Adam M

well, inlet temps being monitored at full boost on the road have been ambient or lower.

In traffic, because of the position of the sensor I can get a little bit of heat soak from the rad in the inlet pipe (steel one fed directly into throttle body). This doesn't always disappear, even on cruise.

The second I run any boost intake temps drop to ambient or below, regardless of outside air temp.

I am not talking about dynos or rolling roads, and I am not talking about the effects of fmic vs tmic, which I happent o think you have a point about.

I am talking purely cooling power hear.

The shortest pipes possible for a fmic is what the lateral kit allows whilst providing incredible cooling, I don't think you can contest that.

Much as I thought your kit was innovative simple and very clever, as I said, it was painfully hot to the touch after you had come to a stop immediately after your runs.

Heat soak is an issue therefore surely?

In driving my car I notice some turbo lag due to the turbo being fairly large, this will soon change and then I will be a little more able to comment on pressurisation lag, but that will be dependent on the volume of the core, which is directly related (though not exclusively) to its cooling capacity.

Yours iirc did have some fairly long convoluted pipes with some sharp bends in it in order to connect to the turbo. Surely that has some downsides?

Unless you are doing like for like controlled experiments, your times alone are not enough to disparage an alternative idea.

If that were the case then the 8 second cars in aus would make your theories substantially inferior surely?

Andy.F

Adam

I am confused as to where you get this "painfully hot to the touch" from ? During testing it never got beyond luke warm and I can assure you the testing was much more intense than a 10 second drag run !!
If it had been parked up for a while then there would be heat soak for sure but 30 seconds after the fans go on its cold again.
It really makes me laugh that Trouts relatively poor times at York were blamed on his front mount intercoolers heat soak ! and I was deemed by his supporters to have an advantage there with my top mount

As I said earlier, I'm not saying its better. I was only taking issue with Conrads quote "Theres only one choice for a classic" which is clearly b0llocks especially as the car in question is a MY00. Coulty however has a point re fmic on a pre 96 which has limited space for a tmic.

Andy

scoobyDAZZA

decided to go for the hyperflow over the APS cuz it includes the Y alloy thing underneath
£590 + vat

someone mentioned the 'pace' fm with radiator and 2 fans
i did like the look of that but everyone on here reckons theyre sh1te
but then again someone said it was over 400 bhp,lol.
i only want a measly 325 ish lol

black_scooby

Where are you getting the Hyperflow from if you don't mind me asking, was thinking about an AVO one myself £650 all in

Cheers Lee

T-uk

do calder not run a pace set up?

Bats-Wrx

iTrader: (1)

Yes but the core was replaced with a rs500 core iirc.

madou

Thank you for your response, confirms what I had read on bbs.22b.com, unfortunate, because otherwise this seems to be a very good product

Perhaps direct from Hyperflow http://www.hyperflow.com.au/1wrxtop.htm

Local distributor JW Racing does not list pricing on Hyperflow for some reason http://www.j-w-racing.co.uk/acatalog/Intercoolers.html

scoobyDAZZA

yeah m8
jamie will most probably supplying it

scoobyDAZZA

this is the 1 http://www.hyperflow.com.au/1images/...C/proshot7.jpg

will my dump-valve fit straight on to it ?
probably a stoopid question ,lol .

at the moment ive got a baileys vta which does mount straight onto the standard intercooler , , it looks like it will but want to be 100% sure
daz

black_scooby

Just got a quote from AVO aus £467 delivered may be less, even if i have to pay duty still a good price, this is for a MY93 though

Adam M

Andy,

I guess it must have been post run but pre the fans having time to do their stuff.

It wasn't me who burned his fingers it was mark when he was standing next to me, I was a mere observer, he could have been teasing, but I got the impression he was serious. Never thought to ask him to confirm it was true, but I suspect you aren't worried anyway.

Am not having a go, you know I was interested on the day and I thought it was a good idea to try something new. I dismissed it because I wasn't too happy about the resiliance to heat soak and sustained performance on track. I am sure it would be great for quarter mile runs, but lap after lap at 500bhp sitting just above the engine makes me worry.

In my attempt to combat lag, I would rather go for a smaller turbo and antilag.

I do agree with your complaint on what conrad wrote, I don't believe a fmic is the only or best solution by any means.

Razor2001

HI all,

What type of TMIC does Andy F have and what makes his special...i.e. what type of fans does he have and where can we get them ?

Cheers,
Ray

JIM THEO

APS TMIC is Hyperflow made and they are almost same size/shape, Hyperflow though has less pressure drop 0,27psi contrary to 0,3psi of the APS one.
APS: 20" x 7.5" x 4.5"
Hyperflow: 19.3" x 7.3" x 4.5"
JIM

Adam M

andy's is custom and certainly not available off the shelf.

It is huge and requires removal of the duct under the classic bonnet.

It is based on two separate transverse flowing pace cores which feed together down the centre line and then out the middle into the throttle body.

The feed from the turbo is split very soon after the exit and then each half is fed into a corner of a respective pace core.

This is all from memory, so no doubt I have it slightly wrong, but I am sure andy will me straight when he sees this.

Certainly innovative and original and no questioning its size! I still would rather avoid heat soak at all costs, but andy prefers the reduced pressurisation lag associated with shorter pipework.

He has a point but as soon as you start increasing core volume anyway, which he certainly has, pressurisation lag will always increase, on top of that the effect will be less noticable the bigger the turbo you run.

The Fixer

Andy, I still say the Lateral kit is the best FMIC for a classic in terms of cost / fit / performance compared with the other FMIC options on the market.

Is your top mount intercooler in production yet?

The Fixer

Only time will tell

Is that what the wife keeps telling you? lol

Andy.F

If you are building a 900bhp engine like you have allegedly been doing for the last year or so then I'd agree it is probably the best on offer .... but for the guy on this thread wanting circa 325bhp its a bit steep IMHO.

My intercooler will never be in production, you seem to misunderstand me here, unlike some others I'm not touting for business !

Andy

The Fixer

Andy, FYI engine is built. You are quite correct in that it has taken a year but I'm overseas on other business most of the time so I dont get the time to play in my garage every night. As for its power potential, who knows, its not going on the engine dyno so I guess we'll never know.

For circa 325hp I would be fitting an STi 7 / 8 top mount

Andy.F

OMG we agree on something

The Fixer

LOL I didnt think that we had many disagreements

Seriously, if someone came up with a good topmount that could handle the big power engines and keep inlet temps down then they would be onto a winner for sure! Get your TMIC into production

Conrad

theotherphil

The AVOTurbo I/C also includes the Alloy Y piece. Speak to Jaime regarding the TMIC and prices. I called asking for a Hyperflow and he told me about the AVO Turbo I/C which wasn't even on his website site.

JIM THEO

AVO has only one air feed under the I/C while almost all other brands have the standard type "Y" hose.
I didn't say that isn't good - I don't know it in every case - but in a big test from Autospeed MRT I/C gained some more points due to better/bigger "Y" hose design that flows much better than others.
I am sure if AVO is Australian made uses also Hyperflow cores as TurboXS does.
JIM

theotherphil

Yeah, I had the single alloy pipe from the turbo to the I/C. I assumed this was because I have the early model classic (MY95) and there is a distinct lack of space for anything larger. I am unsure if the later model I/C has the Y shape pipe or the single entry like the earlier model.

TBH though, for the power level dazza is looking for (325BHP), I am sure that the AVO I/C would easily cope and would save ~£300 over the MRT item. It all depends on what mods are planned for the future when deciding if the slightly better performing MRT is worth the extra cash.

David_Wallis

andys intercooler required adjustments to the car that only us two would consider iirc..

it also isnt on a std fit turbo iirc.

none the less its working ok. my problem isnt charge temp its water temp..

Need some thin cheap fans.. ideas?

David

Andy.F

Move the radiator to that big hole where the boot floor used to be

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

What have the extra weight of all that water?

Andy.F

Microbore plumbing

scoobyDAZZA

**** , ,wot have i started lol
nope,going for the hyperflow , , the aps 1 comes with the alloy Y piece for an extra £170 ish , , , so,in theory its dearer than the hyperflow
considered the sti 7 or 8 tm but been told its a pain to fit , whereas the hyperflow or aps fits straight on
innit ;-)

keep going andy and conrad lol

stevey

iTrader: (2)

what's the new pace charge cooler like seems ok on the spec sheet (from them though)

Adam M

if its as bad as their front mount, i wound't bother.

actually that is unfair, if it is as behind the competition for the money, then I wouldn't bother.