Judge says Sikhs should be able to carry knife in school.
pmsl, wind up merchant 
08 February 2010, 05:13 PM
#32
No its not
Thats why most peoples backs are up in the UK with regards to foreign requests - because we're always accomodating others over our own.
But hey - it is their religious right though to carry a dagger
So we may as well just ******* roll over again and take another.
Thats why most peoples backs are up in the UK with regards to foreign requests - because we're always accomodating others over our own.
But hey - it is their religious right though to carry a dagger
So we may as well just ******* roll over again and take another.
08 February 2010, 05:56 PM
#35
Hi,
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
08 February 2010, 06:02 PM
#36
I'm sick and tired of all this islam/muslim beliefs shyte.
**** off from our country - you're destroying it
If you want to live in our country then abide by our rules fullstop or **** off.
We need to clamp down on this absurd nonsense via judicial means and show that we mean business and won't be pressurised by the "racial" card.
**** off from our country - you're destroying it
If you want to live in our country then abide by our rules fullstop or **** off.
We need to clamp down on this absurd nonsense via judicial means and show that we mean business and won't be pressurised by the "racial" card.
Ditto
08 February 2010, 06:05 PM
#37
I come from a Sikh culture & do think that its not really a good idea to allow kids to take anything to school that could be used as a weapon. This could be anything from catapaults to snooker cues etc & even a kirpan (blunted knife) could even be used against the kid wearing it by someone else. I think its more a matter of Health & Saftey than religion, especially in this day & age.
08 February 2010, 06:09 PM
#38
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Hi,
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
I hear what you say and thank you for explaining why and how.
Not wishing to be offensive or belittle Sikh's - i am pretty surre that there has not been a massacre of Sikh's in the UK or even Europe. UK laws prevent knives eing carried for protection and it seems madness to exclude one section of society from this, either no one is allowed or we all 'carry' - or have the choice to anyway.
Many years ago the English carried knives, pickaxes, pikes and swords for protection against maurauding vikings, romans, french and zee Germans (amongst others) over the years. we do not carry these now unless in the armed forces or on ceremonial occasions and certianly not to school.
For me the crux is allowing children to carry knives to school. I have two children at school and would not be comfortable with any children who are allowed to bring in daggers/knives for any reason.
Having the knife in school may lead to it being stolen or even taken off of a 'responsible' child in the heat of playground battle and it being used in anger - many scenarios just like that and that's why 'no knives in school'
I would remove my child from any school that allows other children to carry a knife.
Yet again the law is being made an *** of and more bad feelings stirred up.
It really should be a simple case of fit in or **** off
Last edited by The Zohan; 08 February 2010 at 06:20 PM.
08 February 2010, 06:17 PM
#39
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I come from a Sikh culture & do think that its not really a good idea to allow kids to take anything to school that could be used as a weapon. This could be anything from catapaults to snooker cues etc & even a kirpan (blunted knife) could even be used against the kid wearing it by someone else. I think its more a matter of Health & Saftey than religion, especially in this day & age.
08 February 2010, 06:46 PM
#40
Sometimes I do wonder whether there is sometimes a real objection or just an opportunity to have a moan, I do not see the issue if a Sikh boy is allowed to carry a symbolic dagger, not a real one, something that satifies religous observance and does not fall foul of the weapons legislation, its not that complicated and it isn't rolling over, my kids have toy weapons that arent going to harm, or fool anybody and guess what, when they do school plays and the like, they take them in, shock horror !!
Surely the Sikh leaders can get together with Teachers, the Police and any other agency that feels the need to join in and develop a Kirpan specifically to be suitable for Sikh lads to carry at school, the Sikh community would have to accept the school's right to inspect a Kirpan and confiscate it if it isnt suitable, religous or not, if its the holy Grail itself, if it is capable of harm it shouldnt be in a school.
There is no point p1ssing the Sikhs off and no need to allow Sikh boys to carry a huge knife, a compromise can be found, if someone is so intent on injuring another then they will find a way, if all a school sanctioned Kirpan can do is induce chafing then they will either forget about it or go and find something more effective like those things for drawing circles, a ruler or a million and one other things.
Whilst people fanny about worrying about this there are scores of little toerags going round with "uncermonial" daggers in theri schoolbags, killing each other, these arent Sikhs based on my observations.
Surely the Sikh leaders can get together with Teachers, the Police and any other agency that feels the need to join in and develop a Kirpan specifically to be suitable for Sikh lads to carry at school, the Sikh community would have to accept the school's right to inspect a Kirpan and confiscate it if it isnt suitable, religous or not, if its the holy Grail itself, if it is capable of harm it shouldnt be in a school.
There is no point p1ssing the Sikhs off and no need to allow Sikh boys to carry a huge knife, a compromise can be found, if someone is so intent on injuring another then they will find a way, if all a school sanctioned Kirpan can do is induce chafing then they will either forget about it or go and find something more effective like those things for drawing circles, a ruler or a million and one other things.
Whilst people fanny about worrying about this there are scores of little toerags going round with "uncermonial" daggers in theri schoolbags, killing each other, these arent Sikhs based on my observations.
08 February 2010, 08:28 PM
#41
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Hi,
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
being a Sikh please allow me to try and add some knowledge behind it all:
Baptised Sikhs wear the 5-K's as they are commonly referred: These are the only people who carry a Kirpan (dagger).
There are people who carry a sizeable Kirpan but this is always sheathed, blunt and cannot sometimes be drawn. Some people, especially when they travel and have to deal with security issues etc wear a mini-kirpan which is a small replica on a necklace around their neck. I personally think this is pointless but that's another topic for another forum.
The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Religion is a thing that some people find pointless and others find dear and we've had the religious threads by the boatload on here
Whilst I understand people's anger at this ruling Sikhs are generally a lawful and peaceful people and as the recent case of the Sikh guy who got killed whilst giving chase to criminals confirms - we do try to do the right thing.
Jai
I would not be happy at all, to think any person of any religion was allowed to carry a knife, especially to a school.
Young lads are notorious for scrapping after school, and I don't believe for one minute, the temptation to use said knife would not enter anyones head.
What is disturbing is the fact this "Judge" thinks it should be alright. If that is the case, he should not be a Judge. Would he think it is ok for the Scots to wear a knife in their sock (I think they do whilst wearing a kilt). I very much doubt he would view this the same way. There should never be one rule for one and another for everyone else. Makes for serious unrest.
I am all for people wearing their religious symbols with pride, I myself wear a crucifix and woe betide anyone who tells me I should not. But a crucifix is not a dangerous weapon.
Hopefully this won't offend any Scoobynet Sikhs, wear your other symbols with pride and leave your Kirpan at home
08 February 2010, 08:36 PM
#42
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The judge is clearly totally out-of-touch with society. Of course it's crazy to suggest taking weapons to school is ok.
I'm surprised at this from a Sikh judge to be honest. In my experience Sikh's have very good values and don't try to force their beliefs on others, or generally put their relgion before the laws of the land, but this guy has not done Sikhs any favours with this ill thoughtout comment.
I'm surprised at this from a Sikh judge to be honest. In my experience Sikh's have very good values and don't try to force their beliefs on others, or generally put their relgion before the laws of the land, but this guy has not done Sikhs any favours with this ill thoughtout comment.
08 February 2010, 09:25 PM
#43
No, they don't force their beliefs on others, just insist and lo and behold the law changes for them
Sikh bus drivers/train drivers that didn't have to wear the uniform caps? Sikhs who don't have to wear proper motorcycle helmets? The judge in this one who didn't have to wear a wig because he wanted to wear a turban?
Sikh bus drivers/train drivers that didn't have to wear the uniform caps? Sikhs who don't have to wear proper motorcycle helmets? The judge in this one who didn't have to wear a wig because he wanted to wear a turban?
08 February 2010, 10:33 PM
#44
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Scoobynet at its best as always. People prepared to pass judgement on something they know nothing about.
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
Last edited by Dingdongler; 08 February 2010 at 10:38 PM.
08 February 2010, 10:38 PM
#45
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I'm sick and tired of all this islam/muslim beliefs shyte.
**** off from our country - you're destroying it
If you want to live in our country then abide by our rules fullstop or **** off.
We need to clamp down on this absurd nonsense via judicial means and show that we mean business and won't be pressurised by the "racial" card.
**** off from our country - you're destroying it
If you want to live in our country then abide by our rules fullstop or **** off.
We need to clamp down on this absurd nonsense via judicial means and show that we mean business and won't be pressurised by the "racial" card.
and how long has that mess taken to sort out?
08 February 2010, 11:13 PM
#48
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The Kirpan was given to us not to harm but to defend, not just ourselves but others. Please bear in mind this is in a country and during a time where it was very turbulent and Sikhs were massacred and had a lot do deal with. It may not have the same requirements in modern society but I think its important to understand the importance and background behind something that many may find trivial.
Jai, I don't mean to single you out, just to pick up on the above
Essentially what you've said implies that the physical Kirpan is now, in a modern society, completely irrelevant. In our society you can't defend yourself with a knife, in our society you can't defend others with a knife. The 'knife' Sikhs carry isn't even an actual knife! There seems to me, to be no practical reason to carry it.Remember it, yes. Teach folk about it, yes. Keep one in the home, fine. Carry one about, I don't see the point.
Just my view, not being religionist!
I'd say the same about any religion trying to justify carrying a 'weapon'.
08 February 2010, 11:15 PM
#49
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You goon 
Dingdongler, I sincerely hope you are not including me in your generalisation of peoples opinions !!!!
impreza_sports_nutter's post was excellent in enlightening me on his religion. It was good to read and learn, but it still has not changed my opinion of daggers/knives, blunt or not. School is not the place for them, end of
I doubt God would be too upset to not having them in place for a few hours a day
Dingdongler, I sincerely hope you are not including me in your generalisation of peoples opinions !!!!
impreza_sports_nutter's post was excellent in enlightening me on his religion. It was good to read and learn, but it still has not changed my opinion of daggers/knives, blunt or not. School is not the place for them, end of
I doubt God would be too upset to not having them in place for a few hours a day
08 February 2010, 11:37 PM
#50
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Scoobynet at its best as always. People prepared to pass judgement on something they know nothing about.
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
09 February 2010, 12:26 AM
#53
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Scoobynet at its best as always. People prepared to pass judgement on something they know nothing about.
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
To the extent where one Irish retard thinks sikh's are muslims ffs!
As far as I know the 'dagger' is but a symbol, it is not a real dagger. It is blunted to the extent that a ball point pen would probably be more dangerous. As mentioned before they are often sealed into the sheath anyway.
The backward on here love to come and shout their mouths off about non stories regarding peoples they have no knowledge of, swearing blind that they are threatening their so called way of life. A way of life that obviously never involves reading a book or traveling beyond Benidorm.
Alcazar, we were very happy to allow the sikhs not to wear helmets when they fought with us during the first and second world wars, but its now a big deal if they don't want to wear a bus drivers cap? Get a grip.
Comments of British Generals Regarding Sikh Soldiers
For those who so idiotically say '**** off back to your own country', I've got news for you retards, this IS THEIR COUNTRY
09 February 2010, 12:28 AM
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09 February 2010, 12:34 AM
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09 February 2010, 12:37 AM
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09 February 2010, 08:17 AM
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09 February 2010, 08:37 AM
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You belittle pretty much everyone who dares to disagree with you and you view yet you get all upset when people then come back at you or insult you (as in so many other threads on SN), it takes a real man to give it and then take it on the chin when it comes back.
Martin - Question - Do you think anyone should be allowed to carry a knife in school and why?
It appears that in the UK the strict laws governing this can be broken on the grounds of religion.
This is not right.
No knives in school - it is very simple, no child carries a knife to school, ceremonial or not.
If people/immigrants/second/third/fourth generations of people coming here for a better life cannot accept this then they need to change to fit in or leave. This is not **** off you immigrant scum, this is simply how is must be.
People coming here and not fitting in, not accepting our rules, our laws our ways (the good stuff) then we have a problem, remember 7/7 home grown bombers and the murderers of innocent men women and children.
I have some news for you, 'This is their country' - wrong Martin, wrong!
pathtic statements like that from the wholley minded and cowardly, accepting those who come here to do not want to fit in, accept the laws and culture are the reasons we have a lot of the problems we have now with the likes of the BNP, Choudry, racisim on both sides and possibly worsening/bigger divides and friction.
Thank you NL and the likes of Martin, your 'thinking'(for want of a more approriate word) is why we are getting in the mess we are in.
I have no problem with those who come here and want to 'join in' be part of the community, this country and contribute in a positive way - as long as we have the room, resources and jobs to sustain those already here and those who wish to come.
Blimey - more than a ''**** off you darkies' from a DM reading, right wing, obviously wrong, racist dimwit!
Last edited by The Zohan; 09 February 2010 at 09:11 AM.