potential power band and driveability. It is OK saying use the gearbox, but you end up leaving it in too low a gear for noise and economy just for the possibility that you'll get a gap that you know your peak power can exploit but you need to get up the revs and leave yourself plenty of space as a safety margin. 516 lbft at 2650 RPM such as an AMG 5.4 supercharged engine does with complete manners and refinement, and goes on to nearly 500 BHP at over 6000 RPM is the meaning of powerband IMHO. A new shape WRX has about double the weight to carry per unit of displacement and has a comparably crap power band, when you modify a 2.0 up to say 400 BHP to keep up with the AMG the power band is ghastly IMHO. Prices and running costs are different, but that isn't the comparison here. The only way the smaller, budget 4 cylinder tarted up econobox engine wins is because of weight and weight distribution. It doesn't win on throttle response, reliability, power band, smoothness etc.

RB5_245

I do see the point being made, and I know myself how annoying it is sometimes when you want to go for a gap in the town, or drop to 3rd to overtake from 60 (granted that's not a problem with the TD04). But this is the only occasions when this has ever bothered me. I find from 3200 changing at 6000rpm is a fine powerband to keep me in the right gear most of the time and with a 7.5k rev limit there's an extra 1500revs to play with should you need it (which I find I hardly ever do).

If i'm going quick, i'm in the right rev range, if i'm in a high gear out off boost i don't want to go quick. The trade off between making gaps in traffic and lazy overtaking if one i quite happily accept against the added weight.

As for the Merc, who really wants to drive there favorite B road from 30-150mph in 5th gear, or 6th or 7th depending on how many thay have these days

I can't really see somone saying 'what shall I have hmmm.... amg or sti'

However someone could easily be considering an sti 3 or a 300zx. with this imho anyone wanting a drivers car would have to go for the impreza and someone happy with something a bit softer for a-roads and motorways would prefer the zx.

Engine size vs weight seems to be more a measure of driver lazyness (to a point as I don't think I'd like a bigger turbo on my car regardless of extra power).

The ideal for me is a car, as light as possible and that you can alway be in the right gear if you choose, with a 1000+ rpm to spare at any time from the red line when pushing on.

I think impreza's manage this very well at around 400bhp on tight roads say 40-90mph corners (where I'm happyest)..... Oh S*** i'm rambling on again

Well I certainly can't praise the amount of turbo lag you get at that sort of power, but if I had about 450bhp with the same balance and throttle response of an n/a car i doubt i'd ever change my car again.

I'll shut up now.....

john banks

You say your power band starts at 3200 RPM, but unless you have a very small turbo, it won't do that in 2nd gear I don't think?

AMG or STi/Evo would be a comparison.... if you want something fast that would be a nice daily driver you could take a new STi/Evo and modify it to go like the AMG but throw its weight around better, or you could buy a 2 year old E55. Used 996TT is still a bit expensive, 993TT is a bit old. Not a lot else I can think of that is daily driver practical, reasonably new and has exciting acceleration.

Cosworth427

I think you're factoring in the problem of weight for the wrong reasons.

If you want to go fast in just a Scooby, then by all means that is your choice. But by logic, the 300ZX has far more potential performance. The extra 1 litre displacement, and good aftermarket support places it in another league.

RB5_245

True john it's a bit out of the range in 2nd but this is only really an issue through an extremely tight corner, and i'll admit to using first round the town as 2nd will barely pull you up a hill at low revs.

Anyway since all of the above will remain out of my price range for a good while, i'll just get saving for the old ej25 and keep the blinkers on until then

john banks

EJ25 in a classic gives you similar cc/kg ratio to a 300ZX or Supe though

Shame it isn't tough.

RB5_245

Yours is still going isn't it? how many miles on that now?

john banks

Yes, about 6000 miles, but I am running it pretty tame at about 400 BHP/380 lbft most of the time, with a turbo that is comfortably large enough for it.