mamoon2

I sell Toys for a living and pride myself on supplying 90% UK / Europe / USA made products. The goal for our business is to sell quality products and not try and compete with the Chinese tat available. Everything on our website is quality made and comes with guarantees to back it up.

I toyed (excuse the pun) with the idea of importing chinese products but when the samples came they were shockingly bad.
An example of this is a kids "Ride On Hummer" electric car.... we got the sample over and tested it against one of our other electric cars.... a fully licensed Ferrari F430 European made electric car. The "Hummer" lasted 12 minutes before the battery went dead, the Ferrari lasted 2 hours before my son (chief tester) got bored. The "Hummer" never charged properly again and pieces fell off whenever we tried to get it going.

Lesson learned? Only sell quality stuff! You get what you pay for!

And if anyone wants a high quality licensed ride on car for their child, pm me

cookstar

iTrader: (6)

The full quote "Sometimes we get major orders in and we have to work double quick. I get paid a few rupees for finishing each garment, but in a good day I can make 40 rupees."

Sometimes isn't every day, I have been there a few times mate, spoken to many people and the kids are paid shockingly low amounts of money for a proper days graft.

jonc

You'd better throw away your computer, as I guarentee you'll have parts in it that are manufactured in China! My IBM laptop is made in China, used every day and has been faultless in the 3 odd years of ownership. The reputation of the brand name is more important to me that whether the product is made in a certain country whether it is made in China or not.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

As pointed out earlier in th thread both office PCs developed faults within 6 months of ownership.... made in China

Deep Singh

Everybody goes on about the pollution created by China, India etc. You do realise that PER CAPITA India for example produces less than a 10th of what the UK does?

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

Regardless of who's ***** is bigger ( ), it's still an obscenely low amount, but I still buy t-shirts/jeans etc from these sources as I can't just go out and spend more on the fair trade gear.

Trout

iTrader: (1)

In India you could probably buy four or five for that money

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

But once you factor in the costs of flights and accomodation, £4 from Primark doesn't seem that bad.

Theres a reason (besides being tight) that I'm wearing £4 t-shirts from Primark, and the reason is the same I can't afford a holiday to India

jonc

Yes, but what about the PC you're using now? If you buy a PC components made at a low cost, what do you expect. If it's not a low cost then I would say that that is more to do with the quality control checking (or lack of) of the brand selling the product rather that solely the fault of China. Electrical products contains parts from many countries, how can you be sure that the failed part was specfically from China?

Like I said, I currently have a few Made in China IBM laptops and an unbranded desktop and none of them have had problems. Also I use many recognised brands like IBM, Sony, AEG, Panasonic, Marantz, JVC etc and countless kids toys that are made in China or contain components from China and have not developed faults.

If you buy a box of eggs and find one rotten, do you take it back to the place you bought them from or do you take it back to the hen?

The Zohan

Good, glad they did and paid for their own bullets - spot on!

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Ah, so (pardon the pun ) if I say something I have works well and is made in the UK I get told it probably has parts in it from China whereas when I tell you I have something that clearly states 'made in China' that doesn't work so well I get told it has parts in it not from China. You sure you aren't part of the People's Republic (sic) spin machine?

Look all I know is since things started turning up saying 'Made in China' I have had more of them malfunction than ever before. It doesn't take a geniius to work out where the problem probably lies for the most part.

jonc

No I'm not from China, but I am Chinese but that doesn't mean I agree with the way China runs things either. If you buy more and more products from China, it stands to reason that you will have a greater chance of experiencing more issues with product that are Made in China!

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Look it is fairly simple to understand what I am saying and that is that in my experience I am more likely to experience a problem with a product that is made in China than with a product made elsewhere. Nothing to do with how many I buy.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

I'm on the fence with China:

On one part we endure the never ended amounts of rubbish they make: the cheap junk, copies, knock-offs, as well as poor quality low-end branded stuff.

But on the other hand most big names now manufacture in China; My old canon camera was made in Japan, as was my (30yr) old Sony Hi-Fi and my Pioneer car radio, and the coaxial speakers, same with the Sharp microwave. Now all their modern counterparts made by the same companies are now made in China.

Are they worse? Hmmm, hard to say.

I do believe the electronic insustry as a whole is less honest to consumers than it once was (be it product quality, spec or longevity). I'm not sure if China is the cause, or greedy capitalists that pushed manufacturing there.

For example, low-end brands (or even high end brands) at a consumer level, it seems manufacturers pretty much lie abour their product's spec: Take a modern Mini/Mini Hi-Fi rated at 100watt per channel RMS. Seems good eh? Nope as its not measured to what was once considerd the "accepted" methods. In reality its 20watts...if your lucky. Just looking inside at the PSU of any audio amplifier, be ita 5.1 or 2 channel quickly shows its real power capabilities; Big amps need big power supplies, with big caps and big transformers. Then we have "Full HD 1080p" branded LCD Tvs that are based on 720line panels (cough LG cough ), and mobile phones with 200 hours standby battery life that barely manages 80 hours.

Computer parts are even worse; take a "Silent" Power supply. I've had some that sound like hairdryers. Some with a "Fan control system", which runs the fan at full speed, and upon internal inspection it just wired to the 12v power rail, the only "control" is that it turns off when you turn off the computer. And ones rated at 500watts that would struggle on 300watt loads. Asus motherboards with 3yr warrantee not worth its salt. I better not start on about firmware and obvious lack of product testing before release (thats pretty much all computer part manufacturers though), and not to mention motherboards that will accept up to 4gig of RAM, but neglect to inform that it cannot address anything above 3.2gig due to the chipset not supporting address remapping

Incidentally, I noted that my Gigabyte motherboard has a "50,000 hour Japanese capacitor". What? So does that mean all the other caps are shyte? Actually thats a moot point; Failed/out of tolerance caps is a common problem in alot of electrical goods - so maybe thats an admission that Chinese made capacitors are rubbish?

I know some are: Judging by my dead Sky digiboxes - which are made in the EU, unfortunately the Samsung PSUs used inside both boxes and the caps themselves are Chinese, and guess what parts failed.

Anyway what is the root cause of shoddy/underperforming electrical goods: Is China the influence or is it Greedy capitalism? That can go in circles forever; seeing it was capitalism that pushed major manufacturing to China in the first place.

jonc

Well my advice is don't buy products made in China then and spend your money on more expensive equivalent! Easier said than done you might say when most electrical products have components made in China. Well what do you expect with the demand for cheaper and cheaper products. That is a consumer driven ethos and not the fault of a country. Like I said before, its down to quality control and brand not where the product is made. I spent premium on an IBM laptop that whilst is made in China has given me years of trouble free operation. You get what you pay for and that is true regardless of where it is made.

MikeCardiff

iTrader: (2)

With electronic components, there are different qualities you can buy - there isn't just one resistor or capacitor to do a certain job, there are different tolerances, exepected lifespans etc... ( If you have a quick look through an RS or Maplins catalogue you will see this - lots of little things that look exactly the same, but all cost different prices )

For example, a simple filter circuit in a stereo may be designed by the engineer to have a certain cut-off frequency, using a resistor with a +/- 5% tolerance means the actual cut off could be quite a lot different, whereas paying a bit more more and using a +/- 1% tolerance resistor would be a lot closer to the desired figure.

Capacitors take a hammering, which is why they are often the first thing to fail in a product, a circuit built with high spec capacitors will almost certainly last longer than one with the cheapest crappy ones.

This is one of the main differences with cheap electronics goods, all the components are the cheapest, lowest spec they can get away with and still have the item work when you turn it on. It wont work as well as one built up to a specification rather than built down to a price, but will still work for a while to some degree.

The difference in price between the cheapest and best component may only be a couple of pence, but when multiplied by the amount of components in a unit, this can add up to a few quid, and once that gets multiplied through the maker, distributor, wholesaler and retailer, can end up being quite significant ( particularly when better power supplies and larger capacitors are used, which can cost a lot more for better quality ones ).

Unfortunately consumers would often rather pay for a cheaper item, then replace it after 2 to 3 years when it fails, whereas if they all went for better quality items, the manufacturers could afford to make them all as well as possible rather than scrimping, and they would work better and last longer.

When you add in the cheap labour costs to this, you can see why two electrical items that on the face of it do the same job are often very different in quality.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Whenever possible I do try to ensure what I buy is not made in China and yes the equivalent can be more expensive, but that is becuase it is put together properly and works!!

Sorry, but it is the fault of the manufacturers in China if their goods are not up to scratch, nothing to do with consumers. The demand might be due to consumers, but the quaity of manufacture comes right down to the manufacturers. That is before we even get into the discussion about how they dont deliver the quality they say they will.

As for your wonderful laptop maybe in it was just assembled in China and the composite parts come from other places

jonc

Maybe its a counterfeit product made Switzerland!

Trout

iTrader: (1)

A man after my own heart - I have built up a nice pile of Naim boxes with careful trading on ebay.

Fabulous kit - nothing like it at home or abroad. The best hi-fi in the world.

StickyMicky

My chinese PSU recently had a capacitor blow up, i could not work out where the cap head came from at the time so foolishly bought another motherboard thinking it was a motherboard fault, the motherboard had actually started smoking, so it was an easy mistake to make.

total damage so far

1 Asrock motherboard
1 Asus motherboard
1 Microsoft keyboard
1 wired Microsoft X360 control pad that was plugged in at the time


it was only when i fitted the new Asus motherboard, and it would not switch on for more then 1 second, that i started looking at other things, upon opening the PSU i found and exploded capacitor, and then swore quite loudly

dpb

Xing Xong !

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Good man. It sure is top quality kit with a gorgeous sound. Utterly reliable too.

Dr Nick

If this country (or the rest of the EU for that matter) was serious about reducing emissions, they would not allow so many imports from a country that builds a new coal fired power plant every two weeks.

Instead they go on about reducing carbon footprint and fool us they are making an effort all the while allowing outsourcing Europe's dirty manufacturing to China. Human rights takes a back seat too and folks waving Tibetan flags when top Chinese politicos visited the UK were jumped on by British Police so as not to make them feel "uncomfortable". And don't get me started on my views on a country that blockes the BBC news website...... etc etc rant rant....

But we are the fools that buy it and, as has been confirmed above by many, it is now impossible to buy some things we want without a made in China label.

Aaaarg!

... I'll get my coat ..... (made in .....)

Trout

iTrader: (1)

Well not quite - the transport went in my CD player and cost more to repair than the average HiFi system never mind CD player!!!!!

r32

I'm not meaning trainers and tee shirts but more of the Fortune 500 type of companies. I worked for one multi national 500 company before I retired and they always (supposedly) take an ethical stance on who to deal with and how to deal etc etc. no alchohol allowed on any premises etc etc Yet they bought out one large Chinese company and have invested millions in the place. Its sad as they have a terrible human rights record and really should be treated with disdain. But if one competitor goes there they are frightened about 'losing out' and feel the need to jump in.

richardg

i won't comment on your opinions re rights etc, but in my experience there is a significant level of respect building for the environment. this comes mainly from students who have no experience of economics and so their intentions to move into jobs where they can reduce pollution etc may well be watered down over the coming years when they realise the economic restrictions they may face in business, but at present their intentions are good.

in chongqing you will never see a blue sky. occasionaly, it may be light grey and sometimes you even see sunlight coming through the smog, but it is definately smoggy. locals will tell you it's foggy, but those of us who have seen a blue sky know the difference.

i have heard so many stories about manufacturing in china. for instance, a chip manufacturer who spent millions on a new building with clean air systems etc etc and then appointed local staff. on a random visit when the factory was up and running, the story goes that the visitors were shocked to see the a/c switched off and the doors open and when asking the senior management at the plant why this was the case, the reply was "we're chinese. we can handle a bit of heat, so we've saved you some money on running the a/c"......

some of things i have bought there are utterly useless (but the same can be said of some of the things i have bought from north weald market over the years!). on the other hand, some of the other things i have bought have been great. depends on your expectations for the prices you;re paying. the old saying that you get what you pay for is very true IMHO, but it's often difficult to know where things have come from when you;re paying UK prices for something the suppliers/wholesalers paid peanuts for in the first place