vava voom

iTrader: (6)

KIWIGTI...I think your comment here is full of sh*t...tell me before the USA made a move on IRAQ had anyone heard of a suicide bomber?...was there any problems except for the racist skinhead mob which taumented many asains here in the UK?

KiwiGTI

I don't really care about the US or suicide bombers - plenty of other examples of terrorism, it has always been obvious that many Islamic countries thrive on violence, killing, misogyny. They are completely uncivilised.

btw, as a Muslim could you honestly say that Islam and the West are compatible and that you enjoy being ruled by 'infidels'?

vava voom

iTrader: (6)

Muslims/the west/aliens can all live together in peace as long as we have a understanding that bad things will happen and just becouse 1 so called Muslim/Black/White person carries out this wrong act does not mean you gas them all....what does this country want to follow Hitler's way?
Any Muslim who has violent intent is NOT A MUSLIM

KiwiGTI

Moderate Muslims living in the West can easily to say that, but you must have your head in the sand if you think that all the other residents of Islamic countries think the same, particularly the poorest ones.

The problem is that extremist views are often the ruling views in many of these countries and they are barbaric and the reality is they represent modern Islam.

vava voom

iTrader: (6)

KIWI..Yes i understand your point but less ask our self a question as to why those people hate white people.....hummm??? you go over their and pi** on their land they will get angry , just as if i walk over and **** in your back garden!...and please dont ask as to what the westhas done becouse then i will have to accuse you of haveing your head in the sand!

Do you think that all those muslims just woke up one morning and thought...ahh yes lets hate white people

vava voom

iTrader: (6)

KIWI we will have to pick this back up tommorow as my dinner is getting cold!

2000TLondon

The extemist views, with extreme being the important word as that means it is out of the ordinary, may in deed be those of the government, but that does not mean they have are the representatives of modern Islam.

Look at Tehran for example, formerly a pro-western city pre the 1979 revolution. Since then has been ruled by Ayatollahs and extremists following the coup. Are you telling me the students protesting in Tehran now who want to revert to a more democratic, western way of life are extreme Muslim fundamentalists? Of course not, the government is spoiling for a confrontation, but that doesn't mean the population is!

popeye

I heard a rumour that the people who piloted the planes on 9/11 didn't survive.



Do I win 5 pounds?

Sbradley

Popeye, I hate to bother you with facts but 9/11 was several years after the USA 'liberated' Kuwait.

Let's not worry about the backgorund to that one - but it's fair to say that they made their move on Iraq first...

SB

dsmith

You might need to clarify *which* move on Iraq you're referring to but that aside the answer is yes.

You have to try pretty hard to rise to the top of the pile of utter cr*ap spouted on S'net but hats off to you. You've managed it over the last few days.

I personally cant help feeling those demonstrating have missed the point. It was my understanding that the image of the prophet was banned to avoid idolatry amongst his followers - but they seem to have turned the "No image" thing into more of an "idolisation" than almost any of the other religions do of their specific images/icons etc.

Interestingly dictionary.com lists idolatry as....

1. Worship of idols.
2. Blind or excessive devotion to something.

You have to say that they dont exactly seem to be winning the "no idolatry" competition based on definition no 2.

I'll say it again...."Religion removes the capability for rational thought."

Sbradley

Now for a proper response.

Background first. I'm married to a Christian Arab, I am a white christian Englishman. I'm ex forces and politically would consider myself a liberal conservative. So right of centre but not by very far.

I am really struggling to get my head around the fact that any religious, political or social group can be allowed to hold protests of the type we have seen over the last couple of days in this democracy (I know, I'm stretching a point there) and not be called to account. We've just seen the BNP being prosecuted on far flimsier grounds, yet other groups appear immune to prosecution. My opening statement, giving my ethnic and political position is sufficient to condemn me as 'racist' in some circles, yet anyone else, including even Scots, Welsh and Irish, can proudly proclaim their nationality from the rooftops with impunity.

And why the Hell not? Being proud of one's nationality does not make one a racist. That's an entirely different creature, relying on a belief in racial superiority rather than national pride.

But I digress.

Moderate Muslims assert that anyone who advocates violence in the name of Islam is not a Muslim. That's reassuring to hear. Or it would be if it was heard louder. If those moderates who claim that the angry voices in the street do not represent their faith got off their backsides and shouted those extremists down.

Because folks, it isn't us you need to tell. You need to tell your Imams and Mullahs that they aren't representing the Koran, the will of God or the teachings of the Prophet. You need to tell them that they aren't representative of what you all feel and believe. Because until you do, and until they change their tune then we simply won't believe you. How could we?

I'd love to deny that the West has done anything to provoke resentment in the Arab world. But I can't. History is riddled with, at best, poor judgement and at worst simple dishonesty, double standards and blatant profiteering when it comes to our dealings with Arab nations.

BUT.

We have opened our doors and provided shelter from some of the most oppressive regimes in the world. And those people who have accepted our protection and our hospitality ought to show the proper appreciation. They have come to live in Great Britain - a non secular, predominantly Christian democracy. And they should accept us for that, not try to convert us to an Islamic Republic.

The British have a long history of being gracious hosts. But I truly believe that if our guests continue to behave in the way we are currently seeing then Enoch Powell's 'rivers of blood' speech may yet be proven accurate. Because we may be tolerant but we have a limit. And I'd say that limit is rapidly being approached.

So to all good Muslims reading this I say this. Put your house in order and remember your obligations as either guests in this country or British citizens, before sufficient damage is done that all the good, caring, hardworking moderates get consumed by the fallout.

SB

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

SBradley: hear hear!

Alcazar

BTW: Vavavoom: only ONE person on here is beeling, and it's YOU

Alcazar

scoobchrissy

iTrader: (1)

Well said SB

popeye

"vava voom" or whatever he's called, said, "the USA made a move on IRAQ", which looks looks very much to me like he's refering to the US-lead invasion of Iraq, *not* the "liberation" of Kuwait. (Note the complete lack of the word "Kuwait" in the post). So you're not "bothering" me with facts at all. In fact, it just looks like you're trying to be an apologist smart-**** for him.

mart360

Prehaps ive missed somthing, and appoligies if its already been covered,

i seem to recall when some of the earlier posts regarding islam kicked off, one the things that was repeated time and time agin is the islam is a tolerant faith/ race and there not all out to bomb kill and maim....


so why the fuss about a cartoon.... 2 things strike me as odd there if his image must never be drawn, how do they know what he looks like??? it could have been ET for all we know. how do they know its their god??

and i though part of what makes the people who follow a faith is there ability to ignore any statements or comments that are directed at their faith.

i dont recall any of the other faiths protesting over this article?

mart

Little Miss WRX

Ladies and gentlemen, there are two threads running which are discussing the same topic.
In order to keep some form of order in place I will respectfully request you to continue this discussion in a reasonable and factful manner on the current thread which is here: http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthread.php?t=489070

I will ensure there is a link in the other thread for people to reference their comments to.

Many thanks in advance.