F1 at its best
06 August 2007, 11:02 AM
#91
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I'm saying that in any sport if you can gain a slight advantage over your opponent then it will tempt some people to cheat. In the cases you've mentioned then it may not be as much of an advantage but in a sport where hitting the ball far is an advantage then strength must play a part in that which means some people may look to gain that extra strength by foul means. It's not too hard to see that happening is it?
) and no amount of drugs is gonna make you do that. Golf is not a physical game per se, it's more of a mind game and as has been previously mentioned, feel. As the old saying goes, you drive for show, putt for dough.Geezer
06 August 2007, 11:13 AM
#92
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06 August 2007, 11:18 AM
#93
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I bet there are a few beta-blockers taken in golf at the very least
But back to F1, rumours are already circulating around Alonso's future at McLaren. Briatore wants him back at Renault.
This whole saga brings up an interesting point - is it possible to have two highly talented and competitive drivers in the same team? With overtaking so difficult (we'll leave that debate for another day
) driver cooperation on strategy and pitstops is often the winning factor. That inevitably means a number one driver, and a subservient number two. Like that wimp Rubens 
Richard.
But back to F1, rumours are already circulating around Alonso's future at McLaren. Briatore wants him back at Renault.
This whole saga brings up an interesting point - is it possible to have two highly talented and competitive drivers in the same team? With overtaking so difficult (we'll leave that debate for another day
) driver cooperation on strategy and pitstops is often the winning factor. That inevitably means a number one driver, and a subservient number two. Like that wimp Rubens Richard.
I'll be surprised if he goes to Renault, I just can't see them being competitive. If anyone, he would probably go to BMW, they seem to be the most likely to break McLaren/Ferrari dominance.
That's if he goes at all. The media are reading lots of things into very vague statements. Personally I think they'll sort it out and Alonso & Hamilton will still be McLaren drviers next year.
06 August 2007, 11:26 AM
#94
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The big advantage in golf is to hit it straight, not far, (to a degree obviously if you can only drive it 150yds you're in trouble.... ) and no amount of drugs is gonna make you do that. Golf is not a physical game per se, it's more of a mind game and as has been previously mentioned, feel. As the old saying goes, you drive for show, putt for dough.
Geezer
) and no amount of drugs is gonna make you do that. Golf is not a physical game per se, it's more of a mind game and as has been previously mentioned, feel. As the old saying goes, you drive for show, putt for dough.Geezer
06 August 2007, 11:29 AM
#95
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If you look into any sport in depth, there is always cheating. There is no such thing as 'sporting ethics' and the higher you get the worse it becomes. Winning is everything and everything else is secondary.
Can somebody prove me wrong, at international level, and tell me where no rules are ever bent or broken? I would really like to know.
Formula 1 has been little more than showbusiness for many years where money rules. That's why Hamilton rules - he's good and is worth hundreds of millions to McLaren. But that's what the public wants. Apparently. Winners at any cost.
Show me an honest sport that anybody cares about?
And onother thing, we Brits get all hot under the collar at cheating. Other nationalites - Italaina, Spanish. South America - think that cheating, and getting away with it - is all part of the game. That's why Maradonna's 'hand of God' goal makes him even more of a hero. He cheated the authorites, and won.
Personally, I'm with the cheats who push every single angle to breaking point. I only get upset when my team or driver gets caught out
It's how the world turns these days.
Richard.
PS When we aere karting one mulit-millionaire father was notorious for buying every engine that beat his son. He offered me £3,500 for a chain-saw motor that cost a few hundred quid (but tuned to the hilt by John Button, Jenson's dad). Foolishy I refused - it was not that good a motor as I later found out This dad's driver,although not without talent and backed by the family's millions, is currently languishing outide the top ten of GP2.
Can somebody prove me wrong, at international level, and tell me where no rules are ever bent or broken? I would really like to know.
Formula 1 has been little more than showbusiness for many years where money rules. That's why Hamilton rules - he's good and is worth hundreds of millions to McLaren. But that's what the public wants. Apparently. Winners at any cost.
Show me an honest sport that anybody cares about?
And onother thing, we Brits get all hot under the collar at cheating. Other nationalites - Italaina, Spanish. South America - think that cheating, and getting away with it - is all part of the game. That's why Maradonna's 'hand of God' goal makes him even more of a hero. He cheated the authorites, and won.
Personally, I'm with the cheats who push every single angle to breaking point. I only get upset when my team or driver gets caught out
It's how the world turns these days.Richard.
PS When we aere karting one mulit-millionaire father was notorious for buying every engine that beat his son. He offered me £3,500 for a chain-saw motor that cost a few hundred quid (but tuned to the hilt by John Button, Jenson's dad). Foolishy I refused - it was not that good a motor as I later found out
This dad's driver,although not without talent and backed by the family's millions, is currently languishing outide the top ten of GP2.In my book that is a dreadful attitude and if that became rife we might as well give all sport up because it would not stand for anything anymore.
I believe that Alonso was given the right penalty by the FIA, I would have put him even further back on the grid myself. The earlier business about letting Alonso past in practice had no effect on anyone's times and Alonso was not there to overtake anyway. Hamilton would have lost an advantage to Raikkonen had he slowed any more for Alonso. There is no way that Alonso did not realise that he was spoiling Hamilton's final attempt at pole.
On another tack, Hamilton drove an outstanding race to stay in front of Raikkonen when it is so easy to make an error with someone like that driving in your boot!
Les
06 August 2007, 11:54 AM
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What about the psychological warfare that goes on outside the sporting arena, designed to undermine other competitors' confidence? That is becoming more common, imposible to control, and slowing your opponent down is just as effective as making yourself go faster
Cheating IS rife. And the cheats will always be one step ahead of the rules.
Richard.
06 August 2007, 02:14 PM
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Is it possible for any team that has the top 2 drivers in it, both fighting for the championship, to have any degree of peace and harmony?
It's nice to see a British sports star with a bit of fire in their belly. Yes, Damon Hill was a good guy - but IMHO that's why he only won the world championship once (well, that and a minor incident in Adelaide... ) Sadly it's not the nice guys that win - to win these days you need to be single minded, determined and selfish.
Lewis Hamilton definitely has the makings of a great driver - hard to believe this is only his first season.
It's nice to see a British sports star with a bit of fire in their belly. Yes, Damon Hill was a good guy - but IMHO that's why he only won the world championship once (well, that and a minor incident in Adelaide...
) Sadly it's not the nice guys that win - to win these days you need to be single minded, determined and selfish.Lewis Hamilton definitely has the makings of a great driver - hard to believe this is only his first season.
07 August 2007, 12:52 PM
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Les, I wasn't being entirely serious there. To clarify, bending the rules is all part of the game if you want to win. That's just how it is today. But breaking the rules, deliberately and blatantly, is not on.
What about the psychological warfare that goes on outside the sporting arena, designed to undermine other competitors' confidence? That is becoming more common, imposible to control, and slowing your opponent down is just as effective as making yourself go faster
Cheating IS rife. And the cheats will always be one step ahead of the rules.
Richard.
What about the psychological warfare that goes on outside the sporting arena, designed to undermine other competitors' confidence? That is becoming more common, imposible to control, and slowing your opponent down is just as effective as making yourself go faster
Cheating IS rife. And the cheats will always be one step ahead of the rules.
Richard.
Yes of course the psychological bit goes on and I think that is alright up to a point since you have to learn how to cope with that but when that involves deliberate obstruction as in this case then that is all wrong and should be heavily stamped on-as it was this time.
The duty of the organisers is to try as best they can to prevent cheating in any way and to act very strongly when it is detected. Its their rules!
My main point was that to effectively give up in that respect would be a big mistake and would mean the end of sport generally in the finer sense of the word.
Les
07 August 2007, 01:04 PM
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Is it possible for any team that has the top 2 drivers in it, both fighting for the championship, to have any degree of peace and harmony?
It's nice to see a British sports star with a bit of fire in their belly. Yes, Damon Hill was a good guy - but IMHO that's why he only won the world championship once (well, that and a minor incident in Adelaide... ) Sadly it's not the nice guys that win - to win these days you need to be single minded, determined and selfish.
Lewis Hamilton definitely has the makings of a great driver - hard to believe this is only his first season.
It's nice to see a British sports star with a bit of fire in their belly. Yes, Damon Hill was a good guy - but IMHO that's why he only won the world championship once (well, that and a minor incident in Adelaide...
) Sadly it's not the nice guys that win - to win these days you need to be single minded, determined and selfish.Lewis Hamilton definitely has the makings of a great driver - hard to believe this is only his first season.
I had the greatest admiration for Damon Hill as I did for his father too. They both made themselves into very good drivers by sheer application and grit.
In Graham Hill's day, there were several very good drivers but they were all good mates and could trust each other on the track. They achieved their successes largely due to their abilities and did not stoop to cheating either on or off the track. It is a shame that today's fashion of being totally selfish is causing such unpleasant scenes both on and off the competition arenas and don't bother anyone to tell me I am living in the past. The modern attitude of win at all costs is nothing to be proud about in that respect.
Les
