Immigrant can stay because he has a pet cat!
19 October 2009, 12:42 PM
#31
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Disco, Disco!
Posts: 21,825
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
exactly how many of the non English speaking and uneducated immigrants and illegals fill these rolls then, they aren't all doctors, dentists, or accountants flying in to the UK. we desperately need lots of unskilled workers to fill that wide void in the workforce, remind me how many unemployed we now have?
It is admitted by this gov't some 3 years ago that we have some 750,000 illegals in this country, the real number likely to be much higher as i do doubt they all responded to the gov't poll
Yes, illegals to take jobs, how else can they support themsleves, do tell???
No they or their employers do not pay taxes or NI - how can this be fair against businesses that do not do this
Yes, the illegals and their employers are breaking the laws of this country.
Get the long-term and habitually lazy long tern unemployed of this country back into work, make it so they have to work or do not receive benefits.
Then fill any gaps from outside the UK.
Last edited by The Zohan; 19 October 2009 at 12:48 PM.
19 October 2009, 12:46 PM
#33
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was not born in the 50's so i cant relate to what you are saying.
I think the population has doubled since then and times have changed greatly. This is a unique situation we are in now and one that does not seem to be getting any better.
And once again i have already said that 'stealing' may have been the wrong word to have used. Taking is more apt i think.
I think the population has doubled since then and times have changed greatly. This is a unique situation we are in now and one that does not seem to be getting any better.
And once again i have already said that 'stealing' may have been the wrong word to have used. Taking is more apt i think.
Last edited by Klaatu; 19 October 2009 at 12:53 PM.
19 October 2009, 12:49 PM
#34
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
19 October 2009, 12:53 PM
#35
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
please point out where the UK has a shortfall in skilled workers in 2009, Harping back to the past is merely clouding and a smoke screen.
exactly how many of the non English speaking and uneducated immigrants and illegals fill these rolls then, they aren't all doctors, dentists, or accountants flying in to the UK. we desperately need lots of unskilled workers to fill that wide void in the workforce, remind me how many unemployed we now have?
It is admitted by this gov't some 3 years ago that we have some 750,000 illegals in this country, the real number likely to be much higher as i do doubt they all responded to the gov't poll
Yes, illegals to take jobs, how else can they support themsleves, do tell???
No they or their employers do not pay taxes or NI - how can this be fair against businesses that do not do this
Yes, the illegals and their employers are breaking the laws of this country.
Get the long-term and habitually lazy long tern unemployed of this country back into work, make it so they have to work or do not receive benefits.
Then fill any gaps from outside the UK.
exactly how many of the non English speaking and uneducated immigrants and illegals fill these rolls then, they aren't all doctors, dentists, or accountants flying in to the UK. we desperately need lots of unskilled workers to fill that wide void in the workforce, remind me how many unemployed we now have?
It is admitted by this gov't some 3 years ago that we have some 750,000 illegals in this country, the real number likely to be much higher as i do doubt they all responded to the gov't poll
Yes, illegals to take jobs, how else can they support themsleves, do tell???
No they or their employers do not pay taxes or NI - how can this be fair against businesses that do not do this
Yes, the illegals and their employers are breaking the laws of this country.
Get the long-term and habitually lazy long tern unemployed of this country back into work, make it so they have to work or do not receive benefits.
Then fill any gaps from outside the UK.
Illegals take jobs, only if *employers* employ them. Of course there is a "benefit" both ways. Stop that, you stop the "problem".
Don't worry Paul, the UK, what mfg the UK has, will be soon obliterated by Brown and Copenhagen.
19 October 2009, 12:54 PM
#36
It's not unique, and I did not say you were born in the 50's, *BUT* what LT did in the 50's was because no-one "English" would raide the conductors platform, or drive busses, it was "beneath" them. It set the "standard", and it permiates around the world, the US, Aus and NZ. We sew what we reap. BUT businesses and Gommint are in the loop...follow the money!
My guess is that no one wanted to be a bus driver in the 50's as they had other options. Maybe i am wrong but i dont see the relevance to what is happening today.
We have too many people in this country and too few jobs, a situalion that isnt helped by ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS working when they have no right to do so.
19 October 2009, 01:10 PM
#38
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Attitudes have changed, but 5 million unemployed, really? Crickey, well they do contribute, don't they, they pay their VAT etc. /Sarc off
It will get worse, Copenhagen. Only you can stop it.
Last edited by Klaatu; 19 October 2009 at 01:13 PM.
19 October 2009, 01:12 PM
#39
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I know you didn't say i was born in the 50's but i was letting you know that i wasn't, and thus explaining that i am not ofay with what you were talking about.
My guess is that no one wanted to be a bus driver in the 50's as they had other options. Maybe i am wrong but i dont see the relevance to what is happening today.
We have too many people in this country and too few jobs, a situalion that isnt helped by ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS working when they have no right to do so.
My guess is that no one wanted to be a bus driver in the 50's as they had other options. Maybe i am wrong but i dont see the relevance to what is happening today.
We have too many people in this country and too few jobs, a situalion that isnt helped by ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS working when they have no right to do so.
19 October 2009, 01:21 PM
#41
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,911
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I respect that, seriously. BUT, you have only yourself to blame for the situation. No vote, no responsibility, no action. You want stuff to change there are two options available, vote or violence. I am, begining, to feel that our "leaders" need to feel "violence". Like the poll tax riots of the 90's. Sadly, since then, our "rights" have been severely erroded since then.
19 October 2009, 01:26 PM
#42
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Romford
Posts: 724
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
dear oh dear people........ take a page from the police handbook...... cull the population by shooting anyone running for a train .... then declare them a terrorist.... AND THEN.... listen to the coroner tell the jury they cant find it an unlawfull killing
( that should light a few fires lol)
( that should light a few fires lol)
19 October 2009, 01:27 PM
#43
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 25,080
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A few questions about the chap in question, I don't think they are answered in the article:
1) Did he originally legally enter the UK? Was it as a visitor or worker?
2) If he entered legally, then why did he not extend his work permit, if indeed he had one?
3) If he was here legally, and if he has been here and lived with his parter (I assume they are a resident or citizen of the UK) for more than two years, and seemingly the article states this is so, then why did he not apply for 'indefitinte leave to remain (what I would call permanent residence - Canadian Immigration term) via the SET(M) application. This allows you to stay if you are a spouse or civil parter of a person present and settled in the UK, or unmarried or same sex partner of a person present and settled in the UK.
To me that application sounds very much like the sponsorship application I've got going through at the moment to gain Permanent Residence in Canada. I'd love to see what Immigration Canada's comment on wether co-owning a pet helps this process at all, as I do co-own my wife's black lab, and I do think she'd have hard time adapting to life in the UK
My problem with this case is that from what I can see, if he was in the UK legally then there is a legal way to gain permanent residence. Many go through this route, so why can't he? If he's here illegally, be it because he originally entered so, or wether he stayed after a visa/permit expiry, then I have very little sympathy for him and he should be deported back to Bolivia. Using the pet cat as proof of an on-going and serious relationship is just utter foolishness as it's setting a precedent.
1) Did he originally legally enter the UK? Was it as a visitor or worker?
2) If he entered legally, then why did he not extend his work permit, if indeed he had one?
3) If he was here legally, and if he has been here and lived with his parter (I assume they are a resident or citizen of the UK) for more than two years, and seemingly the article states this is so, then why did he not apply for 'indefitinte leave to remain (what I would call permanent residence - Canadian Immigration term) via the SET(M) application. This allows you to stay if you are a spouse or civil parter of a person present and settled in the UK, or unmarried or same sex partner of a person present and settled in the UK.
To me that application sounds very much like the sponsorship application I've got going through at the moment to gain Permanent Residence in Canada. I'd love to see what Immigration Canada's comment on wether co-owning a pet helps this process at all, as I do co-own my wife's black lab, and I do think she'd have hard time adapting to life in the UK
My problem with this case is that from what I can see, if he was in the UK legally then there is a legal way to gain permanent residence. Many go through this route, so why can't he? If he's here illegally, be it because he originally entered so, or wether he stayed after a visa/permit expiry, then I have very little sympathy for him and he should be deported back to Bolivia. Using the pet cat as proof of an on-going and serious relationship is just utter foolishness as it's setting a precedent.
19 October 2009, 01:36 PM
#44
I respect that, seriously. BUT, you have only yourself to blame for the situation. No vote, no responsibility, no action. You want stuff to change there are two options available, vote or violence. I am, begining, to feel that our "leaders" need to feel "violence". Like the poll tax riots of the 90's. Sadly, since then, our "rights" have been severely erroded since then.
I am not apathetic to what is going on but feel i am at a loss to do something positive. My strongest desire atm is to get the hell out of this country and come and join you.
I watch different Border Control programmes on the tv and get so angry. If they can control the immigrant situation then why cant we?
19 October 2009, 04:41 PM
#45
I don't know why peolpe want to draw lines all over the place saying where you can and can't live.
This guy should get a medal. He was able to find a job when "five million" locals couldn't. He should be held up as an example to the workshy.
My only caveat would be that we should be very careful about handing out benefits to those who come here but can't support themselves. We should also be even more careful about handing them out to lazy indigenes.
19 October 2009, 04:50 PM
#46
BANNED
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 859
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let's realise that the immigrant population know how to play the system, getting legal advice and claiming legal aid, paid for by us. The legal profession must be coining it. Is it a coincidence that Cherrie (Wallace & Gromett) Blair is a specialist in these cases?
19 October 2009, 04:57 PM
#47
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (22)
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Doncaster, S. Yorks.
Posts: 21,415
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My eldest is in the same sort of boat: he started work on £14 an hour as a skilled welder/plater. Due to the recession he got laid off, he now works for £12 an hour, in Holland, and if he comes back here, IF he can get work, the same job now pays £10 an hour
............and that's if he finds work, most of which is now on the North Bank from here, so that's £27 a week bridge tolls straight off his wages
............and that's if he finds work, most of which is now on the North Bank from here, so that's £27 a week bridge tolls straight off his wages
I count myself lucky to be where I am now, and I've worked hard for it too.
19 October 2009, 05:48 PM
#48
The typical Brit isn't willing to work and still struggle so they sit on their ***** and claim benefits and struggle. Whereas "Johnny foreigner" is willing to work like a dog regardless of the financial struggle. In fact "Johnny foreigner" will in most cases get a second job to ease the burden.
Now this is the way it seems to be going these days. I'm not saying the British are lazy as a nation but there is an element running through us now that are nothing but lazy. These are the people that scream and moan that their jobs are being taken by immigrants. But I can guarantee that if there were no immigrants this element would find some other reason not to work.
Now this Benefits system that is so inviting to "some" immigrants and so comforting to the lazy British element needs shaking up so as to make it only available on a points system. The longer you have worked the more you are entitled to if you should find yourself out of a job at any point. But even then it should only be paid for a given period then if you haven't found employment you must agree to take part in a government run scheme to retrain in order to take a job in another field. Even if that field is as low as fruit picking (which Brits always think is beneath them)
Now this is the way it seems to be going these days. I'm not saying the British are lazy as a nation but there is an element running through us now that are nothing but lazy. These are the people that scream and moan that their jobs are being taken by immigrants. But I can guarantee that if there were no immigrants this element would find some other reason not to work.
Now this Benefits system that is so inviting to "some" immigrants and so comforting to the lazy British element needs shaking up so as to make it only available on a points system. The longer you have worked the more you are entitled to if you should find yourself out of a job at any point. But even then it should only be paid for a given period then if you haven't found employment you must agree to take part in a government run scheme to retrain in order to take a job in another field. Even if that field is as low as fruit picking (which Brits always think is beneath them)
19 October 2009, 06:17 PM
#49
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Disco, Disco!
Posts: 21,825
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The typical Brit isn't willing to work and still struggle so they sit on their ***** and claim benefits and struggle. Whereas "Johnny foreigner" is willing to work like a dog regardless of the financial struggle. In fact "Johnny foreigner" will in most cases get a second job to ease the burden.
Now this is the way it seems to be going these days. I'm not saying the British are lazy as a nation but there is an element running through us now that are nothing but lazy. These are the people that scream and moan that their jobs are being taken by immigrants. But I can guarantee that if there were no immigrants this element would find some other reason not to work.
Now this Benefits system that is so inviting to "some" immigrants and so comforting to the lazy British element needs shaking up so as to make it only available on a points system. The longer you have worked the more you are entitled to if you should find yourself out of a job at any point. But even then it should only be paid for a given period then if you haven't found employment you must agree to take part in a government run scheme to retrain in order to take a job in another field. Even if that field is as low as fruit picking (which Brits always think is beneath them)
Now this is the way it seems to be going these days. I'm not saying the British are lazy as a nation but there is an element running through us now that are nothing but lazy. These are the people that scream and moan that their jobs are being taken by immigrants. But I can guarantee that if there were no immigrants this element would find some other reason not to work.
Now this Benefits system that is so inviting to "some" immigrants and so comforting to the lazy British element needs shaking up so as to make it only available on a points system. The longer you have worked the more you are entitled to if you should find yourself out of a job at any point. But even then it should only be paid for a given period then if you haven't found employment you must agree to take part in a government run scheme to retrain in order to take a job in another field. Even if that field is as low as fruit picking (which Brits always think is beneath them)
Thr typical Brit is why we have money in the coffers to pay for education, healthcare, etc nfor the long term lazy who this and the previous govt first created then nurtured.
Still the weak minded amongst us confuse or compare the home grown long term lazy and illegals, both need dealing with , two wrong's still do not make a right!
Last edited by The Zohan; 19 October 2009 at 06:24 PM.
19 October 2009, 07:47 PM
#51
Just because some people look at the situation as a bigger picture, rather than two totally separate problems, doesn't necessarily make them weak minded. While illegal immigration is a separate issue, I still firmly believe if you reform the benefits system, it will deter alot of those wanting to come here for a free ride. I am talking only of those wanting to scrounge, not those who are genuinely seeking a better life and willing to work for it.
Not only that, it deals with 'our own' at the same time. There is no getting away from the fact we have a proportion of people here who just don't want to work, and that needs to stop. And also in this day and age, nobody should be able to say they are better off on benefits. Shake it up to be a temporary measure, acively help people get into stable work, and as KOT touched on, the money saved by not allowing people to live without working could be used to either top up wages, give tax credits to more (or a higher amount), or deduct a certain amount of council tax/rent for the lower paid. Make it so those at the lower end are helped, but are still working and contributing.
19 October 2009, 07:59 PM
#52
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (22)
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Doncaster, S. Yorks.
Posts: 21,415
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As per the program on channel 4 recently, a lot of the poeple on benefits stay on benefits because it's a lot more stable than risking agency work or low end min wage jobs where the turnaround is quite high in some aspects.
Thats not me sticking up for those people either - I'd love to know where/how they get their money from 'cos when on benefits myself, I got **** all
19 October 2009, 08:05 PM
#53
Just picking up on this point Lisa, is there such a thing as "stable work" nowadays?
As per the program on channel 4 recently, a lot of the poeple on benefits stay on benefits because it's a lot more stable than risking agency work or low end min wage jobs where the turnaround is quite high in some aspects.
Thats not me sticking up for those people either - I'd love to know where/how they get their money from 'cos when on benefits myself, I got **** all
As per the program on channel 4 recently, a lot of the poeple on benefits stay on benefits because it's a lot more stable than risking agency work or low end min wage jobs where the turnaround is quite high in some aspects.
Thats not me sticking up for those people either - I'd love to know where/how they get their money from 'cos when on benefits myself, I got **** all
This is my point, nobody should be in a situation of benefits (long term) being the only option.
19 October 2009, 08:06 PM
#54
Can illegal Immigrants claim benefits? 
No, they work without paying taxes. Those jobs could be filled with tax paying workers, and that is part of the problem. They are taking and not giving anything back.
I was under the impression that if you was claiming benefit and was fit for work you had to go to so many interviews a week or a day, i am not sure, and that if you fail to do this then your benefit is stopped.
No, they work without paying taxes. Those jobs could be filled with tax paying workers, and that is part of the problem. They are taking and not giving anything back.
I was under the impression that if you was claiming benefit and was fit for work you had to go to so many interviews a week or a day, i am not sure, and that if you fail to do this then your benefit is stopped.
19 October 2009, 08:12 PM
#55
Can illegal Immigrants claim benefits?
No, they work without paying taxes. Those jobs could be filled with tax paying workers, and that is part of the problem. They are taking and not giving anything back.
I was under the impression that if you was claiming benefit and was fit for work you had to go to so many interviews a week or a day, i am not sure, and that if you fail to do this then your benefit is stopped.
No, they work without paying taxes. Those jobs could be filled with tax paying workers, and that is part of the problem. They are taking and not giving anything back.
I was under the impression that if you was claiming benefit and was fit for work you had to go to so many interviews a week or a day, i am not sure, and that if you fail to do this then your benefit is stopped.
Yes, they do lower end jobs (legally and illegally), and while tax paying workers could do the job, the simple truth is, is there are people out there not working who would simply not even want to do them. For whatever reason.
As for claiming benefits, maybe some are pushed and get threatened with their benefots being stopped, but there are many out there who know the system back to front and simply get around any issues that crop up, to live on them long term. I speak from experience (not me btw).
19 October 2009, 08:26 PM
#56
As for working illegally, this needs to be dealt with, I fully agree. But trying to make even legal immigrants a scapegoat is wrong imo.
Yes, they do lower end jobs (legally and illegally), and while tax paying workers could do the job, the simple truth is, is there are people out there not working who would simply not even want to do them. For whatever reason.
As for claiming benefits, maybe some are pushed and get threatened with their benefots being stopped, but there are many out there who know the system back to front and simply get around any issues that crop up, to live on them long term. I speak from experience (not me btw).
Yes, they do lower end jobs (legally and illegally), and while tax paying workers could do the job, the simple truth is, is there are people out there not working who would simply not even want to do them. For whatever reason.
As for claiming benefits, maybe some are pushed and get threatened with their benefots being stopped, but there are many out there who know the system back to front and simply get around any issues that crop up, to live on them long term. I speak from experience (not me btw).
Let me make this point, and i am in no way sticking up for the work shy losers that scrounge off the state. Illegals work and pay no taxes etc. I bet a lot of those on benefits that dont want to or dont see the point of finding work would be a lot happier to do so if they also didnt have to pay and contributions. Some of those on benefits refuse to work when others are seen to be given free range to do what they want. I know this is wrong but its a bit like the chicken and egg scenario. If the government were seen to be doing more to clean up the mess that they allowed to happen, surely this would go some way to be setting an example.
19 October 2009, 08:48 PM
#57
Scooby Regular
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Disco, Disco!
Posts: 21,825
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To be fair to Magepaster, while his comment was a bit sweeping(so are some others on this thread), I think he is just trying to make the point that a benefits shake up could well be a good all round solution to both problems.
Just because some people look at the situation as a bigger picture, rather than two totally separate problems, doesn't necessarily make them weak minded. While illegal immigration is a separate issue, I still firmly believe if you reform the benefits system, it will deter alot of those wanting to come here for a free ride. I am talking only of those wanting to scrounge, not those who are genuinely seeking a better life and willing to work for it.
Not only that, it deals with 'our own' at the same time. There is no getting away from the fact we have a proportion of people here who just don't want to work, and that needs to stop. And also in this day and age, nobody should be able to say they are better off on benefits. Shake it up to be a temporary measure, acively help people get into stable work, and as KOT touched on, the money saved by not allowing people to live without working could be used to either top up wages, give tax credits to more (or a higher amount), or deduct a certain amount of council tax/rent for the lower paid. Make it so those at the lower end are helped, but are still working and contributing.
Just because some people look at the situation as a bigger picture, rather than two totally separate problems, doesn't necessarily make them weak minded. While illegal immigration is a separate issue, I still firmly believe if you reform the benefits system, it will deter alot of those wanting to come here for a free ride. I am talking only of those wanting to scrounge, not those who are genuinely seeking a better life and willing to work for it.
Not only that, it deals with 'our own' at the same time. There is no getting away from the fact we have a proportion of people here who just don't want to work, and that needs to stop. And also in this day and age, nobody should be able to say they are better off on benefits. Shake it up to be a temporary measure, acively help people get into stable work, and as KOT touched on, the money saved by not allowing people to live without working could be used to either top up wages, give tax credits to more (or a higher amount), or deduct a certain amount of council tax/rent for the lower paid. Make it so those at the lower end are helped, but are still working and contributing.
I am sure he/she is big enough to speak for themselves without needed to be defended and not just aimed at Megapaster by any means.
If you took the time to read and understand my post you would have noticed the i said the weak minded confuse or compare and that two wrongs do not make a right which is my point. They are seperate issues and do not cancel each other out as some seem to think
The bigger picture is that of a government more keen to interfere in Afganistan than sort out its own problems mostly of thier creation.
19 October 2009, 09:11 PM
#58
Now maybe I should have written my posting a little more clearly but the first paragraph is meant to indicate the way things "seem" to be headed.
If you notice my second paragraph it starts "Now this is the way thing semm to be headed"
I know the typical Brit is a hard working bugger right now. But more and more people are out of work and the more people that are out of work the more they seem happy to stay out of work and moan about not having a job while blaming someone else for their plight. Things have to change and it has to become harder for the unemployed to stay unemployed.
Sorry for the confusion Mr Habgood
If you notice my second paragraph it starts "Now this is the way thing semm to be headed"
I know the typical Brit is a hard working bugger right now. But more and more people are out of work and the more people that are out of work the more they seem happy to stay out of work and moan about not having a job while blaming someone else for their plight. Things have to change and it has to become harder for the unemployed to stay unemployed.
Sorry for the confusion Mr Habgood
20 October 2009, 12:06 AM
#59
I am sure he/she is big enough to speak for themselves without needed to be defended and not just aimed at Megapaster by any means.
If you took the time to read and understand my post you would have noticed the i said the weak minded confuse or compare and that two wrongs do not make a right which is my point. They are seperate issues and do not cancel each other out as some seem to think
The bigger picture is that of a government more keen to interfere in Afganistan than sort out its own problems mostly of thier creation.
If you took the time to read and understand my post you would have noticed the i said the weak minded confuse or compare and that two wrongs do not make a right which is my point. They are seperate issues and do not cancel each other out as some seem to think
The bigger picture is that of a government more keen to interfere in Afganistan than sort out its own problems mostly of thier creation.
I can see your point, but while the two issues are separate, and need to be dealt with to a point as different issues, to an extent if you adjust the benefit system you can kill two birds with one stone. In terms of scroungers from whatever background.
I don't think two wrongs make a right, but I can see a possible avenue to go down, to solve some problems on both issues, whether it would work is a different matter. There is no point in going back and forward as some do (this person is scrounging/ but this other is too), it's about being proactive, and to my mind, binning the system as it is could solve both issues.
And yes, I agree re the government.
20 October 2009, 12:15 AM
#60
Let me make this point, and i am in no way sticking up for the work shy losers that scrounge off the state. Illegals work and pay no taxes etc. I bet a lot of those on benefits that dont want to or dont see the point of finding work would be a lot happier to do so if they also didnt have to pay and contributions. Some of those on benefits refuse to work when others are seen to be given free range to do what they want. I know this is wrong but its a bit like the chicken and egg scenario. If the government were seen to be doing more to clean up the mess that they allowed to happen, surely this would go some way to be setting an example.
In that case ask yourself, why do I not (in a crappy paid job) go on benefits with that opinion? I work bloody hard as do others, for not alot of money, and what little I do earn a percentage goes out to support people who can't either be arsed to work, or somehow cheat the system. While it annoys me, I don't just think I'll give it up as a bad job, and join the club.
If I can't change things, I will continue to have a work ethic, and just accept life isn't all rosy. Believe me, I'm not happy about how everything works, but that is no excuse for me or anyone else just to bow out of work.