Almost a thousand GPs earn more than £200,000
17 September 2010, 10:48 PM
#32
Ah..... PSL
How about the deal we show how much we earn
Looking at your posts and what they contain I would hazard a very good guess that we are both children of the late 50's and before the baby boom of the 60's
Shaun
How about the deal we show how much we earn
Looking at your posts and what they contain I would hazard a very good guess that we are both children of the late 50's and before the baby boom of the 60's
Shaun
17 September 2010, 10:56 PM
#33
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Yes many of us do long hours. I work 12 hour shift 7 days a week half my life.
17 September 2010, 10:59 PM
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18 September 2010, 12:48 AM
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I think I could be a GP. Big Joe shows up sick, I tell him it is probably a viral thing, but get another appointment if he is still sick in 48/72 hours. He isn't going to get an appointment for at least a week, and if he is still sick when he comes back to see me I will refer him. That seems about standard?
18 September 2010, 01:03 AM
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I think I could be a GP. Big Joe shows up sick, I tell him it is probably a viral thing, but get another appointment if he is still sick in 48/72 hours. He isn't going to get an appointment for at least a week, and if he is still sick when he comes back to see me I will refer him. That seems about standard?
And dangerous.Big Joe shows up "sick", well what does that mean? Recently I have had that complaint from a whole load of patients and in the last month that complaint has often meant a viral thing, but it has also meant ruptured sigmoid colon, myocardial infarction and acute glaucoma. The presentation in all cases was just being generally unwell with very little to go on. Recently, similar vague cases have also included meningitis, pyelonephritis, cholangitis, pancreatitis and dissecting aneurysm of the aorta. Some of these patients I saw a few times in one day as things evolved. If you make the genuinely unwell wait 48/72 hours they can die. Perhaps a more common experience of those who underestimate what goes on is that they indeed do have a self limiting trivial but irritating viral infection and the doctor is triaging things carefully. Certainly that is what I'm trying to do anyway.
If someone comes back sick and I refer him, if I suspect cancer that takes two weeks. If I refer everyone and say they have cancer, my consultant colleagues will get very upset. If a routine referral or something vague where it is difficult to pick a specialty then I'm left managing them with limited investigations for quite a while. The life threatening ones to be referred with blue lights now have to be done now or they die. But if you do that all the time you get very unpopular. Most patients I admit have life threatening illnesses, usually limiting their breathing or circulation in a major way, or an overwhelming infection or surgical calamity. The hospitals just don't have the capacity for trivia.
Many of the same comparisons can be made with A/E. You sit for hours in amongst drunks and then get "fobbed off with a virus" or even told to go away by the receptionist. But when you turn up one day in resus with half your leg missing after an RTA you'll appreciate that not all A/E is trivia either. However, a huge amount of it is.
Next time I'm on my own waiting 20 minutes for an ambulance to arrive whilst I'm resuscitating a 20 stone man trapped in a dark hallway I'll remember my job is easy.
You guys have no idea the job a GP does clearly. You just know your own trivial encounters. The job is interesting, varied, often routine, but sometimes quite dramatic and very challenging. You always have to be on your toes to do it well. Dull people don't even make it into medical school let alone last the training and then stick at the job.
Another thing is that patients demand referrals even when it is inappropriate and I have made the correct diagnosis and given the correct treatment. Usually when I refer I know what is going to happen to them, after all I've sat in a lot of the hospital specialties I refer to seeing referrals from GPs, but some patients like to see the hospital. Fear of litigation means it is difficult to refuse even when I know it is unnecessary.
Last edited by john banks; 18 September 2010 at 01:16 AM.
18 September 2010, 12:45 PM
#38
Just found this.......... quite topical
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11350383
I'm paid roughly the same as a secondary school head, I wonder what the survey would have said LOL
Shaun
PS John, The Ruptured Colon / faecal peritonitis, I guess they didn't make it
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11350383
I'm paid roughly the same as a secondary school head, I wonder what the survey would have said LOL
Shaun
PS John, The Ruptured Colon / faecal peritonitis, I guess they didn't make it
18 September 2010, 01:11 PM
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They all made it Just doing my easy job of course, but I didn't admit them all straight away. Some patients get upset about uncertainty and the need for watchful waiting. It is quite challenging (and interesting) watching serious problems evolve from something that looks trivial.
Just doing my easy job of course, but I didn't admit them all straight away. Some patients get upset about uncertainty and the need for watchful waiting. It is quite challenging (and interesting) watching serious problems evolve from something that looks trivial.
18 September 2010, 02:21 PM
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18 September 2010, 10:03 PM
#41
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A bit shallow there And dangerous.
Big Joe shows up "sick", well what does that mean? Recently I have had that complaint from a whole load of patients and in the last month that complaint has often meant a viral thing, but it has also meant ruptured sigmoid colon, myocardial infarction and acute glaucoma. The presentation in all cases was just being generally unwell with very little to go on. Recently, similar vague cases have also included meningitis, pyelonephritis, cholangitis, pancreatitis and dissecting aneurysm of the aorta. Some of these patients I saw a few times in one day as things evolved. If you make the genuinely unwell wait 48/72 hours they can die. Perhaps a more common experience of those who underestimate what goes on is that they indeed do have a self limiting trivial but irritating viral infection and the doctor is triaging things carefully. Certainly that is what I'm trying to do anyway.
If someone comes back sick and I refer him, if I suspect cancer that takes two weeks. If I refer everyone and say they have cancer, my consultant colleagues will get very upset. If a routine referral or something vague where it is difficult to pick a specialty then I'm left managing them with limited investigations for quite a while. The life threatening ones to be referred with blue lights now have to be done now or they die. But if you do that all the time you get very unpopular. Most patients I admit have life threatening illnesses, usually limiting their breathing or circulation in a major way, or an overwhelming infection or surgical calamity. The hospitals just don't have the capacity for trivia.
Many of the same comparisons can be made with A/E. You sit for hours in amongst drunks and then get "fobbed off with a virus" or even told to go away by the receptionist. But when you turn up one day in resus with half your leg missing after an RTA you'll appreciate that not all A/E is trivia either. However, a huge amount of it is.
Next time I'm on my own waiting 20 minutes for an ambulance to arrive whilst I'm resuscitating a 20 stone man trapped in a dark hallway I'll remember my job is easy.
You guys have no idea the job a GP does clearly. You just know your own trivial encounters. The job is interesting, varied, often routine, but sometimes quite dramatic and very challenging. You always have to be on your toes to do it well. Dull people don't even make it into medical school let alone last the training and then stick at the job.
Another thing is that patients demand referrals even when it is inappropriate and I have made the correct diagnosis and given the correct treatment. Usually when I refer I know what is going to happen to them, after all I've sat in a lot of the hospital specialties I refer to seeing referrals from GPs, but some patients like to see the hospital. Fear of litigation means it is difficult to refuse even when I know it is unnecessary.
And dangerous.Big Joe shows up "sick", well what does that mean? Recently I have had that complaint from a whole load of patients and in the last month that complaint has often meant a viral thing, but it has also meant ruptured sigmoid colon, myocardial infarction and acute glaucoma. The presentation in all cases was just being generally unwell with very little to go on. Recently, similar vague cases have also included meningitis, pyelonephritis, cholangitis, pancreatitis and dissecting aneurysm of the aorta. Some of these patients I saw a few times in one day as things evolved. If you make the genuinely unwell wait 48/72 hours they can die. Perhaps a more common experience of those who underestimate what goes on is that they indeed do have a self limiting trivial but irritating viral infection and the doctor is triaging things carefully. Certainly that is what I'm trying to do anyway.
If someone comes back sick and I refer him, if I suspect cancer that takes two weeks. If I refer everyone and say they have cancer, my consultant colleagues will get very upset. If a routine referral or something vague where it is difficult to pick a specialty then I'm left managing them with limited investigations for quite a while. The life threatening ones to be referred with blue lights now have to be done now or they die. But if you do that all the time you get very unpopular. Most patients I admit have life threatening illnesses, usually limiting their breathing or circulation in a major way, or an overwhelming infection or surgical calamity. The hospitals just don't have the capacity for trivia.
Many of the same comparisons can be made with A/E. You sit for hours in amongst drunks and then get "fobbed off with a virus" or even told to go away by the receptionist. But when you turn up one day in resus with half your leg missing after an RTA you'll appreciate that not all A/E is trivia either. However, a huge amount of it is.
Next time I'm on my own waiting 20 minutes for an ambulance to arrive whilst I'm resuscitating a 20 stone man trapped in a dark hallway I'll remember my job is easy.
You guys have no idea the job a GP does clearly. You just know your own trivial encounters. The job is interesting, varied, often routine, but sometimes quite dramatic and very challenging. You always have to be on your toes to do it well. Dull people don't even make it into medical school let alone last the training and then stick at the job.
Another thing is that patients demand referrals even when it is inappropriate and I have made the correct diagnosis and given the correct treatment. Usually when I refer I know what is going to happen to them, after all I've sat in a lot of the hospital specialties I refer to seeing referrals from GPs, but some patients like to see the hospital. Fear of litigation means it is difficult to refuse even when I know it is unnecessary.
John, why are you taking the bait from people who think they could turn their hand to anything but actually work 12 hour days 7 days a week doing some mundane sh1te and get paid sh1te for it? I think the situation they find themselves in now says it all.
Ignore them. Most of these guys would actually (and I mean actually) defecate in their underpants when faced with the life and death decisions that have to be made, sometimes in a split second. They obviously don't have the education to do the job, but most importantly they lack the strength of character.
Those people on here that do proper jobs themselves aren't stupid enough to think that other jobs are easy.
18 September 2010, 10:37 PM
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John - I thought you would have got the irony from someone who gets paid to look after peoples cash, rather than someone who gets paid to make sure they are still alive to spend it? Maybe not enough smilies. Actually.... rereading your post....
18 September 2010, 10:58 PM
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18 September 2010, 11:19 PM
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my wife is a doctors receptionist.gets shat on by the patients .gets no back up from the doctors from irate patients.earns peanuts to take abuse that the practise managers and doctors are not interested in.funnily enough the chavs that do all the shouting and abusing get what they want and and are basically rewarded for their behaviour and are then as good as gold to the gps face.even the complete idiots who have been struck off from other practices for their behaviour are allocated a practice because its the law.so the idiots are assinged to her practice and just continue abusing the staff without recourse.there is something wrong with our system.rant over.
18 September 2010, 11:40 PM
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Points taken Ding and fast.
subevo, I back up my receptionists to the hilt and challenge patients over their behaviour towards my receptionists. It is a hard job they have though. The patients are not as good as gold in the consulting room either.
Agree though that allocations are a nightmare. We're fairly rural so avoid the worst of it. I get crazy farmers instead
subevo, I back up my receptionists to the hilt and challenge patients over their behaviour towards my receptionists. It is a hard job they have though. The patients are not as good as gold in the consulting room either.
Agree though that allocations are a nightmare. We're fairly rural so avoid the worst of it. I get crazy farmers instead
19 September 2010, 03:19 AM
#47
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I posted up an article from a respected broadsheet about excessive pay in the public sector is all.
I respect Doctors but I don't see them as deserving unrestrained pay rises especially as I pay tax. They should be paid enough so they don't quit just like most of us in the private sector.
19 September 2010, 03:22 AM
#48
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Personally I see this 'awe' we have of Doctors as saintly, self-sacrificing life-givers as a bit silly.
I respect their job but it doesn't make them Gods.
19 September 2010, 07:50 AM
#49
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Nobody is in awe of doctors in this day and age and rightly so. This is your original post though
Quote tony de wonderful
d Labour start paying GP's more in real terms? Were we short of GP's? I have nothing against GP's getting decent pay but 200k? I mean should being a GP = riches? It's just a job, and one that shelters one from the rigors of a free market at that so ultra secure and to be frank not that hard IMHO.
You actually think being a Doctor is not that hard? What do you mean? Obviously it's not the hardest thing in the world to do, there are far more challenging things in the world, but are you saying it's easy and you could probably have a go?
Or that perhaps the minimum 8-10 years of training a GP goes through after leaving school is probably not needed? Perhaps we could put school leavers through a two year HND type course and then they could be our GPs for less money?
What did you actually mean?
As always you make ridiculous, childish and factually incorrect statements. Like all trolls you won't answer any of these questions as you still haven't backed up any of your equally ridiculous statements from other threads, such as..
Which countries have what you described as 'high culture'?
Quote tony de wonderful
d Labour start paying GP's more in real terms? Were we short of GP's? I have nothing against GP's getting decent pay but 200k? I mean should being a GP = riches? It's just a job, and one that shelters one from the rigors of a free market at that so ultra secure and to be frank not that hard IMHO.
You actually think being a Doctor is not that hard? What do you mean? Obviously it's not the hardest thing in the world to do, there are far more challenging things in the world, but are you saying it's easy and you could probably have a go?
Or that perhaps the minimum 8-10 years of training a GP goes through after leaving school is probably not needed? Perhaps we could put school leavers through a two year HND type course and then they could be our GPs for less money?
What did you actually mean?
As always you make ridiculous, childish and factually incorrect statements. Like all trolls you won't answer any of these questions as you still haven't backed up any of your equally ridiculous statements from other threads, such as..
Which countries have what you described as 'high culture'?
Last edited by Dingdongler; 19 September 2010 at 07:51 AM.
19 September 2010, 08:27 AM
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Nobody is in awe of doctors in this day and age and rightly so. This is your original post though
Quote tony de wonderful
d Labour start paying GP's more in real terms? Were we short of GP's? I have nothing against GP's getting decent pay but 200k? I mean should being a GP = riches? It's just a job, and one that shelters one from the rigors of a free market at that so ultra secure and to be frank not that hard IMHO.
You actually think being a Doctor is not that hard? What do you mean? Obviously it's not the hardest thing in the world to do, there are far more challenging things in the world, but are you saying it's easy and you could probably have a go?
Or that perhaps the minimum 8-10 years of training a GP goes through after leaving school is probably not needed? Perhaps we could put school leavers through a two year HND type course and then they could be our GPs for less money?
What did you actually mean?
As always you make ridiculous, childish and factually incorrect statements. Like all trolls you won't answer any of these questions as you still haven't backed up any of your equally ridiculous statements from other threads, such as..
Which countries have what you described as 'high culture'?
Quote tony de wonderful
d Labour start paying GP's more in real terms? Were we short of GP's? I have nothing against GP's getting decent pay but 200k? I mean should being a GP = riches? It's just a job, and one that shelters one from the rigors of a free market at that so ultra secure and to be frank not that hard IMHO.
You actually think being a Doctor is not that hard? What do you mean? Obviously it's not the hardest thing in the world to do, there are far more challenging things in the world, but are you saying it's easy and you could probably have a go?
Or that perhaps the minimum 8-10 years of training a GP goes through after leaving school is probably not needed? Perhaps we could put school leavers through a two year HND type course and then they could be our GPs for less money?
What did you actually mean?
As always you make ridiculous, childish and factually incorrect statements. Like all trolls you won't answer any of these questions as you still haven't backed up any of your equally ridiculous statements from other threads, such as..
Which countries have what you described as 'high culture'?
High culture can be found in many places but today you will principally find it is western Europe and the united states. That is not to say those places ONLY produce high culture, they produce more low culture truth be told.
Doctors need to academically inclined and have good application and focus but they don't need to be geniuses. In the scheme of medical science most are hacks and nothing more. Of course a good GP needs more than academic skills and IMHO the 'soft skills' make the difference.
Whether of not I could have become a Doctor or not is a personal question and nothing to do with you thanks.
19 September 2010, 11:10 AM
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19 September 2010, 12:47 PM
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I agree John, better to tell them to be quiet; and then ignore their f*ck-witted whining.
19 September 2010, 02:23 PM
#54
What a hilarious thread!
1) The OP says he thinks being a GP is easy. This is the same person whose post's are usually littered with the most basic of spelling and grammatical errors. We all do it, including me, but his post's seem in line with the reading and writing skills of an average 12 year old.
2) GC8WRX Welcome to the real world my friend! Some jobs take years of hard work, application and a degree of intelligence. Not everybody can put all those qualities together, those that do get rewarded. If you wanted to earn the money of a GP, why didn't you become one?
Some of these comments seem symptomatic of what's wrong with this country. A doctor is protected from the rigors of a free market ffs?? They aren't protected from potential manslaughter charges and being on the front pages of the papers if they **** up are they?
Everybody thinks they are a pop star in this country, now some muppets on this forum think anybody could turn their hand to being a doctor. Now excuse me whilst I go and perform some brain surgery, I'm sure it can't be that difficult.....
1) The OP says he thinks being a GP is easy. This is the same person whose post's are usually littered with the most basic of spelling and grammatical errors. We all do it, including me, but his post's seem in line with the reading and writing skills of an average 12 year old.
2) GC8WRX Welcome to the real world my friend! Some jobs take years of hard work, application and a degree of intelligence. Not everybody can put all those qualities together, those that do get rewarded. If you wanted to earn the money of a GP, why didn't you become one?
Some of these comments seem symptomatic of what's wrong with this country. A doctor is protected from the rigors of a free market ffs?? They aren't protected from potential manslaughter charges and being on the front pages of the papers if they **** up are they?
Everybody thinks they are a pop star in this country, now some muppets on this forum think anybody could turn their hand to being a doctor. Now excuse me whilst I go and perform some brain surgery, I'm sure it can't be that difficult.....
Lol at the last sentence!
19 September 2010, 02:36 PM
#55
The ones complaining about GPs earning too much (who can save lives), what have you got to say about fooballers who earn x10 times that and all they do is "kick a ball".
Do they deserve this? Or what about people in the media etc.?
Whatever has to do with media/entertainment always earned good money but they wouldn't speak of their own race and instead "penalise" GPs for earning more.
People in the media presenting you information and the "reality" from a certain viewpoint that is not necessarily objective, should they be justified huge salaries?
Think about it.
And regarding doctors, what you should worry or complain is not the salary of doctors but the fact that some of them prescribe you unnecessary medication due to "tips"/free holidays etc. they receive from pharmaceutical companies.
If you think it is easy to be one of them go and do it.
John Banks, it is important for you to sleep/rest well rather than posting 15,000 messages on the forum because other people's lives depend on your judgement.
Do they deserve this? Or what about people in the media etc.?
Whatever has to do with media/entertainment always earned good money but they wouldn't speak of their own race and instead "penalise" GPs for earning more.
People in the media presenting you information and the "reality" from a certain viewpoint that is not necessarily objective, should they be justified huge salaries?
Think about it.
And regarding doctors, what you should worry or complain is not the salary of doctors but the fact that some of them prescribe you unnecessary medication due to "tips"/free holidays etc. they receive from pharmaceutical companies.
If you think it is easy to be one of them go and do it.
John Banks, it is important for you to sleep/rest well rather than posting 15,000 messages on the forum
because other people's lives depend on your judgement.
Last edited by fpan; 19 September 2010 at 07:38 PM.
20 September 2010, 11:43 AM
#57
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Why are we discussing doctors pay being £200,000 or thereabouts? When I lived in Ibiza I lived and worked with people earning that in a month for just owning a piece of land. Restaurant owners earned £500,000 a summer and served utter crap in places that would get closed down in England. I my self earned up to £15,000 a month (before the mafia closed me down) for owning a luxury taxi company and all I did was drive people, albeit celebs, around. My brother in law would get tipped Rolex watches for concierge by ridiculously wealthy people. So £200,000 for doctors who have worked their socks off and for the responsibility they have is really not something worth getting worked up about.
I appreciate that Doctors are government paid but their skills are recognised and rewarded accordingly.
There are a lot higher paid people who do far less important jobs.
I appreciate that Doctors are government paid but their skills are recognised and rewarded accordingly.
There are a lot higher paid people who do far less important jobs.
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