Andy.F

No it doesn't ! Or at least not as long as it has the compulsary rider still attached

Bikers conveniently forget to include themselves in the power to weight calculation

I was racing at Shakespeare (in my road legal spec scoob) on the same day as some highly modified bikes, generally they were needing to run long swing arms to get anywhere near my times. I wonder how they handle with them on


Andy

Pudders69

bit like steering the QE2 with a canoe paddle is suspect.

[Davey]

If you can make a 180mph+ Impreza which can break a 3 second 0-60...

I'd have to throw 10's of thousands at my Impreza to touch Even my R6..

[Davey]

Dont feel so bad; a large bore low geared 2 stroke trail bike is a serious bit of kit! They are animals! I've had big CC road bikes and lairy little 2 strokers scare the **** out of me

Andy.F

You can make them no problem, you just can't buy them new like that

b34ver

ring is bumpy and poorly surfaced....

unfortunately bumps really upset bike handling (unless it's a motorcross bike)

Think that on a drag strip with road legal tyres you'd have to spend silly money to beat a standard superbike. Busa turbo with big swing arm........ NO CHANCE!

Around a proper track, both on road legal tyres with driver/rider who can push vehicle 100%, standard bike, car might win if unlimited budget. Bike with limitless budget and mods........ BIKE WINS!

When it's -3 outside and i need to get to work....... CAR WINS!

Also like you said very few people can push a modern bike fully, most are no where near at all. Most people can push a quick car to 90%. Few people can push a fast bike past 60%. You only have to look at the difference of the riders within motogp, they are all the best riders in the world, collin edwards has been no where near rossi for two years on the same bike! You put collin in club racing and he'd wipe the floor! Put club racer against typical road rider, same again.

Pudders69

straight from the crate bikes win hands down, but spend ££££££££££££ on any fast (uses the term loosely) car then obviously it gets interesting.

So to conclude....yesterday i went faster on my bike in ****ty, salty, crappy condirion than Brun and his Lotus can go...ever.

i still can't feel my fingers and i think i have had the cheapest, fastest sex change known to man...need a fun car for winter.

Pud

b34ver

how much for though?

not everyone has limitless budget!

Andy.F

Spend £10k on an engine and gearbox and thats the straightline stuff taken care of.
£ for £ a bike will be quicker but that was not the original question

[Davey]

Valid point about cold weather..

Did 102 miles on Friday, in the wet and cold, with semi-slicks.. Was exciting! lol!

Took about 2 days for the feeling to come back in my thumbs though.

Pudders69

"Spend £10k on an engine and gearbox and thats the straightline stuff taken care of.
£ for £ a bike will be quicker but that was not the original question "

So does 10k = easily outperform a bike?
Is it easy?

suspect no to both, but tbh why not go take ya test, buy a bike + all the kit + extra's, maybe some advanced tuition + couple of trackdays + servicing & tyres all for less than 10k, which still then does 0.00046mph in a traffic jam and can't pull wheelies.

Pud

Andy.F

Ah but my car can pull wheelies although it does usually break something when it lands again

andythejock01wrx

ZEN Performance

Regarding the brands times, we were running 49s if you check the entire MST results from timeattack. I would hope to be running low 47s next year, on road tyres.

Yes you can make a subaru as quick as an big bike, a good rider makes a difference, but even an average rider needs to be determined to keep the bike on song.

If you go to Santapod and actually watch the guys drag racing bikes, you'll be surprised how slow a standard or in some cases modified bike can be over the 1/4 mile. The well prepped bikes with experienced riders are different, the super street bikes are hitting 8 flat, I think it was a super street bike I watched doing 7.97.

So the answer is yes, and no.

[Davey]

And to add to the argument comparing track times against big CC bikes isnt really fair as they are not as well suited to a track as a nice MotoGP bike or a Supersport

dynamix

iTrader: (3)

Andy Carlisle did it in 7.22 on a bike this september BTG (on a public day). Amazing ride and his datalogging is still showing that faster is possible.

Standard road going cars can do that time - would have to be a great driver and probably not on a TF day.

Bikes are quicker but cars have more grip around corners.

Pudders69

how do you mean exactley?

Apart from occassional motorcycling genius i am probably in the "average rider" bracket, once the revs are over 6/7000 rpm the bike "is on song" all the way to 15000rpm, thats loads of revs to play with, especially round some twisties 2nd and 3rd is all thats needed to have power on tap.

or am i mis understanding what you mean???

Pud

[Davey]

I think he's trying to say you have to have MASSIVE ***** to ride a bike on the limit but just about anyone can take a car to the limit i.e. most will back off alot sooner on a bike because the consiquences are much greater

If I went out for a drive now in the car I could nail it out of corners and even take round-a-bouts at pace but If I was on the bike I'd be tip toeing everywhere.

Pudders69

uuuummmmm....

agree about the "at this time of year" thing but in general theres plenty of bikers who will go flat stick on't road, had a few friendly encounters on't road and the only reason i will back off (if i am behind the car) is because you simply don't know how fast the driver is through the bends. If i was infront, knew the road, dry day blah blah i generally don't back off until the job is done so to speak.

As for reaching the limit...its more like reaching Their own limits not the car/bikes.

ZEN Performance

If you come accross the right (or wrong depending on your POV) subaru you'll need to use those revs. I've nearly run into the back of a few bikes that gave it a "quick squirt to get away".

I think a great many bike people would be surprised at how quick some cars can be in the real world. And the power to weight ratios WITH RIDER explain this. Say a bike weighs 175kg, and has 150hp, now put at 80kg rider on it, 10kg of fuel and 10kg of protective gear, and your 857hp/ton has suddenly become 545hp/ton. And those figures relate to peak power, a good quick highpower (600+) subaru will be within 90% of it's peak power when going through the gears, a bike I imagine will a little further away than that.

Obviously a modified bike changes the goal posts, but I hope people can appreciate it's not as cut and dried as it might first appear.

[Davey]

Talking from personal experience I am much more prepared to take the car to the limit, simply because its easier and its not so catastrophic if it goes wrong

Most people can get the back end sliding out on their car but there are not many bikers that are able to do this and control it without having a tank slapper.

[Davey]

Its not all about weight though, you have a much lower DCE on a bike and there is far less rolling resistance, this isnt so good for standing starts but once your moving you are using less power over coming friction with the road and air

As a biker I'll always stand by my belief that its down to the size of your ***** and level of skill at the end of the day..

Pudders69

a good quick 600+ bhp car.....not exactley on every corner now are they, infact plenty of supercars don't have that, so yes you have a point but thats a heavily modded scoob against a std bike.

If i came across a 600bhp scoob without knowing then yeah i'd expect to be think shiiit thats quick.

Power to weight, yup probabaly not inc the rider, but then are the car weights inc driver and fully fuelled...suspect not so it does work both ways.

Ultimately i disagree that average biker could be surprised about how fast a car is as ya average porsche 911 will be dispatched without much hassle on a thou, if the rider is lazy and thinks nowt can beat him then yeah but because he ain't trying imho.

or, read ages ago about 5 busa's all in varing form of tuned etc, the one with the least bhp, because the owner wanted a hyperbike for everyday use, had just over 300bhp, the most was something utterly rediculas, now if he could lay that power down, then 600bhp scoob ain't gunna keep up.

Finally having some fun with Brun in his 300bhp scoob and me on 125bhp gixer, just coming off a roundie he later said "i've never had anything leave me like that before", 300bhp ain't that common, 600bhp really ain't common, so yes cars can be bike fast......but only really if the bikes are basically std, which says it all.

Pud

Brun

Granted yes - but due to the car having far more power and weight to start with the effect of the driver and fuel would in my case, have changed the power to weight from 242 bhp/ton to around 225 bhp/ton. If i had you in the car Pud, i would have approximately the power to weight of a fully laden milk float

Jacey Boy

Its all down to the driver/rider, but £ for £ and speed the bike wins all day long

ZEN Performance

If you think a 911 is quick, that's where you're going wrong!

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

I really don't see the point of this 6 page thread.
It's f&cking obvious that like for like with professional driver/rider, a big power bike will be faster than a standard scoob. Don't know why so many people are arguing this point.
Can a scoob be tuned to be faster than a bike? Ofcourse it can, if you have enough money and talent.

It's like asking if Timmy Mallet could ever be a professional athlete. He could be, but is it really going to happen? I think not. Besides, his glasses would slow him down.

Andy.F

The original question was

And the answer is Yes, I have one.

Can you modify an R1 to beat a modified scooby ? Probably.

Jacey Boy

Heard of the R1 Turbo?

[Davey]

Standard R1 would require a seriously modified Impreza to come anywhere near it on a straight.. On the twisties its a different story