Best turbo for a 2.0l money no object.
05 July 2005, 09:04 PM
#31
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im going to the one at WRC (silverstone)....you should come down...its not that far from you.
1.4 bar on a standard td04??? i didnt think they would boost that high without some fettling!
1.4 bar on a standard td04??? i didnt think they would boost that high without some fettling!
05 July 2005, 09:05 PM
#32
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Another question (maybe obvious)..!
Everthing else being equal, if two different types of turbo produce the same boost at the same rpm/spool up would the performance/outputs be identical..?
Everthing else being equal, if two different types of turbo produce the same boost at the same rpm/spool up would the performance/outputs be identical..?
05 July 2005, 09:06 PM
#33
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i think its down to the design of the turbo, so i would say no, but cant give you the technical reasons why...
05 July 2005, 09:08 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by Neilo
im going to the one at WRC (silverstone)....you should come down...its not that far from you.
1.4 bar on a standard td04??? i didnt think they would boost that high without some fettling!
1.4 bar on a standard td04??? i didnt think they would boost that high without some fettling!
Even Bob commented on the instant spool up..! Good enough for me..!
Edited to ask: What date you going to WRC and how much..! Skint at the moment, bloody scoobs fault..!
Last edited by jasonius; 05 July 2005 at 09:13 PM.
05 July 2005, 09:10 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by Neilo
i think its down to the design of the turbo, so i would say no, but cant give you the technical reasons why...
05 July 2005, 09:17 PM
#36
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Originally Posted by jasonius
Edited to ask: What date you going to WRC and how much..! Skint at the moment, bloody scoobs fault..!
you could always come down to my meet this sunday if you fancied a chat too
on mk.....a nice motorway drive 
05 July 2005, 09:46 PM
#37
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Originally Posted by jasonius
Another question (maybe obvious)..!
Everthing else being equal, if two different types of turbo produce the same boost at the same rpm/spool up would the performance/outputs be identical..?
Everthing else being equal, if two different types of turbo produce the same boost at the same rpm/spool up would the performance/outputs be identical..?
The larger unit will flow more volume of air at the same pressure.
Ie, at "x" psi, a TD05 is flowing more than a TD04
More air ( and more fuel )= more power
= more
05 July 2005, 10:53 PM
#39
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Neilo
If your 2.0l block can handle the extra power and you heads can give you 8000rbm
Go with gt30r a/r0.63 you can get the 400hp so easy its batter than the td06
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If your 2.0l block can handle the extra power and you heads can give you 8000rbm
Go with gt30r a/r0.63 you can get the 400hp so easy its batter than the td06
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05 July 2005, 11:11 PM
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bosaleh, depends how you like your power band. I have a GT30R-12 0.82AR on a 2.5 with 7500 RPM limit, and arguably the TD05H-20G was a nicer road turbo than it or the GT30-10 bolt on, 1 bar was 400-500 RPM earlier at 2500 RPM, there was hardly any lag even in low gears if you were over 3000 RPM, it was up near 400 lbft very soon after the dyno operator turned the load on, and you could crest peak power in a near flat line over a massive range at the top end, it was ludicrously easy to drive fast. Despite the Garrett ball bearing core, the old sleeve bearing Mitsubishis feel to me to be competitive on power band.
05 July 2005, 11:15 PM
#44
fair comment.
I guess that if a number of customers used the RR and got much less on Optimax then they would be pissed
I remember that I could only get about 385bhp out of the 20g with Optimax and NF (420bhp with Race fuel) thats why I am sceptical of the smaller 18g..........
I guess that if a number of customers used the RR and got much less on Optimax then they would be pissed
I remember that I could only get about 385bhp out of the 20g with Optimax and NF (420bhp with Race fuel) thats why I am sceptical of the smaller 18g..........
05 July 2005, 11:25 PM
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The 20G is turbine limited though, so the 18G compressor doesn't hurt it so much, IIRC the exducer is the same size as the 20G, inducer is a bit smaller, it is still a fairly big wheel. Don't think 385 BHP is bad for a 20G, considering the power band it manages, although it likes an STi rev limit.
If you do a bit of digging on the G-force site there is an article referring to using 98 RON fuel for the 2b conversion.
If you do a bit of digging on the G-force site there is an article referring to using 98 RON fuel for the 2b conversion.
05 July 2005, 11:46 PM
#49
Steve,
At WRC tech, I mapped a car with 18g and it made 335hp on plain optimax, rich AFR, 1.2 bar at peak power conservative timing etc. I think 360hp at possible on those rollers, most certainly with the benefits of an STI (heads, cams etc) and getting it to hold 1.4 bar at the top end (like thise paticular car did on the road). I will be doing some more mapping on the same car soon, and I would like to think we can exceed 350hp certainly.
Paul
At WRC tech, I mapped a car with 18g and it made 335hp on plain optimax, rich AFR, 1.2 bar at peak power conservative timing etc. I think 360hp at possible on those rollers, most certainly with the benefits of an STI (heads, cams etc) and getting it to hold 1.4 bar at the top end (like thise paticular car did on the road). I will be doing some more mapping on the same car soon, and I would like to think we can exceed 350hp certainly.
Paul
05 July 2005, 11:58 PM
#50
Pavlo
Fair enough - and for the money you cant go wrong - its the ideal Turbo on standard internals (Fuzz's is an exception and I hope he's saving for when something goes erm BANG!)
I dont think I could drive a car with that little power these days (although the amount of time my sti5 has been off the road in the last 2/3 years I have to make do with an awful 2004 wrx - I get an earbashing everyday about the lack of performance on this Ecutekked car that my wife has to endure!)
John
Remind me what you got when you sold that small GT30 0.6 a/r (thats what it was you had on at one time?) and wanted £750 a few months back?
Fair enough - and for the money you cant go wrong - its the ideal Turbo on standard internals (Fuzz's is an exception and I hope he's saving for when something goes erm BANG!)
I dont think I could drive a car with that little power these days (although the amount of time my sti5 has been off the road in the last 2/3 years I have to make do with an awful 2004 wrx - I get an earbashing everyday about the lack of performance on this Ecutekked car that my wife has to endure!)
John
Remind me what you got when you sold that small GT30 0.6 a/r (thats what it was you had on at one time?) and wanted £750 a few months back?
06 July 2005, 09:16 AM
#51
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Steve
With a few small changes (turbo/intercooler/map) your 04WRX should be as quick as a JDM twinscroll Sti with an almost identical torque band. The only noticeable difference being the rpm limit.
Regards the 'other' turbos, be sure to do your homework and cut through the smokescreens and spec the turbo as it is for the best price. ie a GT30-10/P18 rather than a P450/sr40/bob/fuzz/MDxxx "special" for example
Andy (home of the original TD05-20G and 18G - no secrets !)
With a few small changes (turbo/intercooler/map) your 04WRX should be as quick as a JDM twinscroll Sti with an almost identical torque band. The only noticeable difference being the rpm limit.
Regards the 'other' turbos, be sure to do your homework and cut through the smokescreens and spec the turbo as it is for the best price. ie a GT30-10/P18 rather than a P450/sr40/bob/fuzz/MDxxx "special" for example
Andy (home of the original TD05-20G and 18G - no secrets !)
06 July 2005, 09:35 AM
#52
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Originally Posted by john banks
bosaleh, depends how you like your power band. I have a GT30R-12 0.82AR on a 2.5 with 7500 RPM limit, and arguably the TD05H-20G was a nicer road turbo than it or the GT30-10 bolt on, 1 bar was 400-500 RPM earlier at 2500 RPM, there was hardly any lag even in low gears if you were over 3000 RPM, it was up near 400 lbft very soon after the dyno operator turned the load on, and you could crest peak power in a near flat line over a massive range at the top end, it was ludicrously easy to drive fast. Despite the Garrett ball bearing core, the old sleeve bearing Mitsubishis feel to me to be competitive on power band.
why you dont go with JUN 272 cam kit i think you will have 8500+rbm
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06 July 2005, 09:40 AM
#53
Originally Posted by Andy.F
Steve
With a few small changes (turbo/intercooler/map) your 04WRX should be as quick as a JDM twinscroll Sti with an almost identical torque band. The only noticeable difference being the rpm limit.
Regards the 'other' turbos, be sure to do your homework and cut through the smokescreens and spec the turbo as it is for the best price. ie a GT30-10/P18 rather than a P450/sr40/bob/fuzz/MDxxx "special" for example
Andy (home of the original TD05-20G and 18G - no secrets !)
With a few small changes (turbo/intercooler/map) your 04WRX should be as quick as a JDM twinscroll Sti with an almost identical torque band. The only noticeable difference being the rpm limit.
Regards the 'other' turbos, be sure to do your homework and cut through the smokescreens and spec the turbo as it is for the best price. ie a GT30-10/P18 rather than a P450/sr40/bob/fuzz/MDxxx "special" for example
Andy (home of the original TD05-20G and 18G - no secrets !)
I think Greddy might have something to say about that for starters.
06 July 2005, 09:42 AM
#54
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Think is was about £500 Steve. I bought it before the rotated stuff took off, and it is still difficult to buy a nice off the shelf kit that will have a plumbed back external wastegate and clears a six speed box. Part of the problem is the spec/special thing Andy is referring to.
Steve, what sort of "daily driver" performance are you looking for, whether you measure that in power, torque, or 1/4 mile times?
bosaleh: "why you dont go with JUN 272 cam kit i think you will have 8500+rbm" I am waiting to see how people like Alan G, Callum and P20SPD get on with their built 2.5s. My present 2.5 is lasting so well I don't really want to pull it out...
Steve, what sort of "daily driver" performance are you looking for, whether you measure that in power, torque, or 1/4 mile times?
bosaleh: "why you dont go with JUN 272 cam kit i think you will have 8500+rbm" I am waiting to see how people like Alan G, Callum and P20SPD get on with their built 2.5s. My present 2.5 is lasting so well I don't really want to pull it out...
Last edited by john banks; 06 July 2005 at 09:45 AM.
06 July 2005, 10:09 AM
#55
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Originally Posted by john banks
Steve, what sort of "daily driver" performance are you looking for, whether you measure that in power, torque, or 1/4 mile times?
I was after something that can deliver me comfortably in to the 12s with an 03wrx...semi stripped if need be, that would also be a useful track tool
I realise that the gearbox is a nasty limitation here but if it goes....it goes i guess. So power of around 350, torque of around 330 would be just dandy.
So from all of this i can imagine that the answer would be an 18g or a slightly more stressed VF35, correct?
06 July 2005, 12:35 PM
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problem is floyd yours will feel bloody quick cos its 150kgs lighter than mine...so its not really a fair comparison....id need a 400bhp car of my shape to get the same sort of outright performance...