danwrx1980

when i say it happens i mean there is a current inducted into nearby metal that could theoretically produce a short/spark if there was a gap for it to arc across.
and i have seen mythbusters and numerous documentaries on it and i don't believe it could blow up a petrol station.
just so you know we're both working on the same point

StickyMicky

hmmm

the block has sky hardwired into every apartment, i would have no need for any kind of ariel lead, the tv tuner would not be used and would not even have to be tuned into anything

it would be a simple scart lead from the skybox/ps2
not sure if i would actually need a licence TBH??

found this post from sumbody via google

danwrx1980

that is also true, the law says that if you have a TV AND an aerial then you need a licence, but as your tv will not have an aerial then you should be ok

mark1234

Anyway...

it's a broadcast receiving license, NOT a TV license.

"Sure I have a TV. It's hooked up to the DVD player. Playstation, XBOX, whatever. Yes there's an aerial on the roof, but it came with the house. It's not plugged in."

Alternatively, just pay the damned thing - it's not that expensive. Or ditch the TV and do something useful with life

OllyK

Depends how close to 0 you have to get before you consider the realistic chance of something actually happening are to all intents and purposes impossible.

Luminous

iTrader: (3)

A TV definately broadcasts a signal of some sort when it is used. All electrical devices do, and a TV screens signal is actually quite strong.

I really do not know how much information the TV "gives away" when it broadcasts. Its not as simple as TV just repeating the signal it receives. A lot of the signal is going to be made up from the powerful electronics inside that are used to produce the signal that you are seeing.

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

buy an lcd tv or plasma and let em sweat they will not know diddly sh*t (unless they have devoloped ways to detect these)

ps if they do turn up disconnect arial and say you been using it for computer related purposes

dpb

Mickey, youll just have to invest in a Yat...............

StickyMicky

it would take a good few years worth of paying the dam thing to be cost effective against a plasma tv???

i dont even watch much tv in my parents house, i cant rember the last time my tv was even plugged in (maybe GT4 a few months back)

it will probably be a good month or so before i even move into this place so i will just let them mount up in the mail box

dpb

..<true>

hedgehog

I always thought that the detector vans picked up the frequency generated by the superhet receiver in the TV. If that is the case then they would be able to detect any TV receiver, including those contained in a plasma TV or even in a PC. I would also expect it to be possible to locate such a source with a pretty reasonable degree of accuracy.

Perhaps this is incorrect, or perhaps they use several of the frequencies that a TV set will generate, depending upon the circumstances. If it is the superhet they are detecting then I think danwrx1980 is sort of correct in what he says in a strange way.

fast bloke

Jeez.... there are some suckers in this world - If a white van decides to park about 4" from your TV, then there might be a chance that they can detect TV generated frequencies - other than that, they work on the assumption that nearly everyone has a TV, so if you don't have a licence they will knock you door and ask you why not... my final year included maths, physics, electronics and computers - at that time in 1996 there was no way of detecting a TV being used for any purpose from any locality. There was however a way of 'stealing' mobile phone transmissions and internet traffic.

Think hard about the question - it the TVL people have a magic van, why would they need Dixons to tell them who is buying TV's?

johnfelstead

I grew up with TV technology and studied it down to electronic component level in depth at college for 3 years.

Being technical for a second, TV vans are a load of bollox, they use the good old method of scare tactics and bull**** to make the majority of people pay. They have a list of address's with no licence to find unlicenced TV's, end of.

fast bloke

Didn't realise they had dectector vans that far back


p.s. - I have to applaud you - "Being technical for a second, TV vans are a load of bollox" - I love it when people get really technical

GC8

It is possible, the technology certainly exists, but they dont use it. Most people either confess when/or the Capita (all privatised) employee hears or sees the set, or the tell tale light.


Simon

Monkeh

my old electroncs tutor used to have loads of visits from the TV vans, he had disabled the tuner in the tv from receiving bbc1 and 2

they would send him letter telling him to pay up or else, and he would send one back asking them round for a cup of tea and watch itv on his telly.
this went of for 2 years while i was there..

he was also working on a lcd numberplate i wonder if he ever finnished it

Dracoro

Gotta love it. Spend near £1000 so save £120 on a licence.

cigarboy

I'm actually with Capita.

NOT the TVL division, however.

However, there are indeed detector vans - its been several years since this was floating around, but at one time there were only 12 vans in the whole country (or so the tale went).

OllyK

How do the detector vans work?

PMSL - that says it's bull to me. Still digging on t'internet but so far it looks like electronic detection mechanisms are non-existant to over-hyped, but I'll reserve final judgement for now.

cigarboy

What's the point of keeping something like that a secret, unless you are trying to protect / safeguard the fact that it doesn't exist OR is technically retarded?

Surely if you had an all singing all dancing device that could nail a thousand tellies in one postcode and have it running on two Duracell batteries you would be shouting it from the rooftops.

Sounds like a load of guff to scare wide eyed students on campus into parting with a few sticky pennies to me.

cigarboy

What, so MY cash is going towards not IMPLIMENTING and MAINTAINING a tried and tested system for detection, but MULTIPLE systems, thus with multiple projects, support costs, upkeep, UAT periods... the list goes on.

Jeez.

I'm looking to overthrow a small banana republic in the not too distant future and install a figurehead dictator. I must have a word with him about TVL issues, sounds like a lovely little earner to me. El Presidente's account in Switzerland will be most receptive of this sort of thing.

OllyK

OK more digging done. Seems the technology exists to detect a TV in use due to the inherant "leakiness" of electronics and the re-modulation of the recieved signal to the display frequency of the TV (Oops sorry danwrx1980 - never let it be said I won't admit to being wrong - still think your wrong on the mobile phone issue though )

This is quite a good explanation behind it, although I'm not sure how "independant" it is, so there may be some spin here. One point of note

Have a read of This which seems a little more independant.

Also do some digging on James Whale (yes the TV & Radio presenter), I think this may have also been mentioned in the threads I linked to earlier.

So in summary - the technology to detect a TV in use would seem to be plausible, whether it has been practically implemented is another story. Having scan read the list of excuses it seems to suggest the TV detection guys are using the Database, looking through the window and looking for ariels rather than any electronic gizmos.

m111usy

this makes VERY interesting reading.

http://www.spiderbomb.com/tv/

Under EU law the TV licence is supposedly illegal !

I find it rather amusing they charge blind people for a tv licence. makes no sense whatsoever.

OllyK

Oh they are shouting from the rooftops that they have it, they just won't explain how it actually works - although other sites suggest the mechanism for how it could work.

bioforger

iTrader: (1)

Why only women?

cigarboy

Yeah, granted, but if I told you I had a solid gold statue of Richard Nixon in my front garden then you'd probably be doubtful UNLESS you saw some proof of it.

When are yet to see any proof - so does it actually exist? Its the "I've got a terrible secret but can't tell you" syndrome methinks.

Still, articles v. interesting reading.

hedgehog

Detecting and locating the LO of a superhet receiver is neither new nor any big deal, I'd guess most with an interest in electronics could build a detector and someone with a more advanced interest could build a system that would allow location to within a few feet. I suspect this is the same system that was used to detect spies making radio transmissions during WWII, and it probably wasn't new then. I'd guess it wasn't actually the transmissions that were detected but the receiver side of the gear as it is likely to be running for a longer period of time and the LO will be at a higher frequency making positioning more accurate.

robski

Sure its possible to detect, wouldn't be surprised if its got a lot harder though in recent years as the amount of energy consumed by Tvs etc has plummeted. Lower energy useage is gonna make it harder to find, in the case of a block of flats thats going to be a hell of a lot harder from a ground based detection system

Anyway, sooner they scrap the BBC and stop charging for something that should really just be considered a given rather than a luxury nowadays the better.

Will the government come up with a PodTax now for the new Ipod?, you can throw away your normal TV, cancel your licence and watch it on your ipod to avoid the licence fee!?

I've never thought about it, but when you think a normal tv is a receiver/magnifier, cant be hard to transmit a signal locally that would be picked up by the TV via the aerial, sent down and magnified by the tv itself. If you can make this signal quite tight to a specific aerial then its simple to look for the tv transmitting the signal. Doesnt have to be anything too special, just a small sound clip or something just outside the normal range.

OMG ive got it, thats what interference is, its all these TV vans sending crappy info to our TVs

scunnered

iTrader: (1)

We used something similar when I was in the forces. We used a device that was tuned to the Local Oscilator frequency. The incoming radio signal would be amplified and mixed with the LO. The LO would detected as it is being transmitted back out through the antennae. Very crude, but it works. You certainly cannot tell which room the receiver is in but you can sure as hell pinpoint (by triangulation) the antennae.
Just before I left, there was some experimentation on a device that detects the EM frequency emmiting from a CRT screen.

GC8

Thats how it works. Does anyone remember when the adverts started telling us that they could tell whether you were watching colour or B&W and they knew which station you were watching?

Ive seen a demonstration of this, although it was with regards to data theft rather than TV detection; computer displays used a similar CRT. You might have been able to make out the channel, just.... but you coudlnt really read the data on the screen. I think that it was the EMF that was received, as scunnered stated.

Like I said earlier, it can be done, but Im not sure that it is. Ive seen inside a Sherpa 'TV Detector Van'; it had antenna all down the sides but inside it was a crew seat bus..........


Simon