Swine Flu - the non-facts
16 July 2009, 10:16 PM
#32
ohhh come on.. we are world on medication for goodness sake. Its one of the worlds biggest cons, the answer to everything, pills pills pills. Diagnose everything as a disease or illness and then throw some addictive smarties at them, meanwhile the pharma companies are raking it in. like i said, natural immunity. No wonder virus and bacteriums spread and adapt. They get more virulent cos we are providing the chemicals to them in the form of so called 'medicines' constantly. Ok if some people need them due to a defect in their immunity then so be it but to scare monger like has been happening over a 'flu bug' is beyond. Was anyone following all this right at the beginning. How and where it developed. It wasnt just in mexico. The exact same strain was found in mulitple parts of the world at exactly the same time. That is biologically impossible as when each person contracts it it genically changes. It would of have to have been spread in order for exactly the same strain to exist accross the other side of the world. Btw the big investors in this are our leaders as they all have shares in it. Im not mentioning anymore now cos you guys really have no clue. Do your own research like i have! Switch on the news now and laugh at the fear they try to instil. lol Its comic for goodness sake
16 July 2009, 10:40 PM
#35
Won't work, short of a biohazard suit the virus is small enough to pass through.
The government is already trying to promote this. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink as they say.
16 July 2009, 11:09 PM
#38
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"Your a fool". Grrr. C'mon, it's you're. You. Are. You're. I'll be more interested in what you say if i think you had an education!! 
But onwards. My partner is closely connected to this whole scenario, so in one respect i'm not giving you all the facts, which is perhaps a bit unfair. But what i think you're displaying is angsty devil's advocate stuff rather than anything founded on real knowledge and insight, and ok, everybody is entitled to their opinion. Yes it's "just" flu, but if you've never had it, that's all so easy to say. It's a killer. It's bloody horrible. Yes it's part of the "natural cycle" of things but then you could argue that about measles, mumps, TB, polio etc etc, and i'm pretty sure you're not advocating suspending vaccines for those. Let people make up their own minds, and don't think you know more than those who do go on to take the vaccine. You simply don't.
But onwards. My partner is closely connected to this whole scenario, so in one respect i'm not giving you all the facts, which is perhaps a bit unfair. But what i think you're displaying is angsty devil's advocate stuff rather than anything founded on real knowledge and insight, and ok, everybody is entitled to their opinion. Yes it's "just" flu, but if you've never had it, that's all so easy to say. It's a killer. It's bloody horrible. Yes it's part of the "natural cycle" of things but then you could argue that about measles, mumps, TB, polio etc etc, and i'm pretty sure you're not advocating suspending vaccines for those. Let people make up their own minds, and don't think you know more than those who do go on to take the vaccine. You simply don't.
16 July 2009, 11:34 PM
#39
Is there a more readily available alternative anti viral drug you know of?
The Gov can't be right all the time, but its good to know they are some of the time!
17 July 2009, 12:21 AM
#40
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"Your a fool". Grrr. C'mon, it's you're. You. Are. You're. I'll be more interested in what you say if i think you had an education!!
But onwards. My partner is closely connected to this whole scenario, so in one respect i'm not giving you all the facts, which is perhaps a bit unfair. But what i think you're displaying is angsty devil's advocate stuff rather than anything founded on real knowledge and insight, and ok, everybody is entitled to their opinion. Yes it's "just" flu, but if you've never had it, that's all so easy to say. It's a killer. It's bloody horrible. Yes it's part of the "natural cycle" of things but then you could argue that about measles, mumps, TB, polio etc etc, and i'm pretty sure you're not advocating suspending vaccines for those. Let people make up their own minds, and don't think you know more than those who do go on to take the vaccine. You simply don't.
But onwards. My partner is closely connected to this whole scenario, so in one respect i'm not giving you all the facts, which is perhaps a bit unfair. But what i think you're displaying is angsty devil's advocate stuff rather than anything founded on real knowledge and insight, and ok, everybody is entitled to their opinion. Yes it's "just" flu, but if you've never had it, that's all so easy to say. It's a killer. It's bloody horrible. Yes it's part of the "natural cycle" of things but then you could argue that about measles, mumps, TB, polio etc etc, and i'm pretty sure you're not advocating suspending vaccines for those. Let people make up their own minds, and don't think you know more than those who do go on to take the vaccine. You simply don't.
Telboy, it's 'I', not 'i'.As in I'm, not i'm.
Sorry.
17 July 2009, 12:33 AM
#43
Not being funny SC, but it's fine for you to say people you know that have had swine flu have gotten over it, or you have survived a nasty flu, but everyone has a different level of resistance or ability to fight off things, and help can be needed for some. If they are happy to take a chance with a vaccine or even Tamiflu, it is up to them, the same as it is up to you to not bother. I don't think it's fair to make people feel stupid for worrying about the risks of any flu, never mind one that seems to be taking hold (unlike bird flu).
17 July 2009, 01:02 AM
#45
We're all entitled to an opinion.
I'm no expert, but the way I see it, is the government are trying to act on a situation we are actually feeling (not a possibility), and we'd all be quick to complain if nothing was being done.
I'm all for slating the government at times, but I think the fact we are seeing something hitting people, that isn't the norm, they are sort of damned if they do, damned if they don't so to speak.
The media (at times) don't help, I agree. They give partial facts, and hype things up, causing more panic than necessary.
That said, the only thing that really gets to me, is that seemingly doctors can now diagnose swine flu over the phone. I'm all for treating people etc. but how (unless there are different symptoms), can you diagnose someone with an illness, and give out drugs without actually knowing for sure what is wrong?
17 July 2009, 01:41 AM
#46
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Well attempting to scare the living **** out of the easily lead in the UK seems a pretty good way for the Government to ensure the Tamiflu gets taken.
My wife didn't bother sending me out to get her tamiflu after me and the kids got over it without tamiflu although we all still have a lingering cough and severe tiredness/aches and pains even after over 2 weeks from getting it.
It's scary to think of those that die from it that have no underlying health problems, a 6 year old boy in Kent being the latest. However plenty of people die from seasonal flu and everyone reacts differently to illnesses. Out of me, the wife and our 2 kids my 4 year old son had it the worst and I had it the least severe as I was the only one not to have a raging fever but had everything else the wife and kids had. Our 2 kids had a temp of 103 for 4 days solid with no break even being continually topped up with calpol and neurofen, it just didn't reduce it like it normally would. Had it gone over 103 or gone on for any longer then I would have been a lot more worried.
I was speaking with a neighbour the other night and he couldn't believe the hysteria being caused, he said some women where he works were getting hysterical over it because they believed the media hype and the Government is certainly not helping matters. He was the same us and if him and his wife get it will just stay at home and treat it like any other flu or severe cold/cough. I think there a lot of people not bothering with calling their doctor and acting on all the hype.
My wife didn't bother sending me out to get her tamiflu after me and the kids got over it without tamiflu although we all still have a lingering cough and severe tiredness/aches and pains even after over 2 weeks from getting it.
It's scary to think of those that die from it that have no underlying health problems, a 6 year old boy in Kent being the latest. However plenty of people die from seasonal flu and everyone reacts differently to illnesses. Out of me, the wife and our 2 kids my 4 year old son had it the worst and I had it the least severe as I was the only one not to have a raging fever but had everything else the wife and kids had. Our 2 kids had a temp of 103 for 4 days solid with no break even being continually topped up with calpol and neurofen, it just didn't reduce it like it normally would. Had it gone over 103 or gone on for any longer then I would have been a lot more worried.
I was speaking with a neighbour the other night and he couldn't believe the hysteria being caused, he said some women where he works were getting hysterical over it because they believed the media hype and the Government is certainly not helping matters. He was the same us and if him and his wife get it will just stay at home and treat it like any other flu or severe cold/cough. I think there a lot of people not bothering with calling their doctor and acting on all the hype.
17 July 2009, 09:18 AM
#47
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I'm not insulting you, Mr Doo, i'm just pointing out that all you have is a "man on the street" opinion, nothing more, and you know i'm right. And let's not even address the various exaggerations in your post, eh? And then in your last sentence you say "enjoy your Tamiflu". Are you clear in your own mind the difference between Tamiflu and the upcoming vaccine? I'm guessing not. But you're the educated one, right? 
17 July 2009, 10:58 AM
#48
Oh dear, it seems even the great and the good 
can get it. No one is safeCherie Blair's suspected swine flu. What a shame if she passed it to her despicable husband too.
As always, the Daily Mash is on the money. Daily Mash
can get it. No one is safeCherie Blair's suspected swine flu. What a shame if she passed it to her despicable husband too.As always, the Daily Mash is on the money.
Daily Mash
17 July 2009, 11:08 AM
#49
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Go ahead and try and find those two grammatical errors, especially anything that basic
So The Times publishes evidence that the health checks have been rushed through. Since you're a doctor (of sorts, naturally), you'll know that rushed through does NOT mean they have not been done thoroughly. Vaccines by their very nature (again, sorry if i'm preaching to the informed) are dirty drugs, there is no such thing as a 100% side-effect proof vaccine. But what the government WON'T do is release the vaccine until they're as sure as they can be that the potential problems have been minimised. But of course you'd know that.
So The Times publishes evidence that the health checks have been rushed through. Since you're a doctor (of sorts, naturally), you'll know that rushed through does NOT mean they have not been done thoroughly. Vaccines by their very nature (again, sorry if i'm preaching to the informed) are dirty drugs, there is no such thing as a 100% side-effect proof vaccine. But what the government WON'T do is release the vaccine until they're as sure as they can be that the potential problems have been minimised. But of course you'd know that.
17 July 2009, 11:15 AM
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Oooh excellent, a detail conversation
It's a good question. I don't think it's ever been officially decided in modern computer communication with smileys whether a smiley consitutes a full stop or not. I think a smiley after a full stop, if it's part of that sentence, looks wrong. Hence my lack of full stop at the end of the first sentence, but my inclusion of one at the end of the text, because the succeeding smiley relates to the paragraph as a whole, not just the last sentence.
Let me know when you're sorry you asked
It's a good question. I don't think it's ever been officially decided in modern computer communication with smileys whether a smiley consitutes a full stop or not. I think a smiley after a full stop, if it's part of that sentence, looks wrong. Hence my lack of full stop at the end of the first sentence, but my inclusion of one at the end of the text, because the succeeding smiley relates to the paragraph as a whole, not just the last sentence.
Let me know when you're sorry you asked
17 July 2009, 11:15 AM
#51
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Right or wrong I'm glad we live out in the sticks in Cornwall at the moment. It's the fact that healthy people are dying that worries me - surely "normal" flu only kills the weak usually?
17 July 2009, 11:19 AM
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Swine flu is also intruiging in that the older you are, the less likely you are to get it. There's got to be something in that for the lab rats to investigate and exploit, surely?
17 July 2009, 11:29 AM
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Oooh excellent, a detail conversation
It's a good question. I don't think it's ever been officially decided in modern computer communication with smileys whether a smiley consitutes a full stop or not. I think a smiley after a full stop, if it's part of that sentence, looks wrong. Hence my lack of full stop at the end of the first sentence, but my inclusion of one at the end of the text, because the succeeding smiley relates to the paragraph as a whole, not just the last sentence.
Let me know when you're sorry you asked
It's a good question. I don't think it's ever been officially decided in modern computer communication with smileys whether a smiley consitutes a full stop or not. I think a smiley after a full stop, if it's part of that sentence, looks wrong. Hence my lack of full stop at the end of the first sentence, but my inclusion of one at the end of the text, because the succeeding smiley relates to the paragraph as a whole, not just the last sentence.
Let me know when you're sorry you asked
17 July 2009, 11:41 AM
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In my lifetime I have contracted flu just 3 times; during the 'Hong Kong Flu' pandemic; during the 1968-1970 pandemic and once again in 1990. So in all likelihood many young people have never contracted any form of flu and so are likely to more affected than older people who have.
17 July 2009, 11:53 AM
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I hope that's true, Charles, i'd hate to have it again. Apparently the Doomsday scenario is for this flu strain (lots of people getting it, not that deadly) to mix with the bird flu strain (not many people getting it, highly lethal in those who do). We shall see.
17 July 2009, 12:02 PM
#57
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Who was it that said that the greatest threat to Mankind in the 20th century was the virus? Same story for the 21st century it would appear!
Personally, I'm shi*ting it.....predominantly because I've just booked a holiday and sods law dictates......
Personally, I'm shi*ting it.....predominantly because I've just booked a holiday and sods law dictates......
17 July 2009, 12:07 PM
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Yes the theory is people over 60 are less likely to get it because they are likely to have been exposed to previous flu outbreaks and therefore built up a level of resistance. How accurate/true this theory is another matter. I certainly wouldn't want my parents to have got what we had and they weren't allowed to come over and see us for 2 weeks to try and reduce any chance they might catch it off us.
17 July 2009, 12:11 PM
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[QUOTE=Spooky Mulder;8824291
Something does not add up here.
The reality is that at the end of last week the number of confirmed cases was around 10,000 with the number of deaths at 16.
This is a death rate, at worst of 0.0016%. And that is based on confirmed cases. There are probably two to five times the number of real cases, although the death rate may also be understated.
[/QUOTE]
Hmm yes, your sums don't...
16/10000=0.0016, or 0.16%
Something does not add up here.
The reality is that at the end of last week the number of confirmed cases was around 10,000 with the number of deaths at 16.
This is a death rate, at worst of 0.0016%. And that is based on confirmed cases. There are probably two to five times the number of real cases, although the death rate may also be understated.
[/QUOTE]
Hmm yes, your sums don't...
16/10000=0.0016, or 0.16%
17 July 2009, 12:37 PM
#60
The number of deaths in the UK is now at 29. With swine flu, having a strong immune system can go against you. Its called a cytokine storm where your immune system over reacts to the infection leading to death. This is perhaps why we are starting hear of healthy people dying from the virus. It's believed this is what happened in the 1918 pandemic.