Is the Labour Era over?
24 April 2008, 12:41 AM
#61
The Labour era was over when Kinnock sent Heffer packing back in the early 80's(If I remember correctly).
Since then we have a choice of different shades of blue.
And we have never had it so good!
Plus ca change!
Shame I can't be bothered to vote anymore.
Since then we have a choice of different shades of blue.
And we have never had it so good!
Plus ca change!
Shame I can't be bothered to vote anymore.
24 April 2008, 07:06 AM
#62
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I hope Labour dont get in, what with all the intrusion into our lives. The stealth taxes, what is it? Over 75 new taxes have been invented to part you from your hard earned cash. The £1,000 per family just to provide public sector gold plated pensions. The amount they receive from vehicle excise duty has doubled whilst emissions have fallen shows that the green tax is just another stealth tax (but we all know that). The devolved power away from the police and the courts to allow councils and others to fine us, we all see the significant increases in weekly bills, etc etc..... Can it be worse than this with Cameron?
24 April 2008, 08:24 AM
#63
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There doesn't seem to be a heavyweight in politics anymore and for me Cameron is in the dull as dishwater slot with the others.
Best quote I heard this morning was about Camerons attempted savaging in the commons of Brown over the 10p U turn
"Bit like a pillowfight where it goes on for an awfully long time but no one actually gets hurt"
Best quote I heard this morning was about Camerons attempted savaging in the commons of Brown over the 10p U turn
"Bit like a pillowfight where it goes on for an awfully long time but no one actually gets hurt"
24 April 2008, 11:22 AM
#64
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I'd just like to ask you a simple question Pete.
Do you value this country and all its traditions and culture, or are you happy to see it dragged into the depths and eventually given away to the most corrupt organisation for many years?
Les
Do you value this country and all its traditions and culture, or are you happy to see it dragged into the depths and eventually given away to the most corrupt organisation for many years?
Les
24 April 2008, 11:57 AM
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You left school with the ability to spell and add up.
Those teachers together with the police and your parents were respected
Those policemen you actually saw on the street.
People saved up a 10% deposit for a house and could only borrow 3 x1 income
or 2.5 joint and behaved sensibly
People worried about owing £95,000 on credit cards and didn't live in a world when it became the norm.
Although interest rates were bad,they didn't run at say 10% and the government kept telling you 'its only 2% in our world'.
We weren't falsely taxed because we didn't get snow at Chrismas or we had a pants summer therefore global warming (suppose it was ozone debate then but they didn't tax your aerosols,bet they are cursing)
And,perhaps most importantly(despite having missed out umpteen things that are awful now) there weren't BMW's and mercs on everyones drive.
Yes I have issues
Yes I am following your bait,but generally I think we have a pretty grotty,rude,poorly educated buch of misfits in the UK mostly down to labour policies
Those teachers together with the police and your parents were respected
Those policemen you actually saw on the street.
People saved up a 10% deposit for a house and could only borrow 3 x1 income
or 2.5 joint and behaved sensibly
People worried about owing £95,000 on credit cards and didn't live in a world when it became the norm.
Although interest rates were bad,they didn't run at say 10% and the government kept telling you 'its only 2% in our world'.
We weren't falsely taxed because we didn't get snow at Chrismas or we had a pants summer therefore global warming (suppose it was ozone debate then but they didn't tax your aerosols,bet they are cursing)
And,perhaps most importantly(despite having missed out umpteen things that are awful now) there weren't BMW's and mercs on everyones drive.
Yes I have issues
Yes I am following your bait,but generally I think we have a pretty grotty,rude,poorly educated buch of misfits in the UK mostly down to labour policies
24 April 2008, 12:02 PM
#68
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You left school with the ability to spell and add up.
Those teachers together with the police and your parents were respected
Those policemen you actually saw on the street.
People saved up a 10% deposit for a house and could only borrow 3 x1 income
or 2.5 joint and behaved sensibly
People worried about owing £95,000 on credit cards and didn't live in a world when it became the norm.
Although interest rates were bad,they didn't run at say 10% and the government kept telling you 'its only 2% in our world'.
We weren't falsely taxed because we didn't get snow at Chrismas or we had a pants summer therefore global warming (suppose it was ozone debate then but they didn't tax your aerosols,bet they are cursing)
And,perhaps most importantly(despite having missed out umpteen things that are awful now) there weren't BMW's and mercs on everyones drive.
Yes I have issues Yes I am following your bait,but generally I think we have a pretty grotty,rude,poorly educated bunch of misfits in the UK mostly down to labour policies
Those teachers together with the police and your parents were respected
Those policemen you actually saw on the street.
People saved up a 10% deposit for a house and could only borrow 3 x1 income
or 2.5 joint and behaved sensibly
People worried about owing £95,000 on credit cards and didn't live in a world when it became the norm.
Although interest rates were bad,they didn't run at say 10% and the government kept telling you 'its only 2% in our world'.
We weren't falsely taxed because we didn't get snow at Chrismas or we had a pants summer therefore global warming (suppose it was ozone debate then but they didn't tax your aerosols,bet they are cursing)
And,perhaps most importantly(despite having missed out umpteen things that are awful now) there weren't BMW's and mercs on everyones drive.
Yes I have issues
Yes I am following your bait,but generally I think we have a pretty grotty,rude,poorly educated bunch of misfits in the UK mostly down to labour policiesI am sure someone will say maggie and the tory party sowed the seeds - guess what NL poured on the compost and nurtured them rather than re planting or weeding out the poor ones.
Too busy coming up with soundbites, applying sticking plasters ans lining their own nests.
24 April 2008, 12:03 PM
#69
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Yes to the first part, I very much value our country and traditions, I also value and enjoy the fact that our traditions are not fixed and have evolved and changed throughout the years.
I think the problem with a lot of the comments on this thread is that they are simply 'we hate Labour' rhetoric. It's a fine and respectable position to hold, but the problem is that people then attack EVERYTHING the governments does and blames them for EVERYTHING that goes wrong, and at the same time give no credit for ANYTHING that goes well. This in my view is fairly slack thinking.
There are lots of social and economic challenges our country faces, we share these same challenges with most other industrialised nations, globalisation bring huge opportunity, but also huge challenges, whoever was in government would be struggling in the face of this.
Now I'm not saying for one second that this government haven't made some big mistakes, because they absolutely have (in my view), but has there ever been a government that hasn't made big mistakes?
Politics just isn't black and white, Left or Right it's shades of grey, there is little absolute wrong or right that governments do, so why do people keep portraying things in those terms?
Martin
24 April 2008, 12:28 PM
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Surely there must be room for another party who can sort us out!
Let me see.
Cap immigration from 3rd world countries until we can rebalance. All immigrants to have at least £xK in the bank + a "skill" before coming over (unless getting married to someone already here).
Petrol/Diesel down to 85ppL.
Execute major offenders to free up space in prison.
No more than 3 children per family!
Right to defend yourself in your own property. Get rid of human rights/equal opportunity/more rights for 1-legged ex call girls etc...
Nick
Awaits a flaming but doesn't care.
Let me see.
Cap immigration from 3rd world countries until we can rebalance. All immigrants to have at least £xK in the bank + a "skill" before coming over (unless getting married to someone already here).
Petrol/Diesel down to 85ppL.
Execute major offenders to free up space in prison.
No more than 3 children per family!
Right to defend yourself in your own property. Get rid of human rights/equal opportunity/more rights for 1-legged ex call girls etc...
Nick
Awaits a flaming but doesn't care.
Well, I'd vote "Nick" !
PS Just amended slightly.
24 April 2008, 12:37 PM
#72
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Hi Les, I give this one a go if it's OK.
Yes to the first part, I very much value our country and traditions, I also value and enjoy the fact that our traditions are not fixed and have evolved and changed throughout the years.
I think the problem with a lot of the comments on this thread is that they are simply 'we hate Labour' rhetoric. It's a fine and respectable position to hold, but the problem is that people then attack EVERYTHING the governments does and blames them for EVERYTHING that goes wrong, and at the same time give no credit for ANYTHING that goes well. This in my view is fairly slack thinking.
There are lots of social and economic challenges our country faces, we share these same challenges with most other industrialised nations, globalisation bring huge opportunity, but also huge challenges, whoever was in government would be struggling in the face of this.
Now I'm not saying for one second that this government haven't made some big mistakes, because they absolutely have (in my view), but has there ever been a government that hasn't made big mistakes?
Politics just isn't black and white, Left or Right it's shades of grey, there is little absolute wrong or right that governments do, so why do people keep portraying things in those terms?
Martin
Yes to the first part, I very much value our country and traditions, I also value and enjoy the fact that our traditions are not fixed and have evolved and changed throughout the years.
I think the problem with a lot of the comments on this thread is that they are simply 'we hate Labour' rhetoric. It's a fine and respectable position to hold, but the problem is that people then attack EVERYTHING the governments does and blames them for EVERYTHING that goes wrong, and at the same time give no credit for ANYTHING that goes well. This in my view is fairly slack thinking.
There are lots of social and economic challenges our country faces, we share these same challenges with most other industrialised nations, globalisation bring huge opportunity, but also huge challenges, whoever was in government would be struggling in the face of this.
Now I'm not saying for one second that this government haven't made some big mistakes, because they absolutely have (in my view), but has there ever been a government that hasn't made big mistakes?
Politics just isn't black and white, Left or Right it's shades of grey, there is little absolute wrong or right that governments do, so why do people keep portraying things in those terms?
Martin
a staunch unionite
from liverpool
and you worked in the mines
24 April 2008, 12:49 PM
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Sorry , Paul, you have walked right into this one..
24 April 2008, 12:49 PM
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24 April 2008, 12:51 PM
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24 April 2008, 12:54 PM
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Blimey the shrimp-meister has already attracted SN's Guardian reading, lentil munching, sandal wearing right on lefties
Only kidding - it is good to see the other pov - even if it is wrong - I'll get my coat
Only kidding - it is good to see the other pov - even if it is wrong
- I'll get my coat
24 April 2008, 12:56 PM
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Ace screen name though.
24 April 2008, 01:05 PM
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Are you a red dwarf fan by chance - thinking of Rimmer when the polymorph (season 3 episode 2 - OK i am a sad anorak) removed all his anger and frustration and he appeared as a wannabe leftie/hippie in sandals and a goatee and he had a great t-shirt with the slogan 'Give Quiche a chance' - that's your best t-shirt, that is
It is a great screen name and i wonder whom it really is...
24 April 2008, 01:31 PM
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24 April 2008, 01:36 PM
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24 April 2008, 01:39 PM
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24 April 2008, 02:07 PM
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24 April 2008, 02:10 PM
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Hi Les, I give this one a go if it's OK.
Yes to the first part, I very much value our country and traditions, I also value and enjoy the fact that our traditions are not fixed and have evolved and changed throughout the years.
I think the problem with a lot of the comments on this thread is that they are simply 'we hate Labour' rhetoric. It's a fine and respectable position to hold, but the problem is that people then attack EVERYTHING the governments does and blames them for EVERYTHING that goes wrong, and at the same time give no credit for ANYTHING that goes well. This in my view is fairly slack thinking.
There are lots of social and economic challenges our country faces, we share these same challenges with most other industrialised nations, globalisation bring huge opportunity, but also huge challenges, whoever was in government would be struggling in the face of this.
Now I'm not saying for one second that this government haven't made some big mistakes, because they absolutely have (in my view), but has there ever been a government that hasn't made big mistakes?
Politics just isn't black and white, Left or Right it's shades of grey, there is little absolute wrong or right that governments do, so why do people keep portraying things in those terms?
Martin
Yes to the first part, I very much value our country and traditions, I also value and enjoy the fact that our traditions are not fixed and have evolved and changed throughout the years.
I think the problem with a lot of the comments on this thread is that they are simply 'we hate Labour' rhetoric. It's a fine and respectable position to hold, but the problem is that people then attack EVERYTHING the governments does and blames them for EVERYTHING that goes wrong, and at the same time give no credit for ANYTHING that goes well. This in my view is fairly slack thinking.
There are lots of social and economic challenges our country faces, we share these same challenges with most other industrialised nations, globalisation bring huge opportunity, but also huge challenges, whoever was in government would be struggling in the face of this.
Now I'm not saying for one second that this government haven't made some big mistakes, because they absolutely have (in my view), but has there ever been a government that hasn't made big mistakes?
Politics just isn't black and white, Left or Right it's shades of grey, there is little absolute wrong or right that governments do, so why do people keep portraying things in those terms?
Martin
I dont necessarily hate Labour as such, but I find no respect for this later edition and the so called "third way".
I see a bunch of self seeking toadies who have told us lies continuously and misled us with their "initiatives" and soundbites which in the most part have amounted to nothing which has improved the lot of the people of this country. The so called "modernisation" ploy has always seemed to be convenient to the authorities but extremely inconvenient to the rest of us.
Their policies have encouraged bad behaviour and have dragged this once great country into the depths of depravity. Crime is king now and law abiding people will always take second place to the louts as far as "Human Rights" are concerned. The PC Plonkers have been allowed to take over and are further undermining our traditions and culture. These are the ones who hate Great Britain and especially England and what it stands for. They are actively planning to destroy it and hand us over to a corrupt community.
It is true that they have piled scads of cash into the NHS, but most of that money is being wasted in employing a vast bureaurocracy which does nothing to improve the lot of the people at the sharp end who are doing their best in spite of all that.
They have created an enormous number of "non jobs" with grandiose titles and high salaries but which do absolutely nothing for the rest of the country. Of course that all makes the employment totals look artificially good and is a fine source of votes as well.
Everything is fudged and fiddled from Olympic costs to inflation figures and all to their advantage and certainly not ours.
Do you think that globalisation will be a good thing when the politicians are run by industrial leaders and we have lost our democracy such as it is and the world is onr great monopoly? Do you trust the modern politician to run things for the people as they used to do rather than for themselves?
I have seen a good bit more life that you I imagine and I do remember back to when a politician's word could be trusted in the main and also the spirit in this country was that people thought of others and supported fair play without the thought of cheating the system to their advantage. Bad leaders encourage bad behaviour, I saw that starting in the time of the Wilson leadership.
As I have said before, I dont know whether "Dave" would be able to sort it out, or whether he is really inclined to do so. But i don't think he could do worse than this lot.
Les
24 April 2008, 02:11 PM
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So please list all the wonderful things NuLabour have allegedly done in the last 10 years that they deserve our collective thanks for - because I can't think of a single thing.
24 April 2008, 02:15 PM
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Well, they are supposedly in charge so who else are we supposed to hold responsible? NuLabour ministers ALWAYS try to blame their many shortcomings on previous Tory governments, or the 'global situation' or whatever lame excuse comes to mind. They never take any responsiblity for any of their mistakes and mostly don't even have the courage to own up to them.
So please list all the wonderful things NuLabour have allegedly done in the last 10 years that they deserve our collective thanks for - because I can't think of a single thing.
So please list all the wonderful things NuLabour have allegedly done in the last 10 years that they deserve our collective thanks for - because I can't think of a single thing.
24 April 2008, 02:18 PM
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24 April 2008, 02:26 PM
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I think the main thing that Labour have achieved is a massive increase in public spending, without taxing us all to the hilt. This has been managed by keeping a very high level of employment, therefore keeping the tax revenue in line with what is required.
Our public spending was the amongst the worst in Europe when Labour took over.
Our public spending was the amongst the worst in Europe when Labour took over.