sti-04!!

Bitter ............... Not you

fatherpierre

Neither.

Got the education whilst on the ****, and dipped a-plenty on tax payers' money when being in the forces meant a holiday abroad 8 times a year.

Chris L

Norman we must have words sometime - we're not all that bad Just depends on what aspects you get involved in!

I always take great delight in telling people that I failed my computing A level

jonc

I dropped out of GCSE in Computing, Didn't think it was for me at the time. Wasn't sure what career path to take so did a "general" course an got an HND in Business and Finance. During my time on the course I'd bought myself a PC to do my work and this turned into a hobby. Turned into a bit of a propeller head reading up PC technologies in all those PC mags and constantly upgrading bits on my PC and trying to "optimise" performance of the box to get as much frame rates as possible playing Doom and other games and it almost turned into an obsession! My hobby turned in to a career and 12 years ago when I got a job in a call centre doing basic telephone support for Microsoft products and started on a salary of £12k which I thought was massive. Got an MCP in Windows 95 and went contracting. The IT support industry was relatively in its infancy then and people were paying good money if you had an MCP back then and went from contract to contract building up my experience (and money!!).

Though no longer have as keen an interest in IT, its still what I consider a rewarding job. I'm doing Desktop and Server engineering/deployment and infrastructure support in an investment bank still enjoying what I do earning over half way to six figure salary plus banking bonuses/benefits, though this is a drive to support my family rather than an interest in IT. I guess I got into the IT market at the right time. The IT job market is not what it used to be. Qualifications like MCSE's etc doesn't count for much these days as nearly everyone has them (except me!) and employers look more for experience than what you have on paper. This is not to say its hard to get into the IT industry, there are plenty of call centres and 1st line/call logging support work to get a foot hold, just don't expect to jump straight into a highly paid job with your degrees and quailification.

I'd advise you to take a career path in what you enjoy, whether its an genuine interest or a hobby as its this passion that will enable you and to give you the drive to succeed in whatever you choose to do. Just look at Lewis Hamiltion!

Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Agree with alot with what has been said so far. Enjoying your work is a must.
I have seen both sides of the fence. Earnt my money doing hard physical graft from inside holes in he ground like the fella above through to very highly paid office based jobs - which involved the usual lap top, bull**** and plenty of stress. But meant I could throw money about and own several cars - I did a BA honours which gave me plenty of options.

So now what do I do? Well I am poorly payed - am struggling a bit to afford the next scoob but am well on my way to saving up.
I have a big interest in WW2
I am WW2 historian and tour guide. All I do is tours and research and have a few beers in between. I am also with a cracking girl 15 years younger than me and live in a great place.

So I am NEVER going to afford a Spec C like I could have in the old days. But I do a very interesting job which I love and have a fantastic quality of life.
So as people keep saying money doesn´t buy you happiness.

Although I think perhaps you have to try different stuff and go through that process to actually work out where you want to be.

Money is the sweet icing on the cake. The cake is all the important stuff that makes you happy in life.
Unfortunately many people in Britain are concentrating on making a small **** poor cake with very very thick icing.

Started with jobs and ended with cakes LOL

Leslie

Quite right too!

Les

Bakerman

MId 30s, IT company, analyst programmer (7yrs exp) in an old skool language on a mainframe. Will get paid somewhere around £38-40k this year (good benefits including decent fs pension/flexitime/no oncall) for a max 35hr week. Sometimes enjoyable but nowadays so much more paperwork and talking to idiots rather than programming which is good fun. No IT background (dont have a PC even) and not what I wanted to do (always wanted to fly) but pays OK and enables me to do what I want to do. Easy life really. Money usually comes with hassle/responsiblity and to be frank I dont want any.

As others have said do something you are somewhat interested in or something that pays well that you can put up with. Also get married to a bird who gets paid more than you which keeps the pressue off both of you having to go and earn lots of cash.

Just to add lots of people judge success by size of car and house i.e. for most it is how much debt you are prepared to take on - anybody can buy M3/STi etc etc providing you are willing to go into debt over it which is mad as somebody somewhere WILL ALWAYS give you the cash. As you get older the more mortal you feel and the more you realise long hours working for a few more quid just aint worth it (OK somedays I am jealous but mostly not !!). Next step would be a project manager but can't be rsed at this point in time.

By no means a go-getr, just happy doing what I am doing and doing it well and getting paid for it. Its nearly 3pm, better start thinking about going home soon.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

I like having money, when I dont have any I want stuff, when I have it I kind of lose interest in buying things, its weird ?

pwhittle

I really must get back into the private sector! round here, that salary gets you 1-3 departments full of hastle, multi-million £ budgets, reporting / grovelling councilors, cheif execs and the press, court cases when things go Pete Tong..certainly enough to put me off, even if I had the experience!

I think the top IT job here is around £30-32k. My £28k puts me in around the top 10% of employees, and we have a training budget less than £100 pp pa.

Mind you, my last private sector job was for a large bank, and I hated it. Full of back-stabbing competative morons. I don't have the qualifications or experience to be choosy!

I'm sure the best bet for most people is to get is with a good company who'll support your development and give you oportunities. Some start-ups make it, but most new companies fail in the first year (mine's only running as I keep pumping money in). I'm sure getting a good grounding as an employer is the way. You can never expect to be a good boss until you've had several yourself to learn from

Bakerman

I think that summarises a lot of people's lives, we are brought up to look for money/material things and when we have it (OK there are various degrees of having it) or at least enough to do what we want to do we then think 'whats next' as it is then you realise that there is more to contentment than a few numbers on a piece of paper.

A bit deep for me at this time of the day !?!

dreamer_girl

The thing about money is that no matter how much you earn, it's never quite enough !

You have to be happy in your job and enjoy it, otherwise it can destroy you, but if you can achieve that then I think a decent salary is important so you can get the things you enjoy.

For me, my job pays my mortgage, pays for the scoob, pays for the Caterham, hopefully paying for a season or two's racing soon, and pays for holidays, a pension and savings.

To earn decent money in IT I think you have to work in sales / pre-sales rather than hands on techie stuff unless you're doing a lot of shift / on-call when you get paid decent overtime. Either that or consultancy but that's a hard life - too much accountability for your time !!!

But at 15 I'd honestly just pick some sensible A Levels, plan a sensible degree, plan to go travelling and just see where it all takes you. I'm 31 and at 15 I was studying music, at 19 I was doing a secretarial course and spending most weekends wasted at Club UK etc., 21 at Uni, 24 travelling, 27 working at Cisco, and 31 where I am now - your plans and what you enjoy doing change so much. At 15 I vowed I would never ever ever work "in an office". I still couldn't do an office-based job it would drive me mad, but I do sometimes work at a desk !

ChefDude

can you expand on this please...
what do you think decent money in IT is?
how many IT related consultants have you worked with?

LG John

Man, I wished I knew you then Jo

P1-Brad

Whilst trying to plan a career is admirable and not necessarily a bad idea ... the chances of it coming to fruition are pretty negligable. You MAY end up in the sector you plan to work in, but pin-pointing a particular type of job is probably a pointless exercise

Careers are hugely unpredicatable, you never know what's going to happen from one day to the next and should always try to keep your options open. Not to mention that there are countless jobs out there you probably don't even know existed

When I graduated from uni (BA Hons in Business Studies) I started working for a company in the Financial Services (Life and Pensions) sector up north, doing back office work. I got this job as a stop-gap to pay off my student debts, and cover my car loan ... whilst I looked for a job in Marketing, my 'chosen' career. I was fast-tracked through a couple of qualifications (FPC) that i'd never heard of. I did quite well, and when the contractor who managed one of the teams was invited to set up a team of contractors, to fulfil a requirement in London, I was asked to join. Overnight (literally!), I became a financial services contractor, moved to London, and more than trebbled my salary (from £16k per year to £250 per day) .. admittedly the job was boring but this was made up for by a) the salary b) working with people I liked and c) the social aspect of life in London.

By chance, the company who I was contracting through then invited me to join them permanently. I originally helped form their Risk Management division (having had no previous knowledge of risk management) and then formed a Bid Management Unit (having had no previous experience of proposal writing / bid pursuit). These opportunities presented themselves because I worked for a fast growing company, the company had faith in me due to past performance and my transferable skills enabled me to adapt quickly. I now have a secure job, on contractor wages, and enjoy what i'm doing... in an industry I had no intention of staying in! ... And to go back to my original point, I didn't even know there were such things as 'Bid Managers' when I went away to Uni ... so don't pigeon-hole yourself, there's a world of jobs out there, just a case of finding one you enjoy and that ticks all the boxes you're looking for.

I know this is just one example, but just goes to show that fate has a large hand in what you do and where you end up!

My advice: work hard, don't expect anything for nothing, take calculated risks... and most improtantly, make sure you're doing a fair days work for a fair days pay!! Don't undersell yourself ...It's not a question of making millions or doing a job you enjoy for pittance, just make sure you earn your worth!

Bradders

PS. Everyone would like to work for themselves, be an entrepreneur and make millions ... if only it was that easy. As a casing point, when I did work experience at Uni, the small company I worked for was run by a guy who left a well-paid job in the City based on a 'revolutionary' idea he had... when I left he couldn't afford to pay the 'phone bill and was about to be disconnected! It's a risky strategy but like with all big risks, the rewards are potentially higher. Just look at the new business failure rates, but don't be put off if you think you've got what it takes!?!?!?

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Scott,

I left school at 16, 7 cse's, no O levels (as they were then ) had a clue that I wanted to join the army so did just that, though also wanted to go into the army air corps but they took on like 10 people per year, oh well, ended up joining the royal signals instead
Learnt about mobile and static trunk communications systems, just at the end of the analogue era and the start of the digital age
Ended up doing some really helpful courses (which I dont use anymore ) but proper security not this IT type security and did that for 11 years.
Left that and ended commissioning telephone exchanges (fixed line and mobile) and after 6 years, next job was working for BT at their research and developement establishment (was good in the early days but went to pot later on with 21CN).
Now work in the mobile telecoms industry, still have a background in satcom, radio and crypto security, the telecoms industry is starting (well being forced) to go more IT (god forgive them, wait till it all goes t1ts up and then they will understand ) and its acutally quite interesting

But before you do any of that, you have to do the basics.
CV, wont be much on there, but you need one, you will also need a suit for your interview, be smart, dont be late, dont smell of anything you shouldnt smell of (but smell nice ) first impressions count (took me 1hr and 20 mins to get my last job )
Do your homework on the company, find out what they do (exactly what they do) how their growth is, where they are expanding, where you fit in, ask lots of questions (take a sheet with questions on if necessary ) but remember, you know nothing, no matter what qualifications you have, your understanding is limited, just learn, learn, learn when you get that job, ask questions, gain understanding, and most importantly, gain experience!

The other way of doing things is an apprentiship with a big company, we do them for 16-24 year olds, so you still get your college work in and work experience to boot!

Also do they still let you do the weeks work experience at school where you can go out to a firm to see what they do? That was always a good way of seeing (if they dont shove you in the kitchen making the cuppa's ) what goes on

Money wise.... well your going to be bottom of the pile, what may seem a good wage to you (say 17k starting) wont be in 5 years down the line (if your on about 20k there), but dont expect big money fast, it doesnt work that way unfortunately

If you really want to be a bit on the adventerous side, write letters (or type them) to big companies that your interested in, ask them what they do (dont ask about wages though) and if they can give you any info to any schemes they do for school/college leavers (website searches etc)

Hope some of that helps

Tony

dreamer_girl

I can only expand with what I know and what I've experience in my [relatively short] career.

I'd say decent money is 40-50k+. You can achieve this in other parts of IT but it's relatively easy in sales / pre-sales.

Not sure how many IT related consultants, I've lost count. All of them had a lot of accountability compared to sales; sales people are targeted on sales (obviously) and when you do your work is ultimately up to you as long as you make your number (and being pre-sales you're further removed from that), but as a consultant you are targeted on billable hours - seems a lot more pressure to me, although I'm sure other people would disagree. Different things suit different people

THere's money in other parts of IT, although there's less in contracting than there used to be, and ime the hands-on engineers, support engineers etc. find it harder to earn the larger salaries.

SB - maybe you did

Paul3446

I work for a big law firm doing IT Support, I don't work in London and last year earnt just under £50k, which is not bad for a 35 hour week. I'm oncall but have only been called once in 2 years!

There's plenty of money in IT, but the thing is to work for a good company, if you work for a little tinpot firm doing IT then you're probably looking at half that money.

I'm certainly not any sort of techie guru or anything, just MS Office support, Windows XP, user account administration etc.

It's not massively exciting, but we have a good laugh, I have a 10 minute commute and can be home with the family just after 4 O clock.

dreamer_girl

:thumbup: sounds like a good one! Legal firms seem to pay well, along with financial institutions like banks etc.

Leslie

That hit the nail alright!

Les