pimmo2000

iTrader: (6)

I'd run in for my family, but you can burn

Abdabz

I know one full time fireman and he does gardens in his spare time and does quite nicely from it.
So based on my scientific study 100% of firemen have second jobs
Easy Life Sleeping, gardening and squirting...

swampster

iTrader: (1)

Why do you think they were against proposed plans the last time they were on strike..

"Yes you can have a whopping pay rise, but we're changing the way you work" kind of thing... i.e more realistic shifts of 8 hours, but a 5 day working week, oh and we're thinking about banning you from striking like the police & military. Most of them would lose out, when they have to give up on their primary salary.. that being their alternative employment/business.

IMHO.. they should get a good wage for what they do, and I have no objection to them sleeping or whatever when not on call.. I'd rather have a rested fireman who wasn't knackered when they turned up to hose my house down.. however I think the last time they went on strike they lost an awful lot of public support and goodwill, when it was compared what they actually do week on week in relation to say for example members of the armed forces.

Appropriately puts flame suit on!...

pimmo2000

iTrader: (6)

Sounds like my dad, only he's a **** star

kbsub

Sound's like firemen are about as popular as truck drivers

p1mark

People are missing the point.

They are being paid - and let's face it not spectacular wages - to sit around and wait for whatever hapens. This could be to get a cat down from a tree, or it could be to go into a life threatening situation. At which point they are being vastly underpaid. This may not happen during an individuals service but the fact is if the call comes they will have to do it.

I for one don't begrudge paying taxes for fire services, having seen some in action at a major fire at my place of work. If i wanted to be rude i could say they are a necessary evil but the fact is there may well come a time when they risk their own life to save yours as part of the job.

Leslie

Rather like servicemen they are on duty in case an emergency occurs and they quite reasonably expect to be paid while they are on duty. Should a emergency crop up then they are available to deal with it and hopefully rested and fit.

The cost of their pay should be treated as a necessary insurance against the disasters that can happen to us. Like servicemen they are prepared to risk their lives to save us when the job requires.

All this carping about their pay is disgraceful and those who do so should be ashamed.

Les

Prasius

iTrader: (1)

Compared to the military, police, medial staff, civil service; their pay is comparable to the rest of us.

There certainly isn't much support for them in the military, for obvious reasons I think, and actually, the opinion the police hold of them isn't a great deal different (those police officers I know anyhow).

The thing that made me laugh was when they were complaining about how "dangerous" their jobs are.. what the hell did they think they were getting into? An episode of Fireman Sam??

Hoppy

Well said, Les

You other guys can moan all you like, but when you're really in the ****, our emergency services are superb.

Here's an easy test: drive at high speed into a tree. Make sure you break both legs and have to be cut out by the fire service

Richard.

Prasius

iTrader: (1)

...when they're not striking anyhow.

Paddi70

Bugger someone's been switching my keys around again

wide

Well Im off down the pub tonight and I will be served by a fella who is a plasterer in the day, then I may pop in the club and 2 of the ladies will be serving one is a mental health nurse and the other works as a nursery teacher. Its amazing how its always just "Firemen" have second jobs, some numbskulls must read too much Viz.
Every bodies at it, get over it

swampster

iTrader: (1)

I think the point people are making is whilst yeah people have 2nd and sometimes 3rd jobs, they often do them at night time over and above their daily 9-5, they don't get 3-4 days off a week to pursue them.

Like I said in my earlier post I don't begrudge them what they are paid, they should be paid well... but they lose a lot of support when they go on strike moaning about how bad their conditions of employment are and they're doing such a dangerous job etc etc while your average squaddie gets paid far less, is probably doing a more dangerous job(these days), works more hours, is separated from friends & family for months, only to get back and have to do a fireman's job because they're on strike!

Why should they be able to strike if the military and the police can't?

firesorter

just a point, we cost you the tax payer £32 (average depending on where you live) A YEAR! per tax paying head per household. how much does your car or house insurance cost and will they be there within 10 minutes of the occurence?

as i have said before it was my life choice to pursue this career for those that screwed it up and chose something hard well who`s the stupid one.

and as for the military personnel they are queuing round the block to join us when they leave active service.

swampster

iTrader: (1)

Probably 'cos they've seen how much of a cushy number it is after doing it so many times..

firesorter

they actually only did it for 27 days in total and that was back in 2002, jeez its like arguing with a women

wide

Like I said people should get over it

Paddi70

Is that all, cool. So hows going to do it next time?

swampster

iTrader: (1)

You obviously failed to see these:
<----

Now that's just like arguing with a women; missing my point (and seemingly Prasius') completely.. and then missing the off the cuff humour to lighten the tone!

I would like to apologise here and now to any observant women around these parts!

PG

Unfortunately or fortunately depending on your viewpoint this is rarely the case nowadays.
The organisation is now as much a proactive one as a reactive one. (**** me! I’m starting to sound like one of them now!!) For many, many years the fire service has provided forms of community work, be it attending fetes, fitting smoke detectors or school visits. Throughout these times it was just something we did however it is now a legislative responsibility to provide a level of Community Fire Safety that based on local strategic plans will actively reduce fires, RTCs ect.
Last set we had work experience kids in, 2 nurseries, 1 school visit and half a dozen home fire safety visits. It all sound cooshie but it’s all about educating people not to have fires now. This takes up a huge percentage of our sitting around time.
The business management ideology has well and truly hit the fire service and many may well think this is a good thing and in some respects it will be. No longer will there be the promotions within the old boys network just because your face fits (well less chance of it) but this is leading to Brigades recruiting potential managers as opposed to practically minded firefighters (you’ll rarely find a tradesman as a recruit now) this in turn has the potentially useless operational firefighter pushed into promotion as they are seen to be better suited to run Health and safety forums, HR workshops ect. These managers however will eventually end up taking charge of a shift of real world firefighters who should pay heed to these book based fireground managers …..a recipe for disaster.
Do I have the right to complain about how things are managed if I am not willing to be a manager myself? Been there, done that in another job and tbh I wouldn’t thank you for a manager’s job. We are now seeing people join the job and leaving a short time later something I never though I’d see but it’s a sign that either people are disillusioned with the job or indeed the wrong people are being recruited now.
Politics is now a big part of the organisation. The Chief officers are now so far removed from the job and the feelings of the workforce that as long as they are collecting their Queen’s Fire Service medal and are able to cut costs year on year to justify their massive pay, they will be content to cut the quality of service to the end user…..The general public.
There is often the argument that the job is dangerous blah, blah, blah. Sure, the potential for danger is there but to be honest with the amount of training we do day on day these risks are dramatically reduced. This training again takes up a lot of time.
I can only speak for my station but we sit with rescue fire appliances, an aerial appliance, a mass decontamination unit, a hazardous materials unit and a heavy rescue unit which responds to RTCs, building collapses, chemical jobs, ect. Now it’s not every day these are used but this is not to say that the equipment sits idle. We have to familiarise and train with the literally 100’s of pieces of equipment as much as we can so as to be 100% proficient with it when called to use it. It’s fastly becoming a case of jack of all trades, master of none.
It’s OK, I can hear you say it!! If this is the case then why not train instead of getting some kip. A valid point but most fire stations are within the middle of cities, I’m sure many residents would complain about noise. This will no doubt be addressed when Brigades roll out the Integrated Risk Management Plans (See told you they were speaking business bullsh!t now) It will ultimately see less fire cover, the scrapping of minimum time turnout targets and fire stations relocated to retail or business park areas, further away from life risk (not to mention freeing up valuable real estate) once the managers make the statistics work for them as opposed to the public.
I love my job, there are very few jobs out there where the camaraderie and strong family feeling can be had at work and as much as I see the job going to ruin I will try to remain positive about it all. The job satisfaction I get surpasses anything else I have done professionally and I hope it will continue like that until I retire.
I realise this is a little disjointed but I'm typing as I think and it may have wandered off somewhat from the original point but hey, that’s what SN is all about!


Oh, and occasionally we get to go to fires……or failures as management like to call them

PG

Holy **** !!
Did I just write all that?
Sorry

swampster

iTrader: (1)

Yeah.. you did.. you're at work aren't you!

Tidgy

FFS, whoever the inspectors are need to get the fooking sack, what a complete waste of tax payers money, and they wonder y no one wants to join the emergency services when they have to put up with stupidity like that.

PG

But which one of my many jobs?
That is the question!

PG

Thats the thin end of the wedge Tidgy.
There are audit officers appearing on the fireground doing time in motion ect whilst people are hanging out windows needing help.

thesyn

Everyone's a critic !

Tidgy

same old same old i supose, official bodies couldn't organise a **** up in a brewry.

so many people wanting to get there say that nothing gets doen.

y do you think wembly stadium cost so much? if they left it to a private contractor instead of the government trying to get involved then would have been completed on time and on budget

swampster

iTrader: (1)

My uncle, was in the Fire Service.. was quite high up in the ranks apparentl an "area" somaty other. He was quite vociferous against all the politics that was creeping in, one of his main concerns was recruitment, i.e the wrong type of person getting into the service, he was dead against positive discrimination if the beneficiaries were not "upto the job" as he put it. All this earned him was falling out of grace with the top brass and eventually getting censured.

He basically quit the service he'd served in for 40 odd years.. as it were on "ill health" grounds maintaining his full pension if he left quietly so to speak!

Tidgy

don't blame him tbh, bit like universities now, there so obssesed with high entrance figures they havn't though if they are letting in dumb ***** who just don't have the ability and brains to be at university

Daz34

Yes people now join, cost a small fortune to train and leave a few years after, being disillusioned with management policies & support, and low morale.
There is no longer a decent pension to keep them in now either.
Just like the police and ambulance services have been experiencing for a while now.

Whilst dealing with a severe house fire that was in danger of spreading to adjacent properties through the roof spaces, I was once asked amongst other things by one such officer if 'I had considered ordering toilet facilities yet?'
I nearly walked off the fireground and went home