Kosy

iTrader: (2)

On the emissions issue.

How come Mitsi can get the EVO 6 and 7 past these tests without
reducing its output compared to Japan?
The EVO Extreme has got through the net too depite having 340 bhp.

Is it because they have lower emissions than the Impreza?

Vate

What's all this power malarky?
I never thought people would buy an impreza for it's straight line speed. The things which really make these cars great is their ability to cover distance across country fast not the 0-60, top speed or 1/4 mile times. I'm sure the same rules apply to MY01 as to all previous incarnations. Power obviously makes a big difference but so does torque (no one seems to care about this beautiful commodity. Sort out the breathing shore up your brakes so you can hit them that little bit later with confidence and without squirming down the road (this doesn't mean the biggest you can lay your hands on!) set the geometry and suspension up correctly and a car with great traction has superb handling characteristics too. I friend of mine has a porche boxster S. A great car. In a straight line it's faster than my MY00 (just) but from point to point.....well, goodbye. Another friend has a 935 flatnose with twin turbos. Straight line, well it would probably give a a 747 a run for it's money but across the open countryside it just isnt as fast. The P1 has it's very special place because it was an STi that was set up correctly for typical UK roads. Personally I would have liked to have seen a little less emphasis on styling and more effort on the setting up but people cry out to look special too. An impreza will never be a wolf in shheps clothing but the P1 IMHO should have been more of a sleeper. Just think, no need to worry about bubbling paint on your P1 spoiler if you don't have one :-)
I'm rambling now. Sorry! 30bhp more delivered at 5000rpm will make little difference to point to point driving when compared to the suspension being perfect and brakes just so. My money will not go on the best rolling road performer. If it did, well, it would be a Brabus E-class for me. Mmmmmmm yes!

Gordo

I'm afraid my **** isn't big enough to contribute to this erudite debate.

Gordo

Josh L

First of all Aaron, Pleeeeeeeeeease let go of your anger. You are no longer a P1 owner, and your personally experiences of P1 ownership are far from typical.

Back to subject in hand. I would agree with Roger though regarding the comparison test that Evo did. Quite apart from the fact that it was my P1 that came out on top, we were given the opportunity to drive the STi VII. Personally, I thought it was a great car, but totally different, in almost every respect, to the previous model. You simply can't compare the two. Both are good in different areas.

Also, the economy and import restrictions have changed dramatically over the last couple of years. The P1 was priced when there were still waiting lists, and very high residuals, but whatever you say the Impreza still looses less than most regular cars.

I am considering the STi, but I'm reluctant to part with the P1, and there would have to be a few more changes before I would be swayed.

Josh

Vate

One more piece of scholarly advice.........
try, www.*****-enlargement-product.com
Shame to lose some valuable contribution when the problem can be sorted out by a bit of after market tuning. Hey, I detect a how can I make my BHP bigger than yours type of debate here!

chiark

Kosy - good point - dunno for definite, but I suspect that EVOs come through the SVA route, each and every one of 'em.

The STI has been completely homologated against Euro standards and has a certificate of conformity. The EVO, as I understand it, hasn't.

What this actually means to punters is another question... Still, after you've bought it you can start removing everything restrictive. Hmm.

I do like Adam's suggestion tho...

Nick.

Imago

Have Prodrive confirmed that there will be a performance pack for the STi?

My dealer told me that he would be very surprised if Prodrive ever produce one. His reasoning was that Subaru had to spend a lot of development time and money to get the STi into the UK in the first place. The only way to get back all the power whilst meeting the UK requirements would be for Prodrive to reproduce the work they did on the P1 and as such this would probably put the cars price up to one similar to the P1.

We all know the problems the dealers had selling the P1 so would they have a similar problem selling a 30K+ STi? I can see his point, also if the dealers are not enthusiastic I doubt Prodrive will bother. Of course time will tell.

Also I prefer 2 doors to 4 doors, will Subaru ever bring in a 2 door STi?

Also I previously owned an RB5 WRSport which because it had the ppp cost me £1,100 per year in insurance, I have just got two quotes for an unmodified P1 of £670 and £715 including protected NCB. Those mods sure add to the running costs.

Also the P1 was a limited edition whilst the STi is a full production car. I bet the P1 will hold its value better over time.

In the end it is surely down to personal preference, I personally think that at the moment, with the current P1 prices around £26k, that the P1 is better value than a new STi. Things will of course change in time, after all there will never be any more P1s.

Mick

chiark

Imago, now they've got the CoC, they can sell the car anywhere in Europe. After it's sold, modifications can be made that completely invalidate the CoC as it's just got to pass an MOT in 3 year's time... The MOT's requirements are a lot less stringent.

This is why the PPP has ALWAYS been an add-on, and it's why the UK300 PPP has to be fitted after you've bought the car in theory.

Nick.

RogerE

Josh,

At last! someone on the same wavelength. Great pictures by the way.

Like you I too am considering the new STI, however, the P1 is just that little bit special, and as Imago says there will only ever be 1000 of them (or less now with a few being written off).

Its amazing how polarised views are on the P1, people either love it or they hate it.

I would still like to hear what Chins has to say on this subject or has he deserted Scoobynet since he got his M3?

wilf

I think there is alot of unfounded resentment for the P1 stirred up by IM's overpricing and botched launch.

Last night I was re-reading Autocar's best handling car test for 2000 issue. If the P1 was such a boat how come it was friendliest in the wet and in the top 5 (not ranked) of a field of 15 overall along with Noble, 911 GT3, Exige and 340R. Also remember the best car in the real world test in EVO second to Ferrari 550 ain't bad.

Im fed up with people slagging it off and thats why I waste my time responding to these threads. Its a good car. Sure STi V is cheaper but its an import and it is worth less second hand. The P1 remains best official UK Scoob (22b aside).

ARRON BIRD

Josh I`m sorry to dissagree with you as you are a thoroughly nice bloke.
The residuals for any rally based car are now shot and thats it.

mutant_matt

Gordo & Vate,

???? I don't see this turning into a Max BHP is all thread? Just a reasonable debate invloving varying opinions from P1 owners and others.....

RogerE, in general I think you're probably right but I don't hate the P1 but I'm not sure I'd buy one either. I'm a little un-decided to be honest. I like them but I don't think I'd buy one, but this doesn't make me a "hater"

Wilf, "The P1 remains best official UK Scoob (22b aside)" - isn't that what this thread is discussing? And why 22B aside, there are/were 16 official UK ones so you might argue ( ) that this was/is the best official UK Scoob

Aaron, I think you're right about the residuals for "rally based cars" but you really do need to let this one go now For your own sanity m8

Matt

Vate

m_m
Sorry m8, you are of course right.
Too many people start talking about power differences in an argument where it's not really relevant this was my (very distorted/sidetracked) point.

As a total driving package for road use the WR RB5 cannot be ignored and this does have some of the advantages of the 2 door because of the improved rigidity of the body shell owing to the lack of split folding rear seats.

The STi with the fancy bodywork mods which have very little effect on performance during road use is IMHO probably not as good value as a driving package as a P1 was or is now. I would imagine that the cost of developing the mods for the P1 for such a limited number of cars tuned for UK roads mean it was actually cheap when new. An STi in 'European' guise is just a choked Japanese STi and will not be as perfectly balanced on UK roads as a standard P1.

By the way I'd have em all if the wife would allow it!!

Gordo

m_m

the nature of the question instantly polarised the debate into a subjective (and oft repeated) argument about handling/torque ratios/***** sizes etc. Perhaps a better question would have been "who would still choose a P1 given the new STi that is on offer?"

and, for any girls reading this, I was only joking. My **** is massive.

Gordo

ARRON BIRD

Matt i`m fighting back the tears mate
My post wasnt intended to go this way really and I really dont give a to55 about the P1 as its now gone.
Everyone seems to miss-interperate my mission
I have NEVER said the P1 is a bad car. It was simply WEL overpriced and I took the bait.
Dont however any of you think that your special this and that will hold its money better than that cos it just aint gonna happen.
I`m in the fortunate position at the moment that I could sell the Beemer at the moment and probably make a few quid. Great pub bull**** but am I gonna sell it ..............nah. I`d miss all that third gear spinning up and sideways action.
It really is a special car .
It has real soul.
When you drive one you will realise just how easy the Subaru`s are to drive quickly.
This car demands serious respect:d
Laters.

[Edited by ARRON BIRD - 12/15/2001 9:06:08 AM]

ARRON BIRD

All quiet now and calm.........hmmmmmmmmmm

Spudgun GTR

are they pricing the sti7 low because they want to make sure they shift 'em before the redesigned one is released in 2003?

P1Fanatic

Yep thats what Im hoping - the intro of the STI type UK lowers the price of second hand P1's.

The P1 is a far better looking car IMHO. It is a faster car - the stats Ive seen on the Sti indicate it is only significantly faster than the standard WRX. All u seem to be paying extra for is the 6 spd gearbox and the pink Sti logos located on the driving light covers, front grille, seats, intercooler and dash dials. The wheels are just the gold version of the standard WRX 17" unlike the 18" OZ's on the UK300.

Its those damn bug eyed headlights. P1 every time for me.

jeremy

Does anyone really know if the new UK sti is the same as the jap spec one? Might have Prodrive modified the suspension a bit? If not would not the use of Prodrive springs solve the UK roads problem? Or have they not been made yet??

Confused?

RogerE

I saw an article in Autocar last week that Subaru are giving a £2k discount on the WRX to shift them. Could it be that the new shape is not popular as the old? and maybe this is why the new STI7 is being aggresively priced.

We will have to wait and see if P1 prices fall.

ARRON BIRD

Mate P1 prices ahve already fallen off the Earth.
Like I say theres a price you think something is worth and a real world price.