Police - Incompetent bureaucrats
05 December 2009, 05:22 PM
#31
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The OP's post doesn't actually say whether the 2nd lot of items were paid for before delivery carried out. If they were paid via a card that is pukka then there's no theft.
You can't prove fraud until it's actually happened. If the card is genuine and being used by its owner then the issue is with the CC company allowing transaction reversal.
You can't prove fraud until it's actually happened. If the card is genuine and being used by its owner then the issue is with the CC company allowing transaction reversal.
All far more complex than the clear cut case it first appears as.
05 December 2009, 05:27 PM
#32
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Credit card fraud is hard to prove because the card companies usually just settle up with the loser and then it becomes them that are the victims. They often just soak this up and it's one of the reasons their APRs are so high to pay for this.
05 December 2009, 05:32 PM
#33
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Like I said previously, Fedex come under constant abuse from credit card fraud, but even with all the data we collect on it, it rarely goes any further. Mainly because as we have grown wise to it, we stop most of it now.
05 December 2009, 05:59 PM
#34
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You'd think all the cop-haters on here would start a petition to get her sacked as it doesn't set a good example or help build the reputation of the force.
Then again, it's a lose-lose situation. I'd hate to have been the OIC. Imagine if you got a conviction - "Well done. Get rid of the prisoner and pick up your P45 on the way out"
Then again, it's a lose-lose situation. I'd hate to have been the OIC. Imagine if you got a conviction - "Well done. Get rid of the prisoner and pick up your P45 on the way out"
06 December 2009, 02:32 AM
#35
I get the impression that these days the Police are so obsessed with fulfilling the targets set for them by our masters that they consider that is of greater importance than actually protecting the public and/or solving or preventing crime. Their senior officers who are responsible for their application to the job appear to be more interested in presenting the right answers to the politicians to their own advantage and have forgotten what we actually pay them for!
Les
Les
06 December 2009, 02:29 PM
#39
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Unfortunatly its the "prove beyond reasonable doubt" thing that causes the issues.
If you were staying at a friends house, and a delivery arrived that just needed a signature, a box from Royal Mail or something, and you were the only one in..... Would you sign for it?
95% of people will answer yes to this.
3 mins later, when the police put the door in, and arrest you for possession with intent to supply, as the box was full of charlie, would you expect the case to stick?
NO!
Using that kind of logic is how these fraudulant people operate. The person commiting the fraud, making the purchase is untracable (unless monitored for a good period of time) and the only person to be arrested will be the "friend" at the house.
Physical cards are rarely used for such transactions, its usually stolen data, so what exactly is there to use to build a case on.
And in theory in this case, the company KNEW the transaction was fraudulant, yet delivered it anyway. So as no transaction had ever been completed/authorised (following the discovery of it) the delivery of the treadmill was not paid for, so technically played no part in any offence.
Receiving stolen good? No they were delievered willingly by the owners.
Fraud? No, the transaction was reversed, so was not valid as such.
Its unfortunate, I agree fully, and irritating that these people walk free everytime. But if the police were following up on these things, in all cases, they would have an Ebay Division, to spend the whole day chasing people parcels that they sent after Paypal reversed the payment.
I really do wish all the people that commit these crimes would fall into a deep hole just as it was being filled in..... But for now, its down to us to minimise our losses to these scum!
If you were staying at a friends house, and a delivery arrived that just needed a signature, a box from Royal Mail or something, and you were the only one in..... Would you sign for it?
95% of people will answer yes to this.
3 mins later, when the police put the door in, and arrest you for possession with intent to supply, as the box was full of charlie, would you expect the case to stick?
NO!
Using that kind of logic is how these fraudulant people operate. The person commiting the fraud, making the purchase is untracable (unless monitored for a good period of time) and the only person to be arrested will be the "friend" at the house.
Physical cards are rarely used for such transactions, its usually stolen data, so what exactly is there to use to build a case on.
And in theory in this case, the company KNEW the transaction was fraudulant, yet delivered it anyway. So as no transaction had ever been completed/authorised (following the discovery of it) the delivery of the treadmill was not paid for, so technically played no part in any offence.
Receiving stolen good? No they were delievered willingly by the owners.
Fraud? No, the transaction was reversed, so was not valid as such.
Its unfortunate, I agree fully, and irritating that these people walk free everytime. But if the police were following up on these things, in all cases, they would have an Ebay Division, to spend the whole day chasing people parcels that they sent after Paypal reversed the payment.
I really do wish all the people that commit these crimes would fall into a deep hole just as it was being filled in..... But for now, its down to us to minimise our losses to these scum!
06 December 2009, 02:30 PM
#40
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PS thats not to say that these people are never arrested. Again, through work we have seen a good number nicked. But its all about time....... Their time will come, one way or another.
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