The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Sadly, when in Rome do as the Romans do.

Obide by British Law if your British.

Perhaps the very same books where used by the insurgents who blew up the 4 soldiers in Afghanistan today?

?????

Perhaps if she married a fine British chap then her parents would have her killed? Or would they be accepting of British Law?

Debate that one.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

As have I: she was in possession of illegal material, she was rightly prosecuted. The point of argument concerned whether her "poetry" should be considered among that material. This was not simply an innocent person prosecuted for their views: she had illegal material - that is beyond refute!

A desperately naive and illogical thing to say: so no-one would be harmed if you wrote a book on how to adduct and abuse children without leaving evidence? If you are in possession of such material, be it child ****, terrorism, or whatever criminal material: you ARE part of the problem! Instructional material doesn't just emerge out of thin air: it is the product of personal experience, or reference to other experienced parties.

Completely untenable argument: possession of terrorist instructional material is hardly the foundation of a upstanding citizen, especially when considered in the pretext of someone who calls themselves the "lyrical terrorist" and makes a name for themselves with inflammatory rants against the west! On the legal side of things, the only reason the CPS aren't pressing for a re-trail is that they believe she has served a sentence commensurate with the terrorist literature that she was in possession of and which the appeal court didn't rule as being non-admissible.

I seriously doubt that: I would best her intellectually, as easily as I have dealt with your sad attempts at trolling.

My view is that people who hide behind the rights and freedoms afforded by western laws, should perhaps refrain from bemoaning them so agressively (and certainly from supporting criminal activities that endeavor to undermine them) or go somewhere where they might be more happy and have less cause for complaint.

I think that's about as fundamentally (no pun intended) sound an argument as one could postulate!

I am the champagne of intellect to your Tennants Extra, Narco.

Ns04 has left the building!

vindaloo

This is "the problem" with constantly changing or amending laws. Case history and precedence makes a lot of common sense of what is demanding and complicated... And they still get it wrong sometimes.

Writing verse/poetry and possession of written words isn't an offence in this country.

The CPS failed to make the case that she's a terrorist. The offence she was convicted of was improperly presented to the jury.

So... legally....
1) She's not a terrorist and has been proved innocent in court.
2) It's not proven that she's distributed materials or otherwise given aid to individuals likely to commit future terrorist acts.

J.

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

Oh blimey...I might stick around for this. It is getting interesting

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Have this one's on me, Tony!

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmd_blo...ed-popcorn.jpg

I'm not hanging around this thread any longer lest I perpetuate the trolling and, in doing so, become what I condemn!

Ns04

Intellectually formidable I maybe, but my heart is in circulating filth and bad taste on SN. There, this gives Narco something to get his teeth into in my absence!

NACRO

All you've done is give a viewpoint that disagrees with mine and I might add the great British Justice system.

If you believe she was 'rightly prosecuted' then you're as mistaken as the CPS was. Despite their attempts to fit her up justice prevailed.

That's the problem with your argument- it's already been lost and was the moment her conviction was rightly overturned.

As for Champagne what you've shown here is more like a half empty bottle of two day old pomagne that someone urinated in..........

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

Half empty or half full????

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

You know your cheap plonk, sir!

Well I'm sorry, but the queue for the toilet was massive and I couldn't hold it in anymore!!

Still, no harm done: I left the bottle on an empty table in the restaurant
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reserved for the release celebrations of a Miss. Enshallah Samina

Ns04

Henrik

iTrader: (5)

Ns04:

Merely having and/or reading a "terrorist handbook" doesn't make you a terrorist.

I read the anarchists cookbook, the terrorists cookbook etc etc in my early teens. Does that make me a terrorist?

When I was about 15 I made some of that explosive that they used in the tube bombings (acetone + hydro peroxide). Does that make me a terrorist?

I even shared the information on how to make the explosives with my friends! Does that make me a terrorist?

On all counts, I'd argue that, actually, all things considered, I'm not a terrorist.

Do I like the government and the way they've invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, or the way they've chipped away at my liberties for the past couple of years (this goes for Sweden as well, btw, before you say "**** off back to Sweden then")? The answer to that is NO. Do I speak out against it on online forums? Occasionally.

I'm not scared that I'll be whisked off to detention (and possibly being prosecuted) just yet, because I'm white European of non descript religion, so that (possibly) makes whatever I've done OK to the CPS/MI5 etc, or maybe I've just slipped under the radar so far.

Btw, I also picked up a copy of Mein Kampf when I was about 14. Does that make me a ****? As it happens, I never got around to reading it, but I still possessed it for a while. I do kind of fit the physical appearance of Germans...

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Henrik, I think the previous posts above respond to your points; I'd just be going over old ground.

AND....in any case:

I've always had my doubts about you.....mein fuhrer (sp?)

NACRO

In fact in the case of Samina the law has found that her conviction was unsafe and that all the points you contend about her are in fact false and unproven.

I note you still haven't been able to admit this 'little' flaw in your entire argument makes it invalid. Maybe best to stick to using what you call your 'intellect' to making statements like 'f**k off home' perhaps?

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

Is Chaos back

NACRO

Just noticed this and have to say I resent the implications.

I've felt drawn towards Mecca for some time now so it goes without saying my belief that Samina and also Islam have been victims of a most vile persecution in this case could not be any more sincere. Truly it is so.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

I dont know, cheap suits and now this !!
Always thought you were classier

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

if your friends were bin laden, bin hidin, bin there, bin bombin then yes

NACRO

You know I'm surprised that those bingo people aren't the subject of a campaign against them by the great forces of Islam. They are dragging the name of the Prophet through the dirt by associating it with gambling.

I'm going to bring this up on a Muslim forum I'm a member of and see what they think.

cookstar

iTrader: (6)

Among the people he is banned from meeting in London is al-Qaeda leader Osama Bin Laden"


I found this part funny.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Lord Phillips added: "The jury was required to consider not only documents which were capable of being of practical utility for a person committing or preparing an act of terrorism, but a large number of documents that were not [i.e. her poems]."We consider that there was scope for the jury to have become confused."

So she got let off cause the CPS included documents -in good faith- that the COA subsequently decided were not under the scope of the law IN ADDITION to documents that the law lords have upheld were under the scope of the law in their ruling. They were simply concerned that the jury may have got confused, so erred on the side of caution.




PS Get back under your Bridge!!!

coolangatta

Bollocks, bollocks, bollocks. You and Nacro are unbelievably naive if you believe that we are 'somehow' better off by this judgement I don't know what agenda you follow but it must be born of seriously flawed reasoning.
Are you advocating that our KKK 'friends' can say/write/push/ perpetuate their views openly without fear of prosecution. You make me chuckle

PeteBrant

Aside from the argument hand, this is the double edged sword of freedom of speech. If you support it, the you have accept that some people will say things that you don't agree with.

But I would rahter than that censorship, or gagging of points of view I don't agree with.

I abhore the BNP and everything it stands for, but I would never vote for a legal "gagging" of it, because to do so would be to support a gagging of a POV I might hold dear.

THe best way to deal with issues is to debate and reason, not to stifle debate altogether.

NACRO

The point is that a book on how to drive a car could be construed as "documents which [B]were capable of being of practical utility for a person committing or preparing an act of terrorism" if the car was then packed with explosives/used in an attack. At least it could under the interpretation of the law you and other persecutors of Islam are using.

I would further argue that the CPS did not do anything in 'good faith' in this case and in fact attempted to present conjecture that she was providing reconnaissance for a possible terrorist attack.

She wasn't 'let off' either, her conviction was rightly overturned. A triumph for British justice. All we need now is her to receive compensation and the wheel will have turned full circle.

coolangatta

Idealism at it's finest.
Get real, we can't allow lunes to regulate/control the 'hard of thinking' amongst us.
The 'thinking majority' don't need to be talked to.

PeteBrant

Well its not really idealism is it - It's pretty much the status quo.

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

Pointless discussion..everyone knows that Eric Morley and his empire was around far before any prophet !!

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

You've got me: the following titles can, of course, be construed as every bit as innocuous as the Haynes car manual, especially when owned by someone who posts inflammatory anti western rhetoric as "the lyrical terrorist"

"other documents in her possession, including the al-Qaeda Manual, the Terrorist's Handbook, the Mujahideen Poisons Handbook"

She may as well have had a copy of:

http://www.almostaproverb.com/images...mies_thumb.jpg

And you, sir, need a copy of:

http://mosquito.25.free.fr/LFS/Fakes/en/Troll's%20Brain%20and%20memory.gif

Ns04

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

NACRO, you say thjat you are leaning toward Mecca.

But are you British?

Do agree that forced marriage is a crime and against human rights?

Ritual abortion because of sex is right?

The blessing of gay marriage in Church is accepatable?

There should be a Truth and Reconcilliation Committee in Northen Ireland?

I ask out of curiosity.

????

SwissTony

iTrader: (19)

coolangatta

What, allowing lunes to control the 'Duuurrr' minority is the status quo?
I hope not.
P.S. I include Nacro et al in the 'hard of thinking' brigade.

NACRO

He couldn't even get it right despite one of his favourite 'decades later' edits.

I still contend that possession of such material doesn't make someone a terrorist nor should the law be used/interpreted in that way.

Thankfully in the case of Samina the CPS in it's desire to viciously persecute Islamists managed to screw the case up.

Regarding Blue Dragoon's questions I won't answer them individually but would say that if he is trying to imply that Islam is opposed to them then he's being rather short sighted in what he views as 'Islam'.

edited to reply to blue dragoon