Ted Maul

I'm sure a scientist would have a better stab at it than god's 'the universe was created in 7 days..err moving on...' comment.

sarasquares

iTrader: (1)

'a person' dont forget to be pc

Leslie

I dont think its foolish to be guided into living a good life though, however its done.

Les

Geezer

It get dismissed because it is historically inaccurate. Any other document pupporting to be so would also be dismissed if it was inaccurate, it's not really singling out the bible per se.

What has it being about a caprenters son (well, half of it) got to do with it being dismissed or it being relevant? The only reason Christianity got widpesread adoption was because Constantine saw it as a move to unite the Empire under one religion. Had the Romans adopted something else, Christianity would have been forgotten, or at best a minority religion.

Also, Christianity is worlds largest religion by numbers, but it is still a minority of the world that is Christian, so the teachings aren't so wonderful that everyone has discarded other beliefs for them.

Useful information in the bible that everyone can draw on? IIRC there isn't anything 'useful' in there, only directions about how you should live your life (which change along the way) or how you should not think for yourself at all and offer yoursefl wholly to God/the church. Not very useful or pleasant IMO.

As for scientists and how the Universe was created, so what? We have a pretty good idea, the evidence of which can be observed by anyone, unlike the creation story in the bible, which has no evidence to support it whatsoever.


That's very true Les, however, is being homophobic or opressing women leading a good life?

Geezer

Mr Bat

I found this review of the bible useful.

“The book is split into two distinct sections - The Old Testament being quite an entertaining fantasy tale involving flooding, the parting of the sea, evil snakes and the creation of the world itself! The New Testament is the sequel to the old one and like most sequels, it lacks something.

God was a bit grumpy in the first book, to be honest he behaves like a jealous child and even says that "I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me" - so if you don't agree with what he says and worship him, then he's going to come after your kids, and their kids, and so on. Sounds like a bully to me, this is essentially a very old gangster story. He's the Don, the world is his patch - and he's got the power to make your family pay. Still, it's a good yarn!

The second part - The New Testament - is nowhere near as entertaining. The plot is not as epic, so the preachyness comes through strong and you can't help but feel that it's trying to mean all things to all people, this results in it contradicting itself and seeming a bit clumsy at times.

This New Testament should really have been called "Bible 2: Son of God - this time it's personal". There's a huge plot hole in the story though - this Jesus fella is a likeable hippy and ends up getting nailed to a cross only to actually appear again later on in the story. I also felt that this was a blatant rip off of Monty Python's Life of Brian.

Interpret it how you like - no matter what your beliefs are you'll find justification for them in there. Whether you like the philosophy of hate or love, you can follow either and quote passages from this book to support your actions. You can even get different versions of this book with the bits you might not want to follow cut out, genius - pick `n' mix religion! This version drops a lot of the old-speak and replaces it with Americanisations (I refuse to use a Z).

The book also misses out Gods final message to the universe, thankfully this was included in Douglas Adams' Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy: "Sorry for the inconvenience".

In a nutshell: Fantasy fiction fans might be a bit disappointed, 3 stars from me as it's pretty average. The first bit props it up, otherwise it would have been a 2 starrer for me. It has its uses though, if you sit reading this on a train, nobody will sit near you. Just stash your Harry Potter (or whatever) inside.”

sarasquares

iTrader: (1)

i watched something on tv recently about Moses. instead of him walking through water, he may have passed through water during a tsunami when the sea was withdrawing. also something about a mis-spelling with the Red sea and Reed sea.
its all very complicated

Geezer

I saw that too, trying to make scientific sense of the ten plagues. All sounded very plausible, but it boils down to whether you believe exodus took place at all.

I suppose that the exodus story could have come about because of a series of disasters like that, after all, the people of the time would have thought that the destruction of Thera and all the chaos that followed would have been by divine intervention.

Geezer

OllyK

Outside of the bible there's little evidence for most of the content of the bible, Creation, Exodus, The Great Flood and Jesus to name but 4

Klaatu

Not quite true. Don't ask me for facts, links, or "area", I can't recall at this time of night. But in "theory" there was one, around the dead, red seas...may have my "inner" seas mixed up though.

Leslie

Should not think so and all the teaching I have had does the opposite of telling me to behave in such a manner.

Les

Geezer

I have no doubt of that Les, but you can find that in the bible, hence the smilie.

Geezer

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

Belter from B3ta....

Jamie

I would still wipe my **** with it as it needs more crap

sarasquares

iTrader: (1)

apparently, it wasnt the Red sea it was the Reed sea, something about a spelling mistake?

Geezer

Aye, that was it. All the plagues were "explained", it was quite an interesting prog really.

I was waiting to see how they explained the death of the first born, and they did quite a good job of it!

Their explantion was that after Thera exploded, the resulting earthquakes released a load of CO2 which then flooded several areas, like at that lake in Cameroon in the 80s. In ancient Egypt, the first born always slept on the ground floor, so when the CO2 swept through, they were stuffed and suffocated.

Tenuous, but a valiant attempt I thought!

Geezer

Abdabz

I stayed in a premier inn a few years ago on my own, and when I returned from my drunken night of fun alone, decided I would read the gideons book of short stories hidden in a bedside draw.
That first few pages is hilarious - I gave up in no time... AND IT WAS GOOD etc (or whatever it kept repeating)...

Anyway, if it was such a good book, why was there never a sequel?

Leslie

Would not surprise me.

Les

B-B

I would rather live my life as if there is a God and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is. (Albert Camus)

Sara

Iwan

I've read it, and still pick it up regularly.

Fair enough if some folks want to slag it off as a load of crap, that's your call of course. But lots of people find it helpful in their daily lives, and so it's not a load of crap to them. I find it interesting, but not to the level where I have to rely on it to get through the day in a 'Dot Cotton' style way.

I often wonder about this. Is it better to be miserable/stressed in life but at the same time have an unshakeable belief that the bible is garbage and that there's nobody there for you? Or is it better to be woefully misguided and believe in the teachings of a dusty old book, but at the same time have a happy and peaceful life as a result?

You know where the guy (Cypher) says in the movie 'The Matrix' about ignorance being bliss, there's a lot of truth in that IMO...

Leslie

I think that is as good an answer as any you can find.

Les

markr1963

Sorry, Les, that doesn't work for me.

It's not just that I refuse to believe in an ephemeral non-entity, I simply don't need to. Belief in {substitute your chosen deity} is, IMO, the preserve of sheep. If, when I die, I'm wrong, so what? Will I GAF? I doubt it.

BTW Morality. If anyone needs the {substitute their chosen religion's work of fiction} to determine their moral fortitude, I feel sorry for them. If they can't work it out for themselves...

Mark

Geezer

That's really not a very nice thing to say, it implies that life without God is without morals or values or that people who don't believe are in some way inferior.

I know plenty of people who believe who are thoroughly decent people, and likewise plenty of people who are not believers who are thoroughly decent people.

Geezer

Donald Trump

I'd rather live my life knowing there isn't a god but somehow manage to be there when all the 'sheep' find out the truth .

Leslie

You are perfectly entitled to think that if you wish, and I would not try to change your beliefs of course. And I am naturally also entitled to my own beliefs!

You may well possess moral fortitude, maybe due to your parents' influence for which they should be praised. Most people need some guidance from the beginning to learn such things, it does not always come automatically.

As people get older and become aware of their own mortality they often change their minds and begin to consider the possibility of a superior being!

Les

Leslie

Well I doubt that Mr Camus was actually inferring that which you say about morals etc Geezer.

As I have personally explained to Olly in the past, I believe that if you follow your conscience and live a good life with respect to others, whether you believe in a God or not, you won't go far wrong anyway. That is the most important thing as far as I am concerned.

Les

markr1963

Yes, I respect your beliefs.

I don't doubt my parents had something to do with my moral alignment. IMO that is where it should come from. It's a sad that these days there seems to be precious little of that going on. Religion, whatever the flavour, is not the answer. I could quote you Old Testiment stuff I'd sooner refer you to, as an example, the God Delusion by Richard Dawkins. He's far more eloquent.

Les, you were doing ok until your last paragraph. Advancing years is the hope of most of us but do you really think that we alll look for some omniescent super being enlightenment? Of course, I can only categorically speak for myself. IMO I am part of the evolutionary machine. What I learn, adapt to etc will pass on in my genes. That's the way it is.
The need to believe in a superior being baffled me. How does that help, BTW?
The possibility that there are other life forms, superior or otherwise, in the universe doesn't. In fact, I'd say it was odds on.

Prasius

iTrader: (1)

yes, I have - I went to a Church of England school, went to the Chapels childrens bible study things and all that.....

Basic issue is that while much in it is right, and certainly not a bad way to live your life, there were too many inconsistencies and incidents involving stoning women and killing babies for me to actually like the Christian God. I have issues with their God that go beyond what is simply written; but pretty basic issues about his behaviour, omnipotent nature and the idea of original sin.

As it is, I'm now officially "Other Belief" and actually find I have a lot more respect for peoples various beliefs now than I did before.

I have however, already bought my burial plot.. the idea of being buried in consecrated Christian ground, finding out that they were right, and then having to explain that, while I understand that he felt a need to stick up for his homeboys, killing a bunch of baby boys kinda made him look like a bit of an arsehole - is one of those awkward conversations I'd rather try and avoid

OllyK

There have been lots of localised floods, just never a global one as claimed in the bible.

SiPie

...mostly out of fear as they start getting a bit scared about the big box in the ground....

Time people started to accept that it's just a big sleep, nada, nought, nothing, zero, lights out, game over, all black......

Good night

My opinion anyway

PS Whoever infracted Jamie for airing (admittedly a rather harshly put) book review, needs to have a look at themselves...

It's just an opinion and the last time I checked, we are still allowed one of those

Leslie

Yes well whether you feel like that at the moment is up to you and even you do not really know how you may feel in many years time. What I said is a fact, many older people do indeed think that way as they become aware that time is running out. I did not in fact say that everyone is likely to move in that direction, but in fact that many do.

When it comes to other forms of life, I would never be so arrogant as to say that there are no other forms of life in the Universe. They could be superior to us or not, all depending on the stage of their development. It could even be that the laws of nature as we know them do not apply in the same way. None of this of course is to say that there still cannot be one superior being who has the whole business in hand.

We all make up our own minds and there is no positive proof of such things in one direction or another. Just theories on the part of the scientists which are by no means positive, or personal beliefs by individuals who feel when looking at the existence of the Universe and us that there may well be some being who is running the whole shooting match. That of course cannot be proved either, so it is down to personal feelings of course.

I have no wish to influence your thinking nor will you influence mine. I only ask that I am allowed to have my own beliefs without the necessity of rude and unpleasant jibes etc about it.

Les