davyboy

Yep, and I've mentioned it.

I have put my points forward, this is all good reasoned debate, and one clearly we're not going to agree on.

I'll let you guys carry on now.

Dave

davegtt

I know you mentioned it, I quoted the actual text, my point is you dont know the facts yet your calling the guy names for something you know nothing about, its one thing having an opinion on a subject but to judge somebody on something none of us really know much about is a little unfair and taints your whole argument somewhat, especially as you seem to be in a minority

Crapaud62

Interesting points raised about this on Question Time last night.
One point is that it would be dreadful for the child to be born knowing that its natural father did not want it. But that must also happen in many other cases.
If a woman announces to her partner that she is pregnant and he doesn't like it then there is nothing he can do. If it has been concieved "naturally" then the father has no rights at all. He can neither prevent or force an abortion (rightly so). In this case he did consent to the "production" of the embryo to be made in a test tube but not to it then be implanted in the woman.
In my view I still think the consent was at the point of conception even if it was by artificial means.

In both situations ie natural conception versus artificial, the male has consented at the time of conception. In both cases they could be in a loving relationship and want kids. If they subsequently split up, the father of the naturally conceived embryo has no chance to subsequently withdraw his consent but the other father does. It appears that basically it is down to location! If the embryo is frozen in a test tube it remains jointly owned and if it is implanted inside the woman then it is 100% hers?

I'm trying not to be one sided on this but to advance the debate. I accept the legal decision but think that more thought needs to go into this subject to prevent issues like this arising again.

TheBigMan

That is your choice, and one that could arguably be applauded. However the guy in this story does not wish to do so - as such does that make him wrong/you right?? You nice/him a bad person??

Everybody is slating this guy, it is hugely unfair.

Crapaud62

Actually reading my post again, I think there is more consent with the artificial conception. The "father" knew when he donated sperm exactly what the reason was. Most times someone has sex, the idea of conception is probably the last thing on their minds and it might be just an unfortunate accident!

TheBigMan

If I was the guy in question I'd be sitting there, with my head in my hands saying "foock me what have I done to deserve all this ****".

Calling this guy names, and basically abusing him is bang out of order.

The decision is his - and he's made that decision. the woman took it to court and they have ruled in the only way possible - any other ruling WOULD be wrong.

There are waaaaaayyy too many questions that need to be answered before any other ruling could even be possibly considered. The correct and only decision has been made on a logical level, social level as well as a moral level.

davegtt

wtf. I suppose it depends on how you interpretate an Embrio, to be its nothing but a group of cells or whatever it is sat there, its not a child.

He gave his consent to making an Embrio with a view to the possibility of using it to create a child of their own if they wanted to in the future NOT to just creating a child there and then and tough titty about the future. Think your missing the point of all this.

OllyK

Do you think a woman consents to sex when a man buys her a drink?

Artificial impregnation adds additional stages where consent must be given and can be withdrawn. It is not the same as a natural impregnation and so can and should be considered on its own merits.

OllyK

Once the woman is actually "pregnant" then you get in to some serious moral (and social) issues about the implications of withdrawing consent at that time. Up until that point either party should be free to decline concent at any time they wish.

TheBigMan

Yep -that's happened.

Poor woman, but don't try and drag your ex down with you.

Leslie

Daveyboy,

So you are one of those people who is unable to admit when he is shown to be wrong then!

Les

Clarebabes

Edit his name Les

TheBigMan

Oh Claire don't be so pedantic.....

jasey

LOL

TheBigMan

lol !