What the **** is wrong with 22b.com?
09 April 2005 | 09:09 PM
#31
Scooby Regular
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,316
Likes: 2
From: home
Shaun,
Just get on with it. If you are open with the facts there can be no conflict of interest. So far you have been very cagey with the facts WRT suppliers and their contributions, to me that suggests you are not sure what people on the whole would think if you actually came out with the facts.
If it is a commercial project using a private car (and they happen all the time) then so be it, I can understand you can't necessarily donate your car to SN Ltd or have SN Ltd buy a car for you.
Like I said a while ago, I wait to proven wrong.
Paul
Just get on with it. If you are open with the facts there can be no conflict of interest. So far you have been very cagey with the facts WRT suppliers and their contributions, to me that suggests you are not sure what people on the whole would think if you actually came out with the facts.
If it is a commercial project using a private car (and they happen all the time) then so be it, I can understand you can't necessarily donate your car to SN Ltd or have SN Ltd buy a car for you.
Like I said a while ago, I wait to proven wrong.
Paul
09 April 2005 | 10:37 PM
#32
Dave-Ol. It is a pitty you only have two posts. Some might agree with your sentiments, at least in part but when your previous post, referring to "What the **** is up with 22b" had this to say:
I hope you are not another one of these sad persons hiding behind an internet name.
I just dispise weak and sad characters like this. Most of them would dribble in their pants if you tried to talk to...
10 April 2005 | 12:09 AM
#34
Scooby Regular
Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by R19KET
Dave,
Personally, I find some of your comments, rude, and insulting, but you are entitled to your opinion, and you have given it.
However, I think you're missing the point. When Shaun posted his/Scoobynets intention to have a project car, based on the threads content, some people were very dubious about the integrity of the project, with regards to it being unbiased.
I think it is more than reasonable to question these things, because information that is posted on Scoobynet is enormously influential.
However, when questions are asked, these people get berated for asking them, and then the thread gets locked !
You've obviously read the thread on 22b.com, so I'd be interested to hear your comments about the integrity of the "Scoobynet Project", when this ahs been posted.
Shaun chose to ignore it !
Mark.
Personally, I find some of your comments, rude, and insulting, but you are entitled to your opinion, and you have given it.
However, I think you're missing the point. When Shaun posted his/Scoobynets intention to have a project car, based on the threads content, some people were very dubious about the integrity of the project, with regards to it being unbiased.
I think it is more than reasonable to question these things, because information that is posted on Scoobynet is enormously influential.
However, when questions are asked, these people get berated for asking them, and then the thread gets locked !
You've obviously read the thread on 22b.com, so I'd be interested to hear your comments about the integrity of the "Scoobynet Project", when this ahs been posted.
Shaun chose to ignore it !
Mark.
Clearly he didnt choose to ignore it, as I have been receiving PM's. It would appear that I was told "in confidence" and seem to have broken this, not deliberate I might add as this was some time ago and we all have limited PM capabillities so I didnt have the PM to refer to
. Never the less the content was correct and I stand buy it no matter what is said via PM. 
Conrad
PS Harvey, I also noticed Dave Ol also ended his first ever post in a very familiar way to some PM's I recently read.
10 April 2005 | 01:16 AM
#35
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: ECU Mapping - www.JollyGreenMonster.co.uk
Mark (R19KET) is spot on imho!
David,
I like the idea.. do you think he is really in Canada or did he just say it for this very reason?? humm.. long weekend BREAK in Canada anyway?
Simon_
David,
I like the idea.. do you think he is really in Canada or did he just say it for this very reason?? humm.. long weekend BREAK in Canada anyway?
Simon_
10 April 2005 | 04:12 AM
#39
Orange Club
Joined: Oct 1998
Posts: 13,763
Likes: 1
I am dissapointed to see the same people causing the same problems as usual.
Dave. Thank you for complying with our reasonable request to refrain from posting attacks on here.
I am now making the same request to everyone else. ScoobyNet is not the place for attacks and negativity of this kind. I hope you will respect this.
Regards,
webmaster
Dave. Thank you for complying with our reasonable request to refrain from posting attacks on here.
I am now making the same request to everyone else. ScoobyNet is not the place for attacks and negativity of this kind. I hope you will respect this.
Regards,
webmaster
10 April 2005 | 09:39 AM
#40
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 11,217
Likes: 0
From: Does it matter?
Personally, I really don't see what all the fuss is about.
I do think it's a shame that all these topics seem to end up in bickering
I was around when this all kicked off the first time round (albeit without a Scoob) and can see some saddening similarities.
The cynicism of certain "personalities" is phenomenal!!!
OK. A project's being started.
OK. By the webby.
I see much of the "discussion" is regarding the acquisition of parts etc
SO WHAT!?!?!?!?!?! At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, does it?
What will be good for the COMMUNITY, will be the journalled documentation of how Shaun gets from the start to the finish. I think it will be a good read.
Just as everybody else who's done the same thing, I've read those too with the same fascination.
I couldn't do it myself as I have neither the spare funds nor any technical expertise to do so!!!
Now, I can see the cynic's argument, but I really don't see where the problem is.
Now, I'm not agreeing with , nor disagreeing with the comments about "conflict of interest". All I'm saying is that, I really couldn't give a toss about what IMHO is very petty details.
I'm just looking forward to a bloody good read.
I'm sure that many other viewers/members will think the same.
Dan
I do think it's a shame that all these topics seem to end up in bickering
I was around when this all kicked off the first time round (albeit without a Scoob) and can see some saddening similarities. The cynicism of certain "personalities" is phenomenal!!!
OK. A project's being started.
OK. By the webby.
I see much of the "discussion" is regarding the acquisition of parts etc
SO WHAT!?!?!?!?!?! At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, does it?
What will be good for the COMMUNITY, will be the journalled documentation of how Shaun gets from the start to the finish. I think it will be a good read.
Just as everybody else who's done the same thing, I've read those too with the same fascination.
I couldn't do it myself as I have neither the spare funds nor any technical expertise to do so!!!
Now, I can see the cynic's argument, but I really don't see where the problem is.
Now, I'm not agreeing with , nor disagreeing with the comments about "conflict of interest". All I'm saying is that, I really couldn't give a toss about what IMHO is very petty details.
I'm just looking forward to a bloody good read.
I'm sure that many other viewers/members will think the same.
Dan
Last edited by ScoobyDoo555; 10 April 2005 at 10:58 AM. Reason: oxford english dictionary!! ;)
10 April 2005 | 10:49 AM
#41
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Joined: Oct 1998
Posts: 13,763
Likes: 1
Dan
Thank you for your sensible comments.
I completely understand your frustration, as I too used to feel compelled to try to explain obvious facts, but soon realised that they genuinely are obvious and the majority of people don't need them explaining.
It always seems to be the same people with the same problems.
Rest assured the majority do not feel the same way otherwise these questions / cynical statements would be popping up from new people all the time. Why is it we always recognise the names from the last time?
Thanks again for taking the time to post. General the silent minority suffer this kind of thing in silence / or just can't be bothered with it (which I understand completely) which is fine, but this can give strength to the moaners / cynics as they only see negative comments and start to believe they must be right.
All the best
Simon
Thank you for your sensible comments.
I completely understand your frustration, as I too used to feel compelled to try to explain obvious facts, but soon realised that they genuinely are obvious and the majority of people don't need them explaining.
It always seems to be the same people with the same problems.
Rest assured the majority do not feel the same way otherwise these questions / cynical statements would be popping up from new people all the time. Why is it we always recognise the names from the last time?
Thanks again for taking the time to post. General the silent minority suffer this kind of thing in silence / or just can't be bothered with it (which I understand completely) which is fine, but this can give strength to the moaners / cynics as they only see negative comments and start to believe they must be right.
All the best
Simon
10 April 2005 | 11:26 AM
#42
Scooby Regular
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 7,957
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shaun, scoobydoo555,
I must admit I tend to agree with dan on this on the baiss that acquisition of the parts is not what the thread is about.
However, the fact remains that if the acquisition of the parts is based upon who is willing to donate them in exchange for advertsising, then the feature and promotion of those parts is there due to which manufacturer could justify the advertising cost, not which which is the best value for money to the customer who has to pay normal retail.
Thus a project thread intended to help out the man on the street (scoobynet) in order to be accurate should be the kind where shaun has to have a specific budget in mind, and go out and purchase the items, fit the products and review them, accounting for every penny of the budget along the way.
I am not implying here that shaun is being dishonest and I am not wanting to come across as cynical, I just think that the "cynics" on this thread have a valid point, and that the phrasing of the opening lines of the project thread is inconsistent with a project in which the acquisistion occured in the way that has been intimated.
As for the anti22b.com posts, as has been said before, I am not keen on the amount of cross bbs bashing and am glad to see it has been discouraged on here. There is more than enough room for both bbs, and if DaveO feels the way he does, he is more than welcome not to lurk or post there.
22b.com was originally set up as a tecnical reference. It does that and it does that well, with all the "ture" experts on here (that I know of any) happily posting from the benefit of their knowledge on there. the difference being, there aren't another 10k people shouting at the same time, so questions get answered quickly and efficiently. That doesn't mean that 22B.com doesnt have a social area where a dry sense of humour prevails.
The amount of traffic doesn't compare to here and if you want to hear some fresh voices, which many often do, then the social threads on here seem more and more attractive, plus there is more exposure to other technical threads and those seeking htechnical help who aren't aware of 22b.com. With that in mind there is more than enough room in my favourites drop down menu for both sites.
Although 22b.com is at the top! mostly due to alphabetical ordering on the list.
aardvark.com anyone?
I must admit I tend to agree with dan on this on the baiss that acquisition of the parts is not what the thread is about.
However, the fact remains that if the acquisition of the parts is based upon who is willing to donate them in exchange for advertsising, then the feature and promotion of those parts is there due to which manufacturer could justify the advertising cost, not which which is the best value for money to the customer who has to pay normal retail.
Thus a project thread intended to help out the man on the street (scoobynet) in order to be accurate should be the kind where shaun has to have a specific budget in mind, and go out and purchase the items, fit the products and review them, accounting for every penny of the budget along the way.
I am not implying here that shaun is being dishonest and I am not wanting to come across as cynical, I just think that the "cynics" on this thread have a valid point, and that the phrasing of the opening lines of the project thread is inconsistent with a project in which the acquisistion occured in the way that has been intimated.
As for the anti22b.com posts, as has been said before, I am not keen on the amount of cross bbs bashing and am glad to see it has been discouraged on here. There is more than enough room for both bbs, and if DaveO feels the way he does, he is more than welcome not to lurk or post there.
22b.com was originally set up as a tecnical reference. It does that and it does that well, with all the "ture" experts on here (that I know of any) happily posting from the benefit of their knowledge on there. the difference being, there aren't another 10k people shouting at the same time, so questions get answered quickly and efficiently. That doesn't mean that 22B.com doesnt have a social area where a dry sense of humour prevails.
The amount of traffic doesn't compare to here and if you want to hear some fresh voices, which many often do, then the social threads on here seem more and more attractive, plus there is more exposure to other technical threads and those seeking htechnical help who aren't aware of 22b.com. With that in mind there is more than enough room in my favourites drop down menu for both sites.
Although 22b.com is at the top!
mostly due to alphabetical ordering on the list.aardvark.com anyone?
10 April 2005 | 11:41 AM
#43
Scooby Regular
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 11,217
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From: Does it matter?
I see what you're saying Adam (great project of yours by the way!!!! )
However, I'll add one final comment on this.
The impression of this project is a bit like "Challenge Anneka" only without the jumpsuit, dune buggy and timescale!
I don't know or really care about the whys and wherefores of the parts acquisition - it's nothing to do with me.
But my understanding of what you've said is that some parts could be traded for advertising space. Whether I'm right or wrong on the understanding, again, doesn't really matter. This is Shaun's business.
If there are parts that are unavailable through this concept, then they would have to be bought anyways. But from my brief reading of Shaun's post, there's a PPP-like budget anyway, so there's cash to spend.
Either way, the project must go on
So, regardless of the "swapsie" aspect, like all other builds, there will still be a cost.
So, to conclude, I really don't see where the problem is. If people wish to contribute, they will. If they don't, they won't!
Dan
)However, I'll add one final comment on this.
The impression of this project is a bit like "Challenge Anneka" only without the jumpsuit, dune buggy and timescale!
I don't know or really care about the whys and wherefores of the parts acquisition - it's nothing to do with me.
But my understanding of what you've said is that some parts could be traded for advertising space. Whether I'm right or wrong on the understanding, again, doesn't really matter. This is Shaun's business.
If there are parts that are unavailable through this concept, then they would have to be bought anyways. But from my brief reading of Shaun's post, there's a PPP-like budget anyway, so there's cash to spend.
Either way, the project must go on
So, regardless of the "swapsie" aspect, like all other builds, there will still be a cost.
So, to conclude, I really don't see where the problem is. If people wish to contribute, they will. If they don't, they won't!
Dan
10 April 2005 | 07:32 PM
#48
Scooby Regular
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Inside me cage !!
Originally Posted by Dave-Ol
sorry but enough is enough.
Should it be renamed to 22Wankers.com because thats what it seems to be? A small group of even smaller minded tossers with nothing to offer the world posting childish and frankly offensive attacks.
I haven't been around for a while as I now live in Canada and started lurking again recently and i cant help but say it makes me sick to my stomach to see the threads that are posted on there.
quite how the webmasters of scoobynet put up with it is beyond me. I remember the old days of 22b.com vs scoobynet and would have thought all that would have gone by now. I certainly haven't seen any 22b.com bashing posted on scoobynet. Maybe the webmasters would vape anything like that? Higher standards of decency?
I remember Moray from years ago. He is now a moderator on 22b.com i see and is actually supporting these threads himself! You should be ashamed of yourself moray!
webbies I'm sure it must be upsetting to read some of the crap posted on there (assuming you do read it!). But take heart from this.
*People vote with their feet. How many members, threads, views does scoobynet have compared to 22Tossers.com?
*You only have to read a few of the names and posts on there to realise that the whole site is basically the "scoobynet reject society". Misfits. People who have such petty and insignificant lives that they have the spare time to post their massively heart felt upset at having a post deleted or something equally minor. They post it on there because it is the only place they can have the confidence a reassurance that other misfits will support their twisted views, and now it seems they have the support of the site moderators themselves!
*22Losers.com will never be popular. Any organisation in history which conducted itself in such a manner is laughed about and ridiculed.
I apologise to all for the rant. But I think its about time we showed these horrible people what we all think.
The webmasters take so much **** from so many people. They seem to be accused of everything short of the great train robbery and they provide all of this for us for no charge. Yes I've seen the scoobynet+ thing and may buy it at some point, but you dont have to if you dont want to.
Keep up the good work fellas and the moderators. I have missed the scene and am so happy to see it still going so well. Shame the same cant be said for the 22Misfits.com.
Regards
Dave
Should it be renamed to 22Wankers.com because thats what it seems to be? A small group of even smaller minded tossers with nothing to offer the world posting childish and frankly offensive attacks.
I haven't been around for a while as I now live in Canada and started lurking again recently and i cant help but say it makes me sick to my stomach to see the threads that are posted on there.
quite how the webmasters of scoobynet put up with it is beyond me. I remember the old days of 22b.com vs scoobynet and would have thought all that would have gone by now. I certainly haven't seen any 22b.com bashing posted on scoobynet. Maybe the webmasters would vape anything like that? Higher standards of decency?
I remember Moray from years ago. He is now a moderator on 22b.com i see and is actually supporting these threads himself! You should be ashamed of yourself moray!
webbies I'm sure it must be upsetting to read some of the crap posted on there (assuming you do read it!). But take heart from this.
*People vote with their feet. How many members, threads, views does scoobynet have compared to 22Tossers.com?
*You only have to read a few of the names and posts on there to realise that the whole site is basically the "scoobynet reject society". Misfits. People who have such petty and insignificant lives that they have the spare time to post their massively heart felt upset at having a post deleted or something equally minor. They post it on there because it is the only place they can have the confidence a reassurance that other misfits will support their twisted views, and now it seems they have the support of the site moderators themselves!
*22Losers.com will never be popular. Any organisation in history which conducted itself in such a manner is laughed about and ridiculed.
I apologise to all for the rant. But I think its about time we showed these horrible people what we all think.
The webmasters take so much **** from so many people. They seem to be accused of everything short of the great train robbery and they provide all of this for us for no charge. Yes I've seen the scoobynet+ thing and may buy it at some point, but you dont have to if you dont want to.
Keep up the good work fellas and the moderators. I have missed the scene and am so happy to see it still going so well. Shame the same cant be said for the 22Misfits.com.
Regards
Dave
say no more !!
Last edited by 200+; 10 April 2005 at 07:37 PM.
10 April 2005 | 07:35 PM
#49
Scooby Regular
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Inside me cage !!
Originally Posted by TonyBurns
I didnt think of you as a Judge Dredd fan Shaun
Tony
Tony
I thought it was reference to "A Few Good Men" all time great IMHO
Doesnt deserve to be dragged into this
Last edited by 200+; 10 April 2005 at 07:38 PM.
10 April 2005 | 10:24 PM
#50
Scooby Regular
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,611
Likes: 0
From: Zed Ess Won Hay Tee
i use 22b.com
to be honest, when i am on there i act compleatly sensible, its usefull for tech info, spend more time searching then posting,
i use this one more for banter
each site is better, for diffrent things, if you dont fit in with one, move on and dont winge about it
to be honest, when i am on there i act compleatly sensible, its usefull for tech info, spend more time searching then posting,
i use this one more for banter
each site is better, for diffrent things, if you dont fit in with one, move on and dont winge about it
11 April 2005 | 10:33 AM
#52
Scooby Regular
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 6,095
Likes: 0
From: £1.785m reasons not to be here :)
LOL
So what if the parts are donated in return for free advertising? Whats the big deal?
As long as the subsequent reporting is fair and accurate, it shouldn't matter by what means the parts are procured.
Of course, what Shaun needs to bear in mind is that any significant discount on the cost of the modifications based upon Scoobynet exposure, whether that is 100% or less will be deemed to be a taxable benefit, on the basis that the car is his.
So Shaun't biggest issue should be with the Inland Revenue
That is, if the parts and services are being provided for free (or at a higher discount than could be expected by the average man in the street)
D
So what if the parts are donated in return for free advertising? Whats the big deal?
As long as the subsequent reporting is fair and accurate, it shouldn't matter by what means the parts are procured.
Of course, what Shaun needs to bear in mind is that any significant discount on the cost of the modifications based upon Scoobynet exposure, whether that is 100% or less will be deemed to be a taxable benefit, on the basis that the car is his.
So Shaun't biggest issue should be with the Inland Revenue
That is, if the parts and services are being provided for free (or at a higher discount than could be expected by the average man in the street)
D
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