Cornish Locals get extreme
polgreen avenue and the like are full of the free loading *******
although I hear hayle is catching up
19 June 2007, 01:36 PM
#94
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Err no, Les. Some of us have a life and unlike yourself spending time online at the weekend is not one of them unless I'm totally bored. Yesterday afternoon was spent picking up the detritus left over from the London - Brighton bike ride which unfortunately we have to do every year but at least we got some free beer out of it from the pub which made a fortune.
As I've said from the outset, I can understand why there is resentment towards second home owners in any area but the parochial NIMBYISM displayed by yourself with a total reluctance to acknowledge that they bring anything into the economy is astounding. If (and its a big if) they spend only two weeks per annum then they'd be classified as tourists which you've already admitted brings something into the economy but you simply won't be able to admit that because you're so bitter and twisted about it.
Interesting to note, that despite all your bleating you've yet to acknowledge that there are properties available in Cornwall from £80k to £150k which is a not unreasonable price band.
Any chance of an apology to all those Scoobynetters who live in properties valued around this mark? I mean, insinuating that they all live in 'hovels' is a bit rich even coming from you.
To be fair to Matt, he's admitted that second home owners do put something tangible into the local economy and that some trades are benefitting as I have done with some of his points - neither element can take the moral high ground here.
Some of the comments on this thread are symptomatic of the ingrained envy culture that is prevalent in British society. Nothing else. Go to many other parts of the world and second home ownership is prevalent, its the norm and people understand and accept it. You'd think that all these second home owners were high earning toffs buying up multi-million pound homes and its probably this image which kicks in people's envy but its not. Get on any flight to Spain, Portugal, Italy or France and the second home owners you'll meet are regular joes, tradesmen, secretaries, clerical workers, middle-management types or whatever - they cover a broad cross section of society. Their profile won't fit your perceptions because they won't fit on your hate list and I know you'll now respond by completely failing to address any of my points because that's the way you post.
Cue self indulgent rant from Les...
As I've said from the outset, I can understand why there is resentment towards second home owners in any area but the parochial NIMBYISM displayed by yourself with a total reluctance to acknowledge that they bring anything into the economy is astounding. If (and its a big if) they spend only two weeks per annum then they'd be classified as tourists which you've already admitted brings something into the economy but you simply won't be able to admit that because you're so bitter and twisted about it.
Interesting to note, that despite all your bleating you've yet to acknowledge that there are properties available in Cornwall from £80k to £150k which is a not unreasonable price band.
Any chance of an apology to all those Scoobynetters who live in properties valued around this mark? I mean, insinuating that they all live in 'hovels' is a bit rich even coming from you.
To be fair to Matt, he's admitted that second home owners do put something tangible into the local economy and that some trades are benefitting as I have done with some of his points - neither element can take the moral high ground here.
Some of the comments on this thread are symptomatic of the ingrained envy culture that is prevalent in British society. Nothing else. Go to many other parts of the world and second home ownership is prevalent, its the norm and people understand and accept it. You'd think that all these second home owners were high earning toffs buying up multi-million pound homes and its probably this image which kicks in people's envy but its not. Get on any flight to Spain, Portugal, Italy or France and the second home owners you'll meet are regular joes, tradesmen, secretaries, clerical workers, middle-management types or whatever - they cover a broad cross section of society. Their profile won't fit your perceptions because they won't fit on your hate list and I know you'll now respond by completely failing to address any of my points because that's the way you post.
Cue self indulgent rant from Les...
The rest of what you wrote is a load of old cobblers full of assumptions because you are scraping the barrel in an effort to justify your previous innacurate and generalised statements.
Far from being biased, Matt and I amongst others were telling you the facts as we see them by virtue of the fact that we live in the area.
Les
19 June 2007, 02:01 PM
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19 June 2007, 03:51 PM
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Pretty predictably you have ignored what people who live in this part of the world have told you and who might well be considered to have a much more accurate knowledge of the situation than you have. You have basically misquoted what Matt said about second home owners anyway.
The rest of what you wrote is a load of old cobblers full of assumptions because you are scraping the barrel in an effort to justify your previous innacurate and generalised statements.
Far from being biased, Matt and I amongst others were telling you the facts as we see them by virtue of the fact that we live in the area.
Les
The rest of what you wrote is a load of old cobblers full of assumptions because you are scraping the barrel in an effort to justify your previous innacurate and generalised statements.
Far from being biased, Matt and I amongst others were telling you the facts as we see them by virtue of the fact that we live in the area.
Les
Still no reply on your assertion that sub £150k houses are hovels? So tell us, which part of Cornwall do you live? Just for the record?
20 June 2007, 01:14 PM
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Les, you really are a miserable old sod. The reason you can't admit that you've failed to look a the bigger picture is because it doesn't suit your distorted view of the world.
Still no reply on your assertion that sub £150k houses are hovels? So tell us, which part of Cornwall do you live? Just for the record?
Still no reply on your assertion that sub £150k houses are hovels? So tell us, which part of Cornwall do you live? Just for the record?
With respect to the cost of a decent home at an affordable price, I refer you to the answer given at least twice by Matt in his posts. Do you really expect me to publish my address on the Internet? Certainly not just for the likes of you. I have said I live in the West Country and see the effects described by Matt and others for myself which good enough for this thread. How well do you know the West Country?
For some reason you seem to have developed some kind of animosity towards me and I do not know the reason although I have a pretty strong suspicion about that. I am not bothered about that of course. Whatever it is, you are allowing this to blind you to the facts of this discussion. This is no way to carry on since you have ignored completely what other people who are also experienced in that they live down here, have told you about the true effects of second home owners, and the costs of a decent home.
You have been criticised both politely and pretty directly on this thread by other posters-I recommend that you go back and read those posts again.
Les
20 June 2007, 01:35 PM
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Les, apparently he is always right and then fades away with his arguments with comments such as
You only have to go back to the fox hunting threads to see this.
I cannot be bothered to indulge you in debate as you're already slipping into your hysterical mode
You only have to go back to the fox hunting threads to see this.
20 June 2007, 01:38 PM
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20 June 2007, 02:08 PM
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With respect to the cost of a decent home at an affordable price, I refer you to the answer given at least twice by Matt in his posts. Do you really expect me to publish my address on the Internet? Certainly not just for the likes of you. I have said I live in the West Country and see the effects described by Matt and others for myself which good enough for this thread. How well do you know the West Country?
Les
Les
As I said at the beginning, your posting is formulaic and quite frankly I'm not the first to pull you up on it and I doubt I'll be the last.
I showed you how to look up house prices online and you've refused to acknowledge that its possible to buy housing from £80k upwards. Instead you condemned them as 'hovels'.
I asked you which bit of Cornwall you lived in, not your home address. Instead you've blustered over that by claiming not to want to put your address online - which I didn't ask for. The reason I queried which bit of Cornwall you live in is that I don't believe you actually live in Cornwall. In answer to your question, no, I haven't lived in Cornwall as such but I've spent plenty of time with relatives in the Porthleven area to know that the situation isn't as clear cut as you'd like to believe.
As I've said repeatedly, neither 'side' can take the moral high ground because the issue is not as simplistic as that. There are faults on both sides, just as both sides bring something to the table.
You even try to drag New Labour into the thread. What the ****'s that got to do with anything other than another example of your narrow minded thinking - you're so blinded by your dislike of them that you're trying to bring them into this thread. Its your constant refusal to accept that there are two sides to every situation - you just cannot admit it.
Your quote 'to use one's wealth to do so for one's own convenience' is just so laughable its ridiculous. Have you never used your wealth for your convenience, Les? I suspect you have done. But you know what? There's no way you'll admit it.
I'll leave you with three questions, just for clarity.
1. Do you live in Cornwall?
2. Have you ever used your own wealth for your own convenience?
3. Do you accept that properties are available for under £150k and if not, why can't you simply do the search yourself.
Actually, one more.
Why do you condemn these properties as 'hovels'? Are you that much of a snob?
20 June 2007, 02:21 PM
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All I've ever done in this thread is attempt to explain that there are tangible benefits to second home owners, whilst understanding that some locals will find it irritating but as always there are two sides to every argument and it gets frustrating continually repeating that point when others can't accept it.
I've managed to change my mind and accept that your's and others view on Chelsea tractors was/is correct and amend my opinions. What is so difficult in admitting that others have a point and in some instances were correct?
20 June 2007, 02:31 PM
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Bravo, fair point but you and I are never going to see eye to eye on that issue so what's the point in re-hashing it? You were also going through your 'posting every hysterical headline from Sky' phase at the time, hence my comment but if it bothered you so much, then I apologise.
All I've ever done in this thread is attempt to explain that there are tangible benefits to second home owners, whilst understanding that some locals will find it irritating but as always there are two sides to every argument and it gets frustrating continually repeating that point when others can't accept it.
I've managed to change my mind and accept that your's and others view on Chelsea tractors was/is correct and amend my opinions. What is so difficult in admitting that others have a point and in some instances were correct?
All I've ever done in this thread is attempt to explain that there are tangible benefits to second home owners, whilst understanding that some locals will find it irritating but as always there are two sides to every argument and it gets frustrating continually repeating that point when others can't accept it.
I've managed to change my mind and accept that your's and others view on Chelsea tractors was/is correct and amend my opinions. What is so difficult in admitting that others have a point and in some instances were correct?
20 June 2007, 02:42 PM
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I think the issue here is that Les lives in the South West so can talk on personal experience and knows how his local community see these 2nd homes and the arguments for and against. Its difficult to argue against someone when they live there and the person with the other side of the argument doesn't live there so can't pull repsonses based on local community feelings. In fact its probably similar to the argument where 'townies' shouldn't be telling 'country folk' what they can and can't do.
The issue here is that Les's views are distorted and he refuses to accept that there are any benefits to second home ownership whilst all I've tried to say (all along) is that there are two sides to this issue and neither is completely in the right.
20 June 2007, 08:47 PM
#108
Victim's torture by gang ended in viaduct death fall, court told | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited
Come to Cornwall and get thrown off a bridge
"Martin Pollard' has been done for various offences around here, personally I would slit their throats but what is the betting they are out in 3 years for manslaughter
Come to Cornwall and get thrown off a bridge
"Martin Pollard' has been done for various offences around here, personally I would slit their throats but what is the betting they are out in 3 years for manslaughter
21 June 2007, 10:04 AM
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Victim's torture by gang ended in viaduct death fall, court told | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited
Come to Cornwall and get thrown off a bridge
"Martin Pollard' has been done for various offences around here, personally I would slit their throats but what is the betting they are out in 3 years for manslaughter
Come to Cornwall and get thrown off a bridge
"Martin Pollard' has been done for various offences around here, personally I would slit their throats but what is the betting they are out in 3 years for manslaughter
21 June 2007, 01:28 PM
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Yep, but Bravo as I've said all along second home owners can bring tangible benefits to an area, whether it be financial or supporting the economy in some way. Of course they can cause resentment with the locals but far too often the locals get so emotive about the issue that they can't see the wood for the trees. Equally, there will inevitably be incomers whose attitudes stink.
The issue here is that Les's views are distorted and he refuses to accept that there are any benefits to second home ownership whilst all I've tried to say (all along) is that there are two sides to this issue and neither is completely in the right.
The issue here is that Les's views are distorted and he refuses to accept that there are any benefits to second home ownership whilst all I've tried to say (all along) is that there are two sides to this issue and neither is completely in the right.
Initially you accused us all of resisting tourism. I cannot see any real mention of that and how could there be when that is such a large industry down here. Tourism is the breath of life in the West Country and no one has denied that.
Do you consider that buying second houses is what is really meant by tourism? The best that happens is that the buyer pays local builders to do a house up and then he will live in it for a short time during the summer and buy some food and then he goes away again leaving the house empty and contributing nothing to the the local economy. This action has of course done it's bit towards raising the cost of property to levels that locals can no longer afford.
Are you unable to see all that. Surely that is not too complicated. That is exactly what Matt, I and othsrs have been saying and all you do is ignore all that and keep wittering on about the value to the local economy, which is minimal.
Can't you understand why local people get really upset when they see properties values going way beyond their means and then those houses being empty for the greater part of the year while they have to live in poor accommodation or remain living with their parents?
Did you not notice what Matt and others said to you about the quality of accommodation down here priced at £150K or below? Or do you just ignore anything that does not agree with your own views? Are you really so blinkered or self important?
Would you mind explaining just what is distorted about my views above which are shared by the other people who actually live down here. That is the point made by Bravo2Zero of course. Was that distorted as well?
You are now resorting to the methods used by many who cannot produce a viable argument, and that is by asking me specious questions in an effort to find some way to undermine what I have said. The information I have already given is adequate and I do not propose to accept your orders.
I suggest that you read what others have said about the quality of accommodation at the prices you mention, someone sold a double garage last year for money approaching those prices-with no mod cons!
I think however that the real answer is that you should try hard to ignore your obvious animosity towards me, for reasons that only you will know of course, and then you might be able to understand what is really being said by us all, and you might also be able to write a post without the childish insults and name calling thus strengthening your argument-maybe!
Les
21 June 2007, 02:25 PM
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Are you unable to see all that. Surely that is not too complicated. That is exactly what Matt, I and othsrs have been saying and all you do is ignore all that and keep wittering on about the value to the local economy, which is minimal.
Can't you understand why local people get really upset when they see properties values going way beyond their means and then those houses being empty for the greater part of the year while they have to live in poor accommodation or remain living with their parents?
You are now resorting to the methods used by many who cannot produce a viable argument, and that is by asking me specious questions in an effort to find some way to undermine what I have said. The information I have already given is adequate and I do not propose to accept your orders.
Les
This is why I have an issue with you, its a constant theme of your posting. Ignore the other poster, read into what they say and distort it for your own ends and then completely fail to look (and accept) that there is a bigger picture.
There's nothing specious about my questions. I've simply asked you direct questions which you've avoided answering. Again, you do this every time and I can only assume the reason why you won't answer them is that you know it will undermine your position.
There are plenty of others on this thread who don't agree with your narrow minded viewpoint but I notice you don't include them in your last post. Anyway, what the hell are you on about when you talk of 'orders'? Is this another lame attempt at justifying your position?
I'll let you have the last word because I know how much it means to you in your twisted little world. I'm off on holiday for a few weeks where the locals are not as narrow minded, not dibbing out - simply enjoying myself.
Enjoy Cornwall.
Ooops. I forgot - you don't live there.
21 June 2007, 03:38 PM
#113
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I cannot be arsed to read all that but obviously people owning second homes is a nightmare for the local economy as people do not live and work in the area and the local pubs/ hotels/ restauronts can only trade for two months in the summer while its a free country there is no economic benefit to people having second homes in anyway at all. The percieved benefits are miniscule in comparison to the negative side for the people who live there all year.
Having said that rich people get to tread on poor people thats capitalism and long may it continue.
Having said that rich people get to tread on poor people thats capitalism and long may it continue.
21 June 2007, 05:46 PM
#114
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If all had enough money to buy a 2nd home they would, and don't deny you would'nt, It personally does'nt bother me whether there lived in or not !
Too many people here anyway !
What does bother me is queing in traffic for a hour to get to Truro 10 miles away, I can remember when I lived in Truro taking 10 minutes to go 7 miles to work in the morning, now it's a nightmare, so the real problem is this county is over populated, so all who have not lived here for over 30 years leave ....please
So the more that buy and dont live here the better
Too many people here anyway !
What does bother me is queing in traffic for a hour to get to Truro 10 miles away, I can remember when I lived in Truro taking 10 minutes to go 7 miles to work in the morning, now it's a nightmare, so the real problem is this county is over populated, so all who have not lived here for over 30 years leave ....please
So the more that buy and dont live here the better
21 June 2007, 05:59 PM
#115
Also known as daz
Have to agree with cornwall being jam packed, im all for a bit of tourism but it gets plain rediculous thank god that a30 will be fully open this coming monday as it's my daily commute
Last edited by hux309; 21 June 2007 at 06:04 PM.
22 June 2007, 07:44 AM
#116
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