Muslims and Christmas
12 December 2006, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by vava voom
BUT just the same to enter a bar or club...rates have trippled, water cost £3 a bottle
...lets not point the finger to one side 
...lets not point the finger to one side 
12 December 2006, 12:46 PM
#34
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Thanks for your kind comments re my post #16. Glad is was helpful to some 
Hello imi, what I wrote was a pro-Muslim post. It's as factual as I can make it; speculation in this area is extemely difficult and dangerous (that much I have learned 
). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.
The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses
As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore.
It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
Originally Posted by imi
while some of what you say is true, you make far too many assumptions and generalisations but at the end of the day, it it just your viewpoint which is fair enough.
). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses
As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore. It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
12 December 2006, 01:44 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by pimmo2000
I'm 24 so I'm only young, but in my life I've seen a stupid amount of changes in the way people act and think.Freedom of speech and all that and yet as posted on here some people are scared to have Christmas Decs in case it offends someone ?
I just wanted to post up my thoughts on Muslims.
I received a Christmas card from a Muslim friend of mine today, he went out and bought a card that celebrates something he doesnt believe in. Why ? because he respects other peoples right to believe and practice what they like.
In my opinon everyone is entitled to believe what they like and I was moved by this gesture of good will!!!
Just wanted to say Seasons Greetings to everyone and this is my proof that the only Muslims we hear about are the bad ones !
Merry Christmas
12 December 2006, 06:14 PM
#36
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Thanks for your kind comments re my post #16. Glad is was helpful to some
Hello imi, what I wrote was a pro-Muslim post. It's as factual as I can make it; speculation in this area is extemely difficult and dangerous (that much I have learned ). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.
The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore.
It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
Hello imi, what I wrote was a pro-Muslim post. It's as factual as I can make it; speculation in this area is extemely difficult and dangerous (that much I have learned
). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses
As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore. It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
A very well informed and REPRESENTATIVE account of what is actually happening Richard. You have, in two posts probably shown more knowledge about Islam and the interpretation thereof than most muslims themsleves. Indeed as you have pointed out all religions texts have a capacity for being interpreted in differing ways, Islam is no different. The Clerics aren't all holier than thou, some have personal agenda others are influenced by people and organisations. If Islam was practised in it's purest form (I'm no expert I hasten to add) there wouldn't be any killings or terrorism. There would be no suicide bombers killing innocent civilians. I often wonder why I spend so much time on Scoobynet, reading your posts Richard seems to justify my addiction.
Last edited by Maz; 12 December 2006 at 06:17 PM.
12 December 2006, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
Let's be honest though, not once have I ever heard a Muslim complain about Xmas.
The only people that have an issues are those pathetic little worms that are in councils and management of some companies.
The only people that have an issues are those pathetic little worms that are in councils and management of some companies.
kiwi God bless u , so true, people dont realise that, its the so called secularists and councils who cause the probs
personally i send xmas cards and gifts tae my mates and even get them back
merry xmas
and all of u
12 December 2006, 07:07 PM
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also personally im school and nursery i loved xmas, we got tae decorate tree's wae tinsel and make xmas cakes and decor
and my lil girl loves it tae, i wont stop any kid from learning aboot other faiths and i loved it all diwali, chinese new yr, eid, xmas and vaiaskahi etc
its sad at my lil girls nursery, u cant call a blackboard a blackboard and baa baa black sheep is banned
its ****e, no blacks complained but these sick councils stopped it
someone has tae stop it
and my lil girl loves it tae, i wont stop any kid from learning aboot other faiths and i loved it all diwali, chinese new yr, eid, xmas and vaiaskahi etc
its sad at my lil girls nursery, u cant call a blackboard a blackboard and baa baa black sheep is banned
its ****e, no blacks complained but these sick councils stopped it
someone has tae stop it
12 December 2006, 07:07 PM
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If it were Muslims, you'd never hear the last of it - but as persecuting Jews is so last century, we can imagine that this story won't get very far: BBC NEWS | Americas | Festive trees back at US airport
12 December 2006, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Brendan Hughes
If it were Muslims, you'd never hear the last of it - but as persecuting Jews is so last century, we can imagine that this story won't get very far: BBC NEWS | Americas | Festive trees back at US airport
lol i read it earlier and did u watch daily edition by john stewart , i luv that guy
one of his funny journalists went oot and spotted some jews and asked them tae wish everyone happy xmas and also tae jews
lol it woz wicked
12 December 2006, 08:28 PM
#42
Originally Posted by moses
also personally im school and nursery i loved xmas, we got tae decorate tree's wae tinsel and make xmas cakes and decor
and my lil girl loves it tae, i wont stop any kid from learning aboot other faiths and i loved it all diwali, chinese new yr, eid, xmas and vaiaskahi etc
its sad at my lil girls nursery, u cant call a blackboard a blackboard and baa baa black sheep is banned
its ****e, no blacks complained but these sick councils stopped it
someone has tae stop it
and my lil girl loves it tae, i wont stop any kid from learning aboot other faiths and i loved it all diwali, chinese new yr, eid, xmas and vaiaskahi etc
its sad at my lil girls nursery, u cant call a blackboard a blackboard and baa baa black sheep is banned
its ****e, no blacks complained but these sick councils stopped it
someone has tae stop it
Yes quite daft indeed banning blackboards and baa baa black sheep!
I grew up singing baa baa black sheep and thought it was quite a catchy little number. Madness of the highest order it is!
12 December 2006, 08:39 PM
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ok, reading what you muzzers have put down why dont the bmc come on telly and announce such things ?
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
12 December 2006, 08:47 PM
#45
Originally Posted by gatty
ok, reading what you muzzers have put down why dont the bmc come on telly and announce such things ?
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
I do. I had a chat with my son's headteacher and explained all my concerns. Trouble is nobody could pinpoint who was making these silly policies.
12 December 2006, 08:48 PM
#46
Originally Posted by gatty
ok, reading what you muzzers have put down why dont the bmc come on telly and announce such things ?
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
if you feel strongly that outsiders are implomenting muslim happy slogans just to keep the ethnics happy, and all there doing is bringing attention to somthing that does'nt **** you muslims off anyway!
stand up and say KEEP.. BAH BAH BLACK SHEEP and BLACK BOARD wtf! do it for the sake of everyone.
I might make a complaint to HR about the use of whiteboards.
12 December 2006, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
I might make a complaint to HR about the use of whiteboards.
12 December 2006, 10:36 PM
#49
Originally Posted by gatty
have you ever seen them home office adverts , making you aware about leaving your windows open and the other one where that guy had his mobile left out on the table in the pub ?.....all the victims were ethnic and the crook was white.........wtf . about time the home office showed a bit of bollox and base these adverts on pro rata fact . the adverts might look different.
13 December 2006, 12:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Hoppy
Thanks for your kind comments re my post #16. Glad is was helpful to some
Hello imi, what I wrote was a pro-Muslim post. It's as factual as I can make it; speculation in this area is extemely difficult and dangerous (that much I have learned ). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.
The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore.
It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
Hello imi, what I wrote was a pro-Muslim post. It's as factual as I can make it; speculation in this area is extemely difficult and dangerous (that much I have learned
). Basically, all I am saying in post #16 is that the Koran is fundamentally not a 'bad' guide, and that Muslims are not automatically driven to wipe out western society or to batter our Christian values into oblivion. But if you want the Koran to tell you that, it's easy enough to find an approriate text, and very few people are in a position of knowledge to contradict you. This is dangerous, as we know only too well.The same can be said of the Bible, and Lord knows that book has been used to commit horrendous crimes over the centuries. In fact, history is litered with religious uprisings of all shades, colours and cultures, and religion has been used to wage wars by numerous international empires (tribes if you like) over thousands of years. It's been happening for ever
But if I may express a personal view based on the current Middle East conflict, it has given me a new outlook on life and human values. I am not a Christian, but my Humanist values run very close. I used to believe them to be RIGHT and while for me they still are, I must accept that for others the game is played very differently.
Death, and killing for example. That I am against capital punishment states my position, but in many other societies, killling another person is both fully legal and quite likely to gain you hero status (as opposed to life imprisonment). Incredibly, it is even okay to kill members of your own family under certain faiths and tragic circumstances.
I/we must accept this, and accept many of the other ways of living around the world that we don't much care for. Who are we to judge? Who is Bush/Blair to judge? Sure, when attacked we should DEFEND our people and country, our values and our culture to the last man standing. But that doesn't mean marching around the globe telling everybody else how to live there lives.
I thought we'd learned that lesson in Vietnam, but apparently not. Maybe Iraq will bring us to our senses
As the allied forces inevitably pull out of Iraq in the next couple of years, it will not be a sight for the squeamish Brits and Americans. But there will be millions of Iraqis rejoicing in the gore. It's a strange world. Happy Christmas.
Richard.
hello zionist jew, wherever their is **** tae stir, hoppy the zionist jew will always be their
13 December 2006, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Drunken Bungle *****
Thank you for a top post! I dipped into NSR only to be met with the usual million or so posts whinging and wining over the same old things..... And then this one - thank you!
oh my God, where u been luv haha
awww been ages, hows stef say merry xmas tae him and kisses tae him too plz
13 December 2006, 02:55 AM
#53
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Originally Posted by red_dog104
My local Indian/Pakistani take away have sent me christmas card
13 December 2006, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by moses
hello zionist jew, wherever their is **** tae stir, hoppy the zionist jew will always be their
Get real man.I am not a Jew, if you can read.
If my posts are ****-stirring, you haven't understood them. They're rather the opposisite from your Muslim point of view, I'd have thought.
Anyway, I thought you'd been locked up. Bloody well should be, you lunatic terrorist menace, or have you now changed your mind about wanting to wipe out Israel, and sympathising with the 911 bombers? (Don't go back-pedalling now; it's all on record.)
Think on this: I sat in a suicide bomber's bar in Tel Aviv which was hit a couple of years ago. It's a lively western place, right on the beautiful beach front, with lots of dancing and live music. Four died, and at an average of eight pints of blood per body, that's eight gallons sloshing around the floor. Not to mention limbs flung through windows and up the road, dozens horrifically maimed, lumps of flesh dripping from the ceiling, and the screams from hell deafening the air. I could go on. Are you proud of this?
Richard.
PS Edited to add, while in Israel, I posted stuff on my brother's PC. It sits in the bomb room, which is steel lined, has a door so heavy it takes two to close it, has its own electricity supply, and a 15mm thick steel shutter. The gas masks are kept downstairs. All houses built since 1952 (I think) are like this. Not the same in cosy Scotland, is it? Now Hezbollah/Hamas are digging tunnels in Gaza and filling them with more bombs and missiles. Islam might not be evil per se, but those who fight (or sympathise) in the name of Allah most certainly are.
Last edited by Hoppy; 13 December 2006 at 05:42 AM.
13 December 2006, 07:11 AM
#55
Originally Posted by Hoppy
I am a Zionist because we (Britain) set up the state of Israel and we should stand by our word. That is the definition of Zionist, nothing more. And by the same token, the British Government is Zionist. And so is the United Nations Get real man.
Get real man. Israel was setup by corrupt politicians and by the influence that the Jewish had in Britain.
You're not a Jew? You sound like one trying to play the victim. Quite pathetic really.
13 December 2006, 07:16 AM
#56
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Think on this: I sat in a suicide bomber's bar in Tel Aviv which was hit a couple of years ago. It's a lively western place, right on the beautiful beach front, with lots of dancing and live music. Four died, and at an average of eight pints of blood per body, that's eight gallons sloshing around the floor. Not to mention limbs flung through windows and up the road, dozens horrifically maimed, lumps of flesh dripping from the ceiling, and the screams from hell deafening the air. I could go on. Are you proud of this?
13 December 2006, 09:21 AM
#58
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Anyway, I thought you'd been locked up. Bloody well should be, you lunatic terrorist menace, or have you now changed your mind about wanting to wipe out Israel, and sympathising with the 911 bombers? (Don't go back-pedalling now; it's all on record.)
Please consider yourself 'green blobbed' for that comment
13 December 2006, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
Probably as proud as you are when you cluster bomb areas, steal land and force Palestinians to be 2nd class citizens much like the ***** did to others in WW2. As proud as you were when the Irgun bombed the Start of David hotel?
But I also condemn the perpetual terrorist attacks against Israel, and those who call for the destruction of their State. It is evil, even according most Muslim beliefs, utterly pointless, and deliberately highly provocative. Yet neither am I proposing for a second that Tehran and Damascus should be flattened, which what these terrorists - including many resident in Britain - want to see happen to Israel.
The underlying theme of my posts on this subject is live and let live. I would have thought that was clear enough by now
Richard.
Last edited by Hoppy; 13 December 2006 at 01:27 PM.