There is no GOD, get over it.
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Originally Posted by warrenm2
What? Thats the best arguement for the existance of God!
HAHAHAHAH
HAHAHAHAH
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Originally Posted by AudiLover
Here is another rational christian.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...rading+spouses
And religion is the root of all eveil. Most wars all started off by religion. Dividies in todays society all from religion aswell.
God cant keep his religion. Funny think is most religious people dont even fiully practice to what they swear so deeply by from their bible.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...rading+spouses
And religion is the root of all eveil. Most wars all started off by religion. Dividies in todays society all from religion aswell.
God cant keep his religion. Funny think is most religious people dont even fiully practice to what they swear so deeply by from their bible.
Last edited by MY93WRX; 13 March 2006 at 06:58 PM.
#93
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@ Audi Lover, Yea I've seen that before ,it is rather scary that someone can be brainwashed so far to becoming what can only be described as "a sandwich short of a Picnic"!
I got home from work today and there were no notifications about this thread, I thought it died in the early hours, I was thinking, yep it was too long a post..
How you've all suprised me.
Great reading the replies..
Please dont belittle the believers though, it's thier right to believe even if we think we know better (at this point)
I'd rather not see it degenerate and then be locked.
If God did exist though, the line between "he does exist", and science saying "he doesn't", would be steered towards the belief that "he does".
The trouble is, Science can explain and disprove nearly every "God" theory.
I have yet to see one single God theory, disprove the Science theory.
Hence I "believe" there is no god.
Well said about the "idea" and the "belief" thing.
When that line starts getting knocked in the other direction then I might change my "idea" as you say, it's easier to do!
Andy
I got home from work today and there were no notifications about this thread, I thought it died in the early hours, I was thinking, yep it was too long a post..
How you've all suprised me.
Great reading the replies..
Please dont belittle the believers though, it's thier right to believe even if we think we know better (at this point)
I'd rather not see it degenerate and then be locked.
If God did exist though, the line between "he does exist", and science saying "he doesn't", would be steered towards the belief that "he does".
The trouble is, Science can explain and disprove nearly every "God" theory.
I have yet to see one single God theory, disprove the Science theory.
Hence I "believe" there is no god.
Well said about the "idea" and the "belief" thing.
When that line starts getting knocked in the other direction then I might change my "idea" as you say, it's easier to do!
Andy
Last edited by Fuzz; 13 March 2006 at 06:58 PM.
#94
People believe in god because they're just too scared to live life on their own as a grown up. Religion should be banned, I'm sick of hearing about it all. It long ago outlived its' usefulness as a means of controlling the population - In fact it's now starting to have the opposite effect.
As for people being scared of dying..... did you know anything before you were born? of course not - you didn't exist, it wasn't scary, it wasn't anything, you'll soon get used to it again!
As for people being scared of dying..... did you know anything before you were born? of course not - you didn't exist, it wasn't scary, it wasn't anything, you'll soon get used to it again!
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Originally Posted by Mick
There is no mechanism in evolution 'molecules to humans theory' to increase information in the genome - even Richard Dawkins cannot give an example...
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A good website I've been browsing for a year or so is the British Humanist Association
Now that is a "group" that makes sense !
Andy
Now that is a "group" that makes sense !
Andy
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Originally Posted by mpr
People believe in god because they're just too scared to live life on their own as a grown up. Religion should be banned, I'm sick of hearing about it all. It long ago outlived its' usefulness as a means of controlling the population - In fact it's now starting to have the opposite effect.
As for people being scared of dying..... did you know anything before you were born? of course not - you didn't exist, it wasn't scary, it wasn't anything, you'll soon get used to it again!
As for people being scared of dying..... did you know anything before you were born? of course not - you didn't exist, it wasn't scary, it wasn't anything, you'll soon get used to it again!
Last edited by MY93WRX; 13 March 2006 at 10:26 PM.
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Perfect....
What enables human beings to live well rather than badly is their capacity for imaginative and sympathetic identification with the joys and sufferings of others, together with their capacity to think rationally about the consequences of their actions.
The religious element, in fact, distorts moral motivation. Good people are those who help others simply because others need help, who tell the truth just because they want to trust others and be trusted, who act fairly and justly out of respect for the needs and rights of others. Someone who acts in superficially similar ways to these, but does it simply because they believe that it is commanded by an all-powerful deity, is not morally admirable but merely servile. Someone who is motivated only by the hope of eternal reward, or the fear of eternal punishment, is merely selfish.
Andy
What enables human beings to live well rather than badly is their capacity for imaginative and sympathetic identification with the joys and sufferings of others, together with their capacity to think rationally about the consequences of their actions.
The religious element, in fact, distorts moral motivation. Good people are those who help others simply because others need help, who tell the truth just because they want to trust others and be trusted, who act fairly and justly out of respect for the needs and rights of others. Someone who acts in superficially similar ways to these, but does it simply because they believe that it is commanded by an all-powerful deity, is not morally admirable but merely servile. Someone who is motivated only by the hope of eternal reward, or the fear of eternal punishment, is merely selfish.
Andy
#99
Originally Posted by Sbradley
Hi Theo
Always a pleasure
SB
Always a pleasure
SB
His girlfriend is a Muslim BTW, and a very very nice person she is too. Somehow, we, nor she, feel the need to prove we are the smarter/better person. (yeah of course I am the smartest, but that's not the point )
Literature tip: "Desperately Seeking Paradise" from Ziauddin Sardar. "Journey of a sceptical muslim" is the subtitle. British dude. I guess Scoobynet would call him a "Paki". http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...850803-2361244
Must read.
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Originally Posted by Sbradley
Oh, and while we're arguing semantics, God hasn't started a single war or engaged in any combative action since around the time he cast Satan out of heaven.
2) Please read your bible. The old testament is full of it.
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Originally Posted by Sbradley
And finally. If we're going to quote "Devil's Advocate" then there is one important thing that always conveniently gets omitted when gainsayers start spouting the "How can God allow this to happen" line.
It's freedom of choice. Our ultimate weapon against evil, unfortunately also equally effective against ourselves if we aren't careful how we use it...
SB
Oops - MY93WRX got in ahead of me.
But I put it better
It's freedom of choice. Our ultimate weapon against evil, unfortunately also equally effective against ourselves if we aren't careful how we use it...
SB
Oops - MY93WRX got in ahead of me.
But I put it better
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Originally Posted by MY93WRX
I think you'll find sience hasn't, if there is still parts of science unexplained then there is no absoloute proof, there never will be. You may believe on the evidance you've seen that there is no God but that is not absaloute proof. You also failed to read the retort with regards to Katrina as the same arguement can be applied to every natural disaster. God gave man free will. You can use the same argument you've used on hear to infinity and athers can use the complete oposite arguement to infinity. We will find out when we're dead.
A natural disaster has nothing to do with free will unless you are trying to claim that a man was responsible for the hurricane or any other natural disaster.
#103
Originally Posted by Fuzz
A good website I've been browsing for a year or so is the British Humanist Association
Now that is a "group" that makes sense !
Andy
Now that is a "group" that makes sense !
Andy
Did you click on the link about Erasmus Darwin ? Did you ? Did you realise even Dawkins admits sociobiology says nothing about religion per sé ? That the Big Bang theory has nothing to do with the evolution theory ? That the Big Bang was "invented" by a Belgian priest ? That Dawkins has become a poster boy ? Did you ever hear about E.O. Wilson ?
Of course you didn't. You got an email link from somewhere
OK, creasjonists and ID doods are wacko. Not many sane people would deny that. (you have to wear tin foil hats to believe in that crap). Still, again: it all says nothing about belief or religion. And I bet you still know **** all about sociobiology.
Science is not about opinion, or even about Scoobynet approval: it's about learning ****. Start reading Edward. O. Wilson, and work your way up from there. Yeah, the ants, it's tedious, but it's important. You might become an informed atheist (G-d knows we need more of them ) And might even find Dawkins is far more known for his "opinions" than for his scientific work (and to make it even more complicated: I admire the guy in many ways)
Stop spouting email-linked opinions, start reading FFS.
#104
Originally Posted by OllyK
If we have freedom of choice then god is neither omnipotent or omniscient which is a bit of a pi$$ser for the the Judeo / Christian / Muslim religions!
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Originally Posted by MY93WRX
First point, the muslim, the Jew and the chritian God is the same god, the differance is the muslims belive Jesus was a Prophet not the sun of God and the Jewish faith belive the new testament did not happen. A muslim cleric a christean clergyman or a rabbi will confirm this for you.
Second point you have again missed the meaning of free will. If a God intervined than man no longer has free will or consequence of actions.
Third point who said he was my God, i may just be playing devils advocate with your ignorance.
Fourth point you are mistake in the bibles description/meaning of hell.
The Bible is not at all clear on the severity or the length of the torment in Hell. Many Bible verses indicate that Hell is not eternal torture, and none state that there is eternal torture. If eternal torture were true it would mean that we are to discard some Bible verses. This is forbidden, as all scripture is given by the inspiration of God (2 Tim 3:16, Rev 22:18,19). The Bible also does not say that Hell will be worse than earth is for all people who do not make it to Heaven.There will be a period of torment before eternal death for unbelievers.
Fourth point you are mistake in the bibles description/meaning of hell.
The Bible is not at all clear on the severity or the length of the torment in Hell. Many Bible verses indicate that Hell is not eternal torture, and none state that there is eternal torture. If eternal torture were true it would mean that we are to discard some Bible verses. This is forbidden, as all scripture is given by the inspiration of God (2 Tim 3:16, Rev 22:18,19). The Bible also does not say that Hell will be worse than earth is for all people who do not make it to Heaven.There will be a period of torment before eternal death for unbelievers.
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Originally Posted by MY93WRX
Doesn't prove a God didn't do it either and as has been said earlier in the thread science will never provide all the answers as when one question is answered it leads to more. Look at Stephen Hawkin, he now says he may have been wrong with his theories of Black holes, but he had all of science convinsed his THEORY was correct,
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Originally Posted by RedFive
Fuzz... can you imagine for 1 minute that I first read Dawkins in 1982 ? For my thesis ? That it made perfect sense to me ? That I'm also an atheist, pretty much hardcore. But that I also dislike (or learned to dislike) the "dedain" for religion or personal beliefs ?
Did you click on the link about Erasmus Darwin ? Did you ? Did you realise even Dawkins admits sociobiology says nothing about religion per sé ? That the Big Bang theory has nothing to do with the evolution theory ? That the Big Bang was "invented" by a Belgian priest ? That Dawkins has become a poster boy ? Did you ever hear about E.O. Wilson ?
Of course you didn't. You got an email link from somewhere
OK, creasjonists and ID doods are wacko. Not many sane people would deny that. (you have to wear tin foil hats to believe in that crap). Still, again: it all says nothing about belief or religion. And I bet you still know **** all about sociobiology.
Science is not about opinion, or even about Scoobynet approval: it's about learning ****. Start reading Edward. O. Wilson, and work your way up from there. Yeah, the ants, it's tedious, but it's important. You might become an informed atheist (G-d knows we need more of them ) And might even find Dawkins is far more known for his "opinions" than for his scientific work (and to make it even more complicated: I admire the guy in many ways)
Stop spouting email-linked opinions, start reading FFS.
Did you click on the link about Erasmus Darwin ? Did you ? Did you realise even Dawkins admits sociobiology says nothing about religion per sé ? That the Big Bang theory has nothing to do with the evolution theory ? That the Big Bang was "invented" by a Belgian priest ? That Dawkins has become a poster boy ? Did you ever hear about E.O. Wilson ?
Of course you didn't. You got an email link from somewhere
OK, creasjonists and ID doods are wacko. Not many sane people would deny that. (you have to wear tin foil hats to believe in that crap). Still, again: it all says nothing about belief or religion. And I bet you still know **** all about sociobiology.
Science is not about opinion, or even about Scoobynet approval: it's about learning ****. Start reading Edward. O. Wilson, and work your way up from there. Yeah, the ants, it's tedious, but it's important. You might become an informed atheist (G-d knows we need more of them ) And might even find Dawkins is far more known for his "opinions" than for his scientific work (and to make it even more complicated: I admire the guy in many ways)
Stop spouting email-linked opinions, start reading FFS.
I may not have done a thesis on the subject, nor would I want to, I've got better things to do with my time here.
However,
No one e-mailed me anything I've posted, It's something that I've come across whilst browsing about that particular subject because I'm interested in it, although I wont be dedicating my life to it either.
So in the nicest way possible.
And while I'm at it WTF does "dedain" mean.
Andy
Last edited by Fuzz; 13 March 2006 at 11:11 PM.
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Originally Posted by MY93WRX
MPR You're forgetting that people who are deeply religious aren't scared of dying bacause they believe there going to heaven.- so ahagin the opinion you offer has had not thopught put into it, Why can't you staunch athiasts construct an inteligent argument instead of just mouthing off! I myself am not a staunch religious person i sit on the fence most of the time but lean towards the God is something idea, i'd like to have an inteligent dabate, some post on hear (fiuzz) offer a more inteligent debate against God but the majority (mpr) can't construct an argument just an opinion thats not been thought threw!!!
If you want debate - answer all my previous points. Earth created 6500 years ago? Bible factually accurate? Woman created from Adams rib? Stoning of improperly covered women. Lets hear it then?
#109
Sorry, I was actually targetting both groups of muppets at once. I.E. you religious types (even though you partially deny it), and the ones that are brow-beaten into being religious types because they're scared of dying.
You could also do with a grammar checker, once you find the spell checker that is.
You could also do with a grammar checker, once you find the spell checker that is.
Originally Posted by MY93WRX
MPR You're forgetting that people who are deeply religious aren't scared of dying bacause they believe there going to heaven.- so ahagin the opinion you offer has had not thopught put into it, Why can't you staunch athiasts construct an inteligent argument instead of just mouthing off! I myself am not a staunch religious person i sit on the fence most of the time but lean towards the God is something idea, i'd like to have an inteligent dabate, some post on hear (fiuzz) offer a more inteligent debate against God but the majority (mpr) can't construct an argument just an opinion thats not been thought threw!!!
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if we evolved from apes/monkeys
why are the current apes and monkeys not evolving as we did
as far as i know they are still doing the same things they have always done (bar the odd trained jobbies making cups of tea)
why are the current apes and monkeys not evolving as we did
as far as i know they are still doing the same things they have always done (bar the odd trained jobbies making cups of tea)
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Originally Posted by StickyMicky
if we evolved from apes/monkeys
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Originally Posted by StickyMicky
if we evolved from apes/monkeys
why are the current apes and monkeys not evolving as we did
as far as i know they are still doing the same things they have always done (bar the odd trained jobbies making cups of tea)
why are the current apes and monkeys not evolving as we did
as far as i know they are still doing the same things they have always done (bar the odd trained jobbies making cups of tea)
a) Because Man has evolved into very much the dominant organism on Earth, we are now restricting the capabilities of other large mammals to evolve (erosion of habitat, etc). However, I believe that much smaller organisms such as viruses and bacteria are still able to mutate and evolve. We struggle to control the micro-habitats that they inhabit.
b) They are still evolving, but because of the extremely slow rate of evolution, it's not noticeable to us. Man took somehting like 10,000 years to move out of the caves and into the modern world. We've only been aware of evolution for 200 years - comparatively not much time to notice and measure evolutionary change in apes.
Go ahead, shoot me down....
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Originally Posted by Mungo
Not sure what the "official" evolutionist theory on this one is, but I'd assume that either:
a) Because Man has evolved into very much the dominant organism on Earth, we are now restricting the capabilities of other large mammals to evolve (erosion of habitat, etc). However, I believe that much smaller organisms such as viruses and bacteria are still able to mutate and evolve. We struggle to control the micro-habitats that they inhabit.
b) They are still evolving, but because of the extremely slow rate of evolution, it's not noticeable to us. Man took somehting like 10,000 years to move out of the caves and into the modern world. We've only been aware of evolution for 200 years - comparatively not much time to notice and measure evolutionary change in apes.
Go ahead, shoot me down....
a) Because Man has evolved into very much the dominant organism on Earth, we are now restricting the capabilities of other large mammals to evolve (erosion of habitat, etc). However, I believe that much smaller organisms such as viruses and bacteria are still able to mutate and evolve. We struggle to control the micro-habitats that they inhabit.
b) They are still evolving, but because of the extremely slow rate of evolution, it's not noticeable to us. Man took somehting like 10,000 years to move out of the caves and into the modern world. We've only been aware of evolution for 200 years - comparatively not much time to notice and measure evolutionary change in apes.
Go ahead, shoot me down....
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Originally Posted by RedFive
Another sloppy second:
It is known that there is an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.
It is known that there is an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Therefore, there must be a finite number of inhabited worlds. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near to nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely the product of a deranged imagination.
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I thought that was a convincing read, my only problem is this chance effect and the fact that there still had to be something in the beginning. This goes right back to the old which came first scenario of the egg and the chicken.
I can't comprehend religion to be honest, i do like facts and knowledge, religion hasn't answered my questions but you look at the effect on a vast volume of people that religion has had over the ages and then you have to wonder, then there is science which for every question it answers, poses two more possibilities into the frame. Then when you look at the universe you see how insignificant we are anyway in the scheme of things.
I am not religious in my mannerism but what is religion anyway, is it a belief? is it hope? is it just the longing for companionship in times of need? to each person it's very much an individual relationship with your subconscious self on some level leading me to belive there is no God in the normal sense but ultimatly there must have been some divine entity that instigated the first domino in the series to fall.
I can't comprehend religion to be honest, i do like facts and knowledge, religion hasn't answered my questions but you look at the effect on a vast volume of people that religion has had over the ages and then you have to wonder, then there is science which for every question it answers, poses two more possibilities into the frame. Then when you look at the universe you see how insignificant we are anyway in the scheme of things.
I am not religious in my mannerism but what is religion anyway, is it a belief? is it hope? is it just the longing for companionship in times of need? to each person it's very much an individual relationship with your subconscious self on some level leading me to belive there is no God in the normal sense but ultimatly there must have been some divine entity that instigated the first domino in the series to fall.
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Originally Posted by alloy
there still had to be something in the beginning. This goes right back to the old which came first scenario of the egg and the chicken.
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It just seems to easy, there had to have been a beginning for there to be something. I stick by guns and reiterate this comment
I can't comprehend religion to be honest, i do like facts and knowledge,
Originally Posted by alloy
I can't comprehend religion to be honest, i do like facts and knowledge,
Last edited by alloy; 14 March 2006 at 12:39 PM.
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But surely that is just once again, down to human inability to comprehend something and attaching some sort of relgious conotation to it? We don't understand the process behind the Big Bang, so it must have divine intervention?
Primitive humans probably didn't understand the process involved in procreation, doesn't mean that all births have an immacualte conception.
It still beggars belief that in the face of such an overwhelming lack of evidence of any sort whatsoever, that people can still believe in a God of any sort, especially one who preaches fear, intolerance, hatred and bigotry.
Then again, I believe that girl in accounts fancies me................
Geezer
Primitive humans probably didn't understand the process involved in procreation, doesn't mean that all births have an immacualte conception.
It still beggars belief that in the face of such an overwhelming lack of evidence of any sort whatsoever, that people can still believe in a God of any sort, especially one who preaches fear, intolerance, hatred and bigotry.
Then again, I believe that girl in accounts fancies me................
Geezer