Leslie

Surely it is actually against the law to ride on the pavement!

Les

stilover

Prepare to pay £60 -£120 fine for straying (even for the briefest of moments) into a Cycle lane.

PistonHeads Headlines

to quote a couple lines:

"The police have already got the power to issue fines for the offence, but only three were issued for the year ending at the close of June. TfL are proposing to decriminalise the offence and make it legal for civilians to monitor the cameras and issue the fines by post"

And

"Green transport adviser to Ken Livingstone, Jenny Jones, seethed: “I find it infuriating that the police are not using the powers they have. Far too many motorists ignore the white lanes marking out cycle lanes and they need to be seen to be punished. Better enforcement will give people, particularly women, more confidence that they will be protected if they take up cycling.”

In other words. The Police are either too busy doing something else, or are using descretion. Either way, we want more money, so this is the answer.

SiPie

Matteeboy

"On 1st August 1999, new legislation came into force to allow a fixed penalty notice to be served on anyone who is guilty of cycling on a footway. However the Home Office issued guidance on how the new legislation should be applied, indicating that they should only be used where a cyclist is riding in a manner that may endanger others. At the time Home Office Minister Paul Boateng issued a letter stating that:

"The introduction of the fixed penalty is not aimed at responsible cyclists who sometimes feel obliged to use the pavement out of fear of traffic and who show consideration to other pavement users when doing so. Chief police officers, who are responsible for enforcement, acknowledge that many cyclists, particularly children and young people, are afraid to cycle on the road, sensitivity and careful use of police discretion is required."

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Still against the law then.

"It is illegal to cycle on the footway
(or pavement) alongside a road, and you
should not do so. In any case, footways
are not designed for typical cycling
speeds and riding on them is inevitably
more hazardous than on the carriageway"
(Cyclecraft - Skilled Cycling Techniques
for Adults, written by John Franklin and
published by the Stationery Office 2003)

BTW Mateybuoy - if you can read you will see that I do indeed have a bicycle - a Marin.

Matteeboy

Bet you never speed then Rannoch? Bet you never park briefly on a yellow line?
Both against the law.

Do you actually USE your Marin? Doesn't sound like it.

paulr

I must admit when i used to live in London (for a very short time) i totally ignored road traffic signs, red lights the lot. Its not cyclists that cause congestion, its car drivers so i kind of felt morally superior. I wasnt poluting London or causing tailbacks. I did get hit by a taxi once doing a U-turn down Totenham court road and going the wrong way. My fault i guess. I'd say in hindsight it was a bit irresponsible but the traffic is so bad if you obeyed the rules you'd never get anywhere.

I've grown up a bit since (hopefully)

Trout

iTrader: (1)

To take the latter point first - why do you say that? What have I said that could possibly cause you to come to that conclusion?


As to your first points. Pedantically, parking briefly on a yellow line is not necessarily against the law - although I cannot remember the last time I did so.

I suspect you have lost your bet - maintaining pace with the general traffic on a motorway - quite different from riding my bicycle down a crowded London pavement however.

sti-04!!

Everytime i go to Edinburgh there is cyclists everywhere Cull them i say

Matteeboy

Simple - pretty much anyone I've ever met/spoken to that comes out with your sort of anti cyclist rants never cycles so therefore is not aware of the issues.
I have no idea what you on about regarding a bet and motorways.

corradoboy

So, if you have a taxed car at home you don't need to tax your bike So by the same reasoning, I could have the cheapest tax bracket car sat in my drive with its cheap tax, and thus don't need to tax my Scoob (if I get another ) Big hole in that logic methinks. The vehicle is taxed, not the individual. I propose that anyone over 14 wishing to ride on roads with a limit higher than 30mph should be taxed, must complete a cycling proficiency exam and must have at least 3rd party liability insurance. The fines being handed to motorists for misuse of cycle-lanes must be justified by the equal enforcement of the Highway Code with regards to cyclists (misuse of footpaths, pedestrian crossings, one-way streets etc etc). Helmets should be a legal requirement, as should the fitment of functioning lighting (compulsory use from dusk to dawn).

How many of you keen cyclists still have a bell on your bike I spend 10-12 hours a day observing the traffic of this country, and thus see a lot of cyclists from dumb-@$$ kids to kitted up geography teacher types, and almost none of them have a bell, and therefore have no right to be on the public highway.

Most cyclists are tw@t$ and want it all their own way without a single concession to the rules themselves whilst using the green argument to justify their position. The most recent prize tw@t$ I have witnessed was the local plod who, given it was a nice sunny day, decided to use their bikes to patrol around my area. They can be seen usually riding on the pavement, and NO, there wasn't a bell in sight

Sonic'

The police push bikes around here are all battenberged up

My last bike had a bell on it, I was 6 at the time though

It is quite a vaild point tbh, cyclists should have some sort of warning device, although I suspect most of the time they just shout

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Actually my rant is not anti-cyclist if you read it.

It is anti-arrogant ***** who happen to ride bikes with a total disregard for their surroundings. Although given your posts maybe it is just most cyclists that are in this category.

As I say riding badly on crowded pavements, ignoring red lights, riding over pedestrian crossings weaving amongst people, wrong way up one way streets. And I see this every day. Educate me in what issues a cyclist is aware of that justifies that blatantly irresponsible behaviour.

For reference, where I live, there are no pavements, there are no traffic lights just some nice quiet lanes. Perfect for cycling. Oh and plenty of offroad too.

Matteeboy

Ah but we are't wheezy fat b4stards in size 40" trousers are we? We can nip to the shops without needing a car park. We can literally go anywhere.
And when slovenly fat drivers try and chase us on foot (having reached the edge of the road), we either batter them, or easily run away.
And the best thing is, most of us are drivers too so we get the best of both worlds.
And yes - My bike has a bell.




Now, go back to your can of Coke and your burger, switch on your Sky Sport so you can rant at the football players and "tell" them how to do it properly, then fall into a drunken stupor using many cans of Stella.

Matteeboy

Well I'd say a HUGE %age of drivers are arrogant ***** (especially Audi drivers - the new BMW drivers of the road) but it's not worth wasting any breath over them is it?
How about those who ride very carefully, are aware of others, use a bell if riding anywhere with poor visibility, use lights, hi vis kit and constantly ride defensively like they do driving?
Easy to forget them isn't it?

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

Right I have had enough of this crap been reading the petty arguements between you lot, especially you matteboy.
Get a grip man, you live in bloody cornwall ffs !! the title is about cyclists in london , not some backwater , which suggests that the level of pure stupidness by cyclists in the capital is far greater than down there.

next
You dont have to be a cyclist to have a better more level approach to the problems and issues that cyclists cause (and we are not talking about every cyclist but then again the problem ones are not in the minority). I dont cycle, but that dosent make me any less prone to have to deal with these ***** on a daily basis. Unfortunately the ones that ride like idiots give all the cyclists in london a bad name, whether you like it or not.

And before anyone starts on me spouting some pap, let me give you two examples.

1. about 2 years ago, came out of my office in the car, came to a one way street, looked left (as it is oneway ), then just as i was checking my right and inching forward as no cars were coming from my left, a bloody cyclist came straight down the wrong way into me , flipped over my bonnet and hit the deck.Lying on the ground, the prat dressed in wooley jumper, sandals and no helmet, was surrounded by people checking he was ok.

and me, well because i was standing next to my car, every cyclist that rode past, hurled abuse at me because I was a car driver and had obviously knocked him over
Police came,he went away in the ambulence (just a few bruises) and I was breathalysed (not him) , just because he is a cyclist !!

oh and he had no insurance and no home insurance as well so i ended up having to claim all the damage to my car and affecting my no claims bonus.

2.another time came out of the office, crossed the street (again one-way) and had a cyclist shouting and swearing at me to get out the way as he cycled down the street the wrong way

I see constant abuse of the traffic laws on a daily basis, pavement cycling, jumping red lights, one way streets violations, pedestrian crossing use etc etc and yet because they have no number plates, they are held unaccountable and cannot be traced.

so next time, you feel like defending them, just remember that , yes you may be a good and couteous cyclist, but for everyone like you, there is at least 4 complete morons.

.....and breathe

SiPie

I too have a bell and need to use it frequently in and around Edinburgh

Alot of cyclist are ***** and alot aren't

Bit like Impreza and BMW drivers.

Alot are w@nkers, some are not

Totally agree Tony ....ratio seems about right for Edinburgh but reckon ratio different in London

corradoboy

Touched a nerve there Insults, threats and arrogance. Argument lost I think

FYI - 36" waste, 6'2" 16st, I only eat fresh produce from local farms and haven't touched a soft drink in over 5 years, into rugby, boxing and even cycling (as well as motorsport and fast cars). I only cycle off-road as I aren't a hypocrite (unlike some) and I firmly believe that in the 21st century it is solely leisure transport. If we were going to be fair about things then health & safety would have banned push and motorbikes following a scathing risk assessment.

corradoboy

Numbers are WAY out I think

Matteeboy

I only cycle off-road as I aren't a hypocrite (unlike some) and I firmly believe that in the 21st century it is solely leisure transport.

Interesting grammar and an "interesting" opinion there

H&S would ban cars well before bikes. Lets tot up all the bike related deaths and serious injuries shall we, then compare them to car related deaths and serious injuries

Tony - of course, living down here, I have no idea what London is like. No no, I never lived in the Docklands, I never grew up in Surrey, I've never even seen pictures of London...

SiPie

1 decent to 5 ***** would be the rough Edinburgh ratio

Can't comment on London

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

I dont doubt that, but do you cycle in london ?? no, then you cant comment on the level of cycling in the capital. still welcome to your opinion of course

have revised my earlier ratio of prats to good cyclists..now hovering around the 8-1 mark

what would scooby do

1 decent 199 *****

I saw a cyclist have ago at another one who went through a red light

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Let's analyse the arguments.

One side: -

Cyclists in London cycle the wrong way up one way streets
Regularly flaunt red lights
Ride on the pavement
Cycle over populated pedestrian crossings

The counter to justify this from a cyclists perspective: -

You don't ride a bike
You are fat
You have bad grammer
You might break the law in your car
Even though it is clearly against the law a policeman told me to do it
I don't need to park when I have a bike


Well that clears up why cyclists are free to ignore the laws of the land and the laws of the road....

....not!

Matteeboy

Splendid editing of both sides there Rannoch.

A politician somewhere has stolen your real job.

corradoboy

Let's compare them pro-rata, based on percentage of the population and miles travelled then, eh ?

Let's look at it another way. Safety equipment on a modern car....

Seatbelts, airbags, crumple zones, side-impact beams, seatbelt pre-tensioners, break-away pedals, anti-sub seats, laminated glass, anti-lock brakes, traction control, skid control (various forms), break-away wipers for pedestrian safety, pedestrian impact crumple zones, a horn, lights, indicators. All of the above frequently tested by legal requirement to enable the purchase of tax before you can use it, along with insurance. Oh, and a test to see if you understand the rules of the road and can adequately control the bl00dy thing.

Safety equipment on a modern pedal cycle...

Bell (well, not usually), lights (hmm, hardly ever, especially when it's dark in winter), helmet (errrrrm, again, not very often), cycling proficiency test ( yeah, right )
errr,
errrm,

is there anything else

So, in a health and safety risk assessment, which poses the higher risk when used on the public highway amongst cars, buses, trucks and pedestrians

Balancing on top of a big coathanger on wheels amongst 38 tonners doing 70 may be your idea of safe fun, but it ain't mine

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

To be fair to them it's hard to use common sense when you're on drugs

sti-04!!

By the way ... i am all for it

ScoobyMaz

iTrader: (1)

I drive in London every day, and bikes and buses are the worst, the highway code doesn't apply to them. You get used to it after a while, and as our work car is a Nissan Navara, bikes don't seem to argue with you. We have chased a biker who gave us the finger after he cut us up at a roundabout.....his poor little legs were going as fast as he could.
Bus drivers have a job to do and so do taxis so you accept what they do. If you are in a black cab and you say "pull up here mate" you don't expect him say "sorry, might upset the guy behind", you want him to stop straight away.
That is the way we look at it, otherwise blood pressure would be sky high most of the time.

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Actually I missed out hypocrite out of the counter arguments.

However you have still failed to raise a single 'special issue' that I should be aware of as to why cyclists in London seem to unanimously (according to experienced posters on this thread) flaunt the rules of the road in London putting pedestrians and themselves at risk. Apparently as according to you I don't ride a bike therefore I cannot know.

I am still looking forward to a sensible explanation!