which is best? panel filters.
05 November 2008 | 11:04 PM
#31
Not a panel filter but I ran a K&N cone filter (the shape is the only difference) on a MY99 maf based 2.5L with a rotated GT30R @ 450bhp+ never once had any problems and never had to change the MAF.
I'd get either a K&N panel filter or a Greens Cotton one. Both will do the job extremely well.
I'd get either a K&N panel filter or a Greens Cotton one. Both will do the job extremely well.
06 November 2008 | 08:53 AM
#32
Can we just clear up something about oiled panel filters. K+N is an oiled panel filter and I am yet to come across any car with any problem from a K+N supplied filter.
When the filter is cleaned and re-oiled, you will not have any problem if you follow the instructions but if you are a numpty and soak the filter in oil then you deserve whatever happens, unless of course you cannot read.
K+N lightly oiled panel filters pass a lot of air as I have found and as Shaun has proven above and the light oiling (sensible light oiling) means the panel fitler has great filtration properties but there is not so much oil there that it has any effect whatsoever on the MAF.
When the filter is cleaned and re-oiled, you will not have any problem if you follow the instructions but if you are a numpty and soak the filter in oil then you deserve whatever happens, unless of course you cannot read.
K+N lightly oiled panel filters pass a lot of air as I have found and as Shaun has proven above and the light oiling (sensible light oiling) means the panel fitler has great filtration properties but there is not so much oil there that it has any effect whatsoever on the MAF.
Doesnt mean it isnt so, one friend of mine had a K&N panel filter in his P1 and went through at least 5 MAF sensors, he then changed it to a Simota and has never had a problem since.
Jason
06 November 2008 | 10:40 AM
#33
Scooby Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 481
Likes: 30
From: Oxfordshire
There's some good filter test results available on the web. One of the best is here
ISO 5011 Duramax Air Filter Test Report
When folks ask for the best filter it depends on where your priorities lie. Generally the filters with high air flow filter less well so engines wear quicker. The amount of extra power a free flow filter gives is also affected by the rest of the inlet tract. Sometimes the difference is negligable.
FWIW I stay with the OE filter but mine is a road car and I want it to last for many more years cos I like it. An extra 10 bhp is unnoticable. I can get that performance back by leaving my wife at home but don't tell her that.
John
ISO 5011 Duramax Air Filter Test Report
When folks ask for the best filter it depends on where your priorities lie. Generally the filters with high air flow filter less well so engines wear quicker. The amount of extra power a free flow filter gives is also affected by the rest of the inlet tract. Sometimes the difference is negligable.
FWIW I stay with the OE filter but mine is a road car and I want it to last for many more years cos I like it. An extra 10 bhp is unnoticable. I can get that performance back by leaving my wife at home but don't tell her that.
John
06 November 2008 | 11:41 AM
#34
I had a spread of 1.7 bhp across four pannel filters on an STi 3 Wagon running 335 bhp.
As the results were not what we expected we repeated the experiment the next day and got exactly the same results.
After much debate and arguement on here with some "experts" talking tosh, Mike Wood from Prodrive came on and said my findings were in line with what they had found.
The four filters I tested were O/E, K+N, STi and HKS Green Sponge.
I think the reason Shaun has found a bigger gap is simply that his air flow is far closer to the limitting ability of the filters in question.
As the results were not what we expected we repeated the experiment the next day and got exactly the same results.
After much debate and arguement on here with some "experts" talking tosh, Mike Wood from Prodrive came on and said my findings were in line with what they had found.
The four filters I tested were O/E, K+N, STi and HKS Green Sponge.
I think the reason Shaun has found a bigger gap is simply that his air flow is far closer to the limitting ability of the filters in question.
Was the Sti element any better than the OE item?
06 November 2008 | 01:51 PM
#35
Jason : Your anecdotal information proves nothing and is not in line with most users experience.
How do you know the problem was not vibration (for instance)
The car produced "least power" with the disposable STi filter but it was probably the best/finest filter element and could trap the smallest particles.
Remeber the spread was only 1.7 bhp so it was not of any great consequence.
How do you know the problem was not vibration (for instance)
The car produced "least power" with the disposable STi filter but it was probably the best/finest filter element and could trap the smallest particles.
Remeber the spread was only 1.7 bhp so it was not of any great consequence.
06 November 2008 | 06:25 PM
#37
Scooby Regular
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
There's some good filter test results available on the web. One of the best is here
ISO 5011 Duramax Air Filter Test Report
John
ISO 5011 Duramax Air Filter Test Report
John
Re: NO K&N NEVER on a 944 NEVER - The Porsche 944, 924, and 968 Forum
I worked for race teams for years. One Toyota Atlantic teem I worked on the driver thought the car was lossing power from the start of a race to the end. So we did leak down checks when we got new engines in. 3% leak down- New. At the end of a race we checked it again and we got 29% leak down. So we sent the head to get the valves done and checked the leak down when the head returned. 4%- Leak down. At the end of the next race 31%- leak down. So we put three dabs of grease down streem of the air filter. "K&N" The next engine came in with 3%-leak down new. And at the end of the race 32%- leak down and the dabs of greas were full of grit. So we changed the filter to a oiled fome filter. 3%- leak down new and at the end of the next race? 18%-leak down. Better still not good. So we made a new air box and used a Mustang GT stock air filter. 3%-leak down new at the end of the next race? 1%- leak down yes I said "1%". The rings bed in and the engine seals up. We went from changing a engine at 300 miles with 29 to 34% leak down to. Changing the engine at 800 miles with 7% leak down.
So the bottom line is. You mite gain a littel more power (1 to 2hp) but it will not last long and befor you know it you will have a LOT less.
I work on 944s only and when I tare down a 944 engine that has had a K&N filter the cyclenders have a LOT of scores from dirt that got through the filter.
If you dont beleve me do the grease test your self. Take out the filter and put a dab of grease in the air box. Then put your K&N filter in and dive the car for a few weeks and pull the filter out and check the dab of grease.
Good Luck Mike F
So the bottom line is. You mite gain a littel more power (1 to 2hp) but it will not last long and befor you know it you will have a LOT less.
I work on 944s only and when I tare down a 944 engine that has had a K&N filter the cyclenders have a LOT of scores from dirt that got through the filter.
If you dont beleve me do the grease test your self. Take out the filter and put a dab of grease in the air box. Then put your K&N filter in and dive the car for a few weeks and pull the filter out and check the dab of grease.
Good Luck Mike F
06 November 2008 | 09:47 PM
#39
Can we just clear up something about oiled panel filters. K+N is an oiled panel filter and I am yet to come across any car with any problem from a K+N supplied filter.
When the filter is cleaned and re-oiled, you will not have any problem if you follow the instructions but if you are a numpty and soak the filter in oil then you deserve whatever happens, unless of course you cannot read.
K+N lightly oiled panel filters pass a lot of air as I have found and as Shaun has proven above and the light oiling (sensible light oiling) means the panel fitler has great filtration properties but there is not so much oil there that it has any effect whatsoever on the MAF.
When the filter is cleaned and re-oiled, you will not have any problem if you follow the instructions but if you are a numpty and soak the filter in oil then you deserve whatever happens, unless of course you cannot read.
K+N lightly oiled panel filters pass a lot of air as I have found and as Shaun has proven above and the light oiling (sensible light oiling) means the panel fitler has great filtration properties but there is not so much oil there that it has any effect whatsoever on the MAF.
Stuck with the Green filter purely for the sound, nice slightly louder than standard and reuseable.You'll find it impossible to notice ANY difference in power between any panel filters.Even if it was as much as 7-8 bhp you'll never notice it - all placebo methinks!
06 November 2008 | 09:55 PM
#40
Scooby Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 481
Likes: 30
From: Oxfordshire
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