coolangatta

PeteBrant, let me tell you a story...
I live in a city with a sizable minority of 'foreigners'. I'm a foreigner also but not part of the sizeable minority.
Some of the sizeable minority engage in behaviour that is counter to 'the norm' in this part of the world. Nothing that would be seen in the UK as particularly serious but serious non the less.
So....the sizeable minority get blamed for much more than they're responsible for. Not fair, 'bollocks', I hear you shout, but hear me out.
The people here have no agenda, they don't think black, white or yellow.
They react to what happens around them only and how it is reported.
They are not racist and don't believe that the 'sizeable minority' are born to rape. They do however see the 'threat' that undermines their well ordered community.
I understand them.

Windsor

I'd like to think you simply misunderstood what I wrote, but it is obvious you chose to misinterpret it in order to be confrontational. Neither matters to me, if you want to come across as trouble making you go for it, punchy.

Now for the rebuttal... I didn't say 'black people are being bred..." which would imply ALL black people, I said "these people are being bred..." i.e. the people who are committing the crimes. The fact that the majority of these people are black youths living out some 'gangsta' lifestyle is the reason I contend the crimes should be more accurately entitled "black youth crime" because they are culturally motivated.

Of course we also have "white youth crime" too, however this is usually more to do with drunk and disorderly type offences rather than shooting and stabbing each other.

People like you who refuse to recognise the root cause of a problem for fear of offending someone must share responsibility for that problem. The sooner society accepts that young black kids are being lead culturally into armed gangs much more so than any other race the sooner we can do something about it and, to be honest, I think society is a lot further down that route than you are.

Now put your energy into suggesting solutions rather than trying to besmirch those of us who are simply stating the facts. Trying to gag common sense with the 'racist card' used to work but, aside from being hackneyed and tedious, it is the reason we are in this mess so I will be gagged no more!

It's not knife crime.

PeteBrant

Hang about, how else I am supposed to interpret the following statement:


This isn't 'knife crime', or 'gun crime' or 'machete crime', this is black youth crime. They are being brought up to behave in this way, each generation becoming worse than the next.

These people don't care about tougher sentencing or ever more draconian laws concerning knives. All these do is inconvenience law abiding people, anglers, butchers and the like. No, these people are being bred and brought up to stab, shoot, rape and rob and if it isn't with knives it will be with something else.


What does this say to me? That Black people are getting worse with every generation and are born and bred to commit crime. Whats nore, you explicity say that they are being brought up to behave that way

Now if I read that, then I am going to call it bollocks, which it is. It's got nothing to do with being confrontational, its a simple fact.

Nevetherless, if this was not the crux of your point, then please feel free to clarify.


More white people stab and shoot each other than black people. Fact.
THe more violkent crime is to do with product of the environment (i.e. inner cities and the like) rather than any sort of race issues. Hence you get a higher amount of black youths commiting crime in inner city London, and you get white kids commiting the same crimes in inner city Liverpool (remember the 12 year old that got shot?).

These crimes are not cuturally motivated, that is utter tosh.

The root cause is enviroment and opportunity, simple as. It has nothing to do with colourm in that if you are black, you ar enot inherently more disposed to crime, but you are mor elikely to be poor or disadvantaged or live in an inner city area (which, amazingly, produces some very nasty white kids too).

Solutions are of course, more difficult. I would suggest that somethign needs to happen with combatting ghettoisation and opportunities for underprivilegdged kids. But it is certainly not to put it at the door of Black kids due to cultural motivations. Which is, yes, you guessed it, is absolute ****ing bollocks.

The Zohan

I would be interested to see the split of how many of the crime are committed by immigrants and asylium seaker who have been in this country for less than 15 years.

We have been allowing in people from countries where life has little value, a lot of SSA countries and from eastern europe as well. Some may well have witnessed, been vixctim of or even taken part in extreme violence and murder and be hardened to it in ways we cannot imagine.

I am not saying all immigrants and asylum seakers are bad although we have little checks or ability to check on people and thier background and i do doubt any way of quantifying this.

mamoon2

Erm, thats the only example you can think of though isn't it, and how many years ago was that? Media outrage because it was White on Black crime, not so much coverage on the everyday crime these Black gang members are commiting. Think you will find 90% of the stabbings in London this year were by black wannabe gangsters. And with this being a predomenetly white country ( ) what does that statistic tell you?

ScoTTyB

If you actually bothered to look at the facts rather than rant about something you obviously know nothing about you will see in London it is BLACK <<<<------- BLACK NOT WHITE kids that are stabbing everyone.

Stop trying to make out I'm racist, facts speak for themselves.

PeteBrant

I think you should actually bother to look and see what I called bollocks in the first place.

Let me reiterate it for you.

Winsdor insinutated, as far as I could see, that Black kids are brought up to rape, rob, steal and murder. And I said, thats bollocks.

Understand?

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Pete, you've been doing a lot of swearing on this thread!


On this occasion I will let you off though, as you are using it to underline a rebuttal! .
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Oh, and I happen to like the word "bollocks"

PeteBrant

Sometimes its the only way!


You wait till I tell your students

markGT

Kind of agree with most of what you are saying but I suspect there are a lot of white wanabee black gangsters out there. Unfortuntley the rot set in decades ago with the Tory government and Labour "tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime" have made it worse with lefty doo gooders throughout government and local governmant. For far too long scum have been allowed to breed and have produced scum worse than themselves.

It makes my heart bleed as its all you hear on the news now its 2 French students murdered!

FWIW I would bring back the death penalty, I know it will never happen as there are too many do gooders out there that only care about caring for the minority not the majority.

I left the UK over five years ago and crime was one of the biggest reasons if I'm honest. However it seems much worse now and I can't see it getting any better.

Lets be clear; there is no excuse for murdering innocent people no matter how bad your upbringing has been or where you live. Thats just an excuse by leftie do gooders. Its OK he/she has brutally murdered somebody, he's/she is from the ghetto you know. Ah why didn't you say, kill away!

ScoTTyB

You've got anger issues.

DCI Gene Hunt

...... have you read this thread?

Pete's saying something different to what you appear to be insinuating..... but don't let that stop you

DCI - If I get a tan do I also get the urge to stab and rape people?.... possibly

Going 4 400bhp

iTrader: (2)

You have just said in London.....

Then you said that this is a predomenetly a white country....

So i should take it that london is england? Compared to the rest of england London is a very small place!!!

Think about it for a sec???

You said about the media outrage because it was white on black crime what i would take as there is not much media on black on black crime or black on any other race right?

So were are you getting the info that it is all black kids kill and carrying knifes?

The truth is there has been white on black crimes going on for years! Much more then anything thats going on right now. But it was just not coverd as it was kept under wraps by people like yourself.

Your a raciest! End of, a few of you are in this thread. You have no proof and talking about facts that i still have not seen from any of you. Your just spitting your upset but are not giving any solution to the problem.

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

And out comes the...

DCI Gene Hunt

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

I think racism has started to tip the other way, fuelled by our mp's shovelling the shame of the slave trade onto a generation who had nothing to do with it.

Our department has been told we are ethnically under represented as all 36 of us are white never mind the fact the rest of the factory is mainly lack or Polish.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

'lack' Freudian slip me thinks. I put it to you you're a racist, sir!

Going 4 400bhp

iTrader: (2)

I would not expect any of you to understand something you have never experienced!

Don’t except it to make you feel better, we all know the truth

The Zohan

If you are referring to discrimination
How patronising, having worked in the ME i have experienced discrimination first hand myself and seen it in action for a lot less fortunate people than myself. IO think you will find a few others in the same position - in some ways you are discrminating yourself!

I am not sure that discrimination (as you inferr) along with living in a deprived area or lack of prospects gives anyone the right to carry and kill.

This is an attitude that has been allowed to fester and not been delt with over many years and now we are all suffering for it, white, black or orange!

I wonder justhow any of these kids did not get educated and if it is due to them oand por parenting/lack of a father figure/male role model in some cases.


Is is too easy just to blame everone else for your problems and take responsibility rather than do the right thing.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Spot on!

PeteBrant

Of course people should take responsibility for thier own actions. However, at some point you have to say that it is not just coincidence that inner city, poor, high unemployment, poor performing schools, disadvantaged areas, produce higher crime figures.

Invest in the worst areas, don't just leave them to rot, and you will see a change.

Spoon

Yes, they will have new buildings and amenities to wreck then. You won't change scum by throwing money at them.

PeteBrant

Yes, well, investing in poor areas does not mean putting up a new Youth centre, it means Schools, training colleges, jobs, opportunites.. Something that is severely lacking at the moment.

People are not inherently "bad", they are products of thier enviroment. Change the environment, change the people that are produced by it.

coolangatta

Lets send all these knife wielding 5hitbags on expensive trips around the globe to teach them a lesson
Remember that experiment in social engineering . A great success I'm sure

Spoon

Pete, I know exactly what it means and have seen results that make no difference to the area at all.

Disagree with that. How many families carry on the tradition of being 'bad'. The thing is now, and for the last several years, lots, but obviously not all children, are born with no future. They follow their 'useless' scrounging parents like its the norm. That's not a product of their environment, that's bad genes.

I like your optimism, Pete but its way off reality and while there are people that genuinely think like you then this country is never going to get better.

PeteBrant

Its never been done - So I don't know how you have seen results. Disadvataged areas have been disadvantaged areas for decades - Which ones have been pulled out of that cycle recently?

"Bad genes" do not exist in the vast majority of cases.


As for your assertions that someone on benefits will have children that go onto benefits, there is nothing except anecdotal evidence to support such a claim.
And besides, that goes back to getting those people out of the povety trap. Get them off benefits, give kids a decent start, decent opportunities.

At the moment there is an imbalance - If you are born into the wrong environment you will struggle to get out of it - And by the way, people on benefits are not automatically "scroungers" or "scum".


So what's your solution?

Spoon

Pete, from my perspective and rather than spending time on going round in circles, I firmly believe with views like yours this country is kidding itself.