sonic93

iTrader: (16)

Would u say newage sti lumps strong enough for 450 then ? Any head work? What sti 7 8 9 ?

Billet

iTrader: (60)

Just watching that video again. They way that thing accelerates is immense, a bit too quick i think. I take it, that it accelerates quicker on the dyno then it would on the road?

Ad, you may be fine on standard newage STI internals if it's a road car, but it's always a gamble, the majority seem to take it but some may not. It's up to you if you want to take the risk, i did and so have many others but for peace of mind and reliability i would forge it.

playtime

iTrader: (1)

What sort of power and turbo would you call it quites with a forged 2.5

joz8968

iTrader: (13)

Call it quits, you mean?

Around the 450-470 point. So a SC46 billet or MD321T billet would suit the bill.

Kwik

iTrader: (10)

I think time is as, if not more important than £££. I'm at the very beginning of my project in which at first I'm looking at a conservative 350/400 BHP.
https://www.scoobynet.com/projects-4...elf-build.html

I'm thinking of it like building a house - foundations upwards.
So a Closed Deck Block has the best reputation and is less limited on peak power as compared to new age engines.
So crank will either be an EJ257 which i understand is good for 700BHP, or a billet 257 which is even stronger. Then ACL bearings which seem to be used in most builds and have a great name. I beam rods are the next purchase, i was considering Manley rods though as they are the cheapest option. Some say the Manley's are good for 400BHP, others don't so why risk it? Then Piston's, and having asked about the Cosworth 92.5's seem to have a great name.
I'd have a rock solid bottom end, and this would make my options pretty unlimited as well as giving me a reliable engine i could use in any shell i pleased. I could then bolt the original heads back on and probably get maybe 300BHP from an almost standard (outside of block) set up. I can look at different Cam's, Valves and porting maybe.

Its then when i can start thinking about figures, if I'm that bothered, FMIC Injectors, Turbo and then find a compatible clutch/gearbox.

My advice would be to take your time and think wisely (although I'm not wise) and start from the ground up.

Shaun

Do you selectively read only parts of your replies?

You were the one that quoted my previous post and then went onto making "***** waving" and "creating conflict" statements. Hence why I said you need to take a deep breath and took the tone of you response as "defensive".

Anyway... this is not the purpose of this thread to comment how one other is getting a bit "excited" over a n others post.

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To determine whether or not Bob has in fact polished a turd will require a fair amount more testing and on more than one install imo. It will certainly be interesting to see how it pans out. This is the same with the method of "pinning" the blocks, but again I don't feel there is enough data to make an informed decision.

Trust me.... if I was given a 2.5 solution that didn't have increased potential of headgasket failure, piston slap, oil usage or cylinder wall issues.... I would take a 2.5 over a smaller capacity.

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Agree with this after having been there with a big power 2.5, it was bloody good fun and felt like a 2 litre with a rotated gt30r

sonic93

iTrader: (16)

Banny tell me more about this newage short and sti3 heads

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

What would you like to know dude, it was running a rotated gt30R, 2 bar with 15% meth mapped on a syvecs ecu

sonic93

iTrader: (16)

On a standard newage sti short and sti 3 heads? I'm surprised it even come off the rollers in 1 piece .

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

Yes even running standard head bolts and held together, it was all go no show

playtime

iTrader: (1)

Banny how long did the block last or is the block in question still in use

banny sti

iTrader: (68)

It did over 10k miles and was removed working and given to a friend as a spare

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Not only do I selectively read em, I selectively write em too!

The ***** waving bit wasn't directed at you, but more a good humoured dig at someone who said that a mid-400s 2.5 tricks you into thinking it's fast. No - it just is fast: any road car with 400+bhp is a quick machine, arguments to the contrary are untennable irrespective of whether you have a 600bhp monster etc...

The bit that got me was that far from being a 2.5 evangalist, I was saying that I would not suggest the larger capacity for certain applications e.g. more than a 450/450 build or for a track/competition car, but for a road car it's lovely. Yet from some of the resonses, you'd think I was arguing that it was the best block for every application etc... All I was saying was that start with the right block for your requirements given the intended use of the car.

Problem is that what is identified as an "issue" on here is not necessarily an issue from manufacturing point of view some might well be, some most likely aren't. Subaru UK certainly won't accept there is anything wrong with the std 2.5 pistons, and yet the concensus seems to be that they're poo! There is often a lack of empirical evidence to support such asertions, just odd bits of anecodtal data subject to lots of confounding variables from a few -understandably- disgruntled punters who have suffered a failure. Sometimes it's very difficult to know what you should be concerned about and what has just been blown out of proportion by negatively biased reporting on the internet.

Will be interesting to see how Bob's turns out. It's certainly looking like its going to be an incredibly responsive car. In the project thread he was talking about the potential for full boost in the low 2k rpm range on a 500 bhp turbo I believe. That's amazing. I'm not sure we'll be getting enough people doing this to get solid data on its reliability though.

Ultimately with regards to reliability of the boggo standard block when in higher states of tune I've put my money where my mouth is: I can't afford another build just like that, or a second fun car like some people on here can. So, we'll see! Maybe I'll be coming on here in 5 years going: "Ha, see I told you" or back on here in 1 month saying: "bugger my bores are now oval"

Oh, and that gt40r......I want one!!! But maybe not on the 2.5

jef

iTrader: (13)

harvey built my 2.5 with forgd pistons, acl bearings and sti3 heads, sc46, coupled to my 6 sp box it was an immense road car.
his advice if staying 450 or below and a budget in mind was to do just that.
with boost around 1.35 bar it made 420/430 and never in a yer did it miss a beat.

didnt hammer it everywhere, but still some spirited driving

for what a subaru can give you, i really really thought it was amazing. and from my experience a build not on the edge, but with some tolerance built in, which was what i and i think most want

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

If you look at what I said it was the 2.5ltr runs more torque so makes you think the car is faster than it is, I mentioned nothing about your car or a 400bhp. You seem to have just read what you wanted to hear.

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

Christ there is some utter bollocks being spoken about the 2.5 here.

If it didn't shove you in the back then it wasnt using the right components and it wasnt built properly.

As for them not being quick, what complete and utter crap!!

I dare anyone to come for a passenger ride in mine and think its slow.

600bhp 565 ftlbs in a 1200kg Type R is certainly not slow.

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

My 2.5 used to shove me in the seat and the car used to drag me all over the road on acceleration with the torque steer but using the exact same turbo on the exact same car on a 2.35 the car ran about 80lbs of torque less and similar bhp but the 2.35 is much quicker than the 2.5 but as I have said it doesn't feel as fast as the 2.5ltr due to running less torque but it is much quicker.

I have never said the 2.5 is slow once !

Kwik

iTrader: (10)

I might actually wave my ***** in here in a second, chat roulette stylee!

Hammer man

iTrader: (25)

I get that too Steve..... Gives me the ****** when its raining

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

I dare say Steve that we'd be neck and neck on the strip. Actually scratch that as two factors come into play. 1 you cant drive for sh*t (by your own admission) and 2 mine is lighter than yours by about 150 kilos and yes i've factored in my pie eating self

scooby2.5maz

iTrader: (16)

Hi daz , " does your 2.5 like to rev ? " I'm going down the 2.5 route and notice comments relating to " they don't rev past 6.5 k "

Cheers Maz

chopperman

WOW ! Those curves are perfect !

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

People who say they don't are talking out of their ***** you just have to use the right components

The 2.35 IS by far the best engine to build but the blocks are becoming expensive and are like rocking horse sh*t to get hold of.

The 2.5 has many many good points and one built right will be awesome.

The best road car combination you'll get would be a well built forged 2.5 with avcs heads and an MD321T.That little lot in a Classic would be phenominal.


Mines a proper handfull at full whack and i'm slowly beginning to realise that the car is far more enjoyable at 1.2 bar than it is as 2bar. which equates to somewhere between 400 and 450 bhp. The perfect level for a fun fruity road car.

stevebt

iTrader: (8)

well once mine is mapped properly and running proper power the weight difference won't make any difference

Hopefully see you at some events his year then grumpy

playtime

iTrader: (1)

So what would 450 of each be like in a impreza p1 quick as or just to much

bigsinky

if you haven't been in a 450 hp car then you will soil yourself. trust me.

scooby2.5maz

iTrader: (16)

Have to agree with you daz regarding the 2.5 I previously owned a wrx hawkeye and ran few mods, standard engine but td05 , exhaust blah blah blah ! Paul at zen mapped it , it made 340 x 340 on powerstations rollers ! It went like **** never had a problem with it revving , lol !

Like you say , with the right build and mods

Stevesbluewrx

iTrader: (4)

Mine used everyday for work was was running 453bhp for year and half fine. Or 442bhp on V power .

I've been running over 400bhp since 2009 now.

They are stronger than they get credit for.

400bhp+ in a newage is fun so god knows what it's like in a Classic and stripped out etc?

The way I look at it is , you treat it well give the engine some TLC like fresh oil at least every 3,000, take time to keep a weekly check on fluids ,belts etc and if you rag the living bollocks off of it (lets face it what roads can you these days) every god sending hour your in the drivers seat then it won't last.


I'm half tempted to start a thread asking how many owners passed or present currently have 380+ on standard internals with supporting mods and use the car everyday for work, school runs, dump trips and has a 70 year old mother drive it now and then.

NOT MANY.


I don't want to go off subject too much (which I am) but these engines are great if treated well.



Steve

F1 CJE UK

iTrader: (8)

Interesting thread with a real mix of thoughts and ideas.
I agree with all the guys above any Subaru with 400+ will be great fun to drive so make sure you don’t go around trying to chase figures at the start. I had my car built by RCM and the only advice I have is make sure that you don’t waste any money buying cheap parts as you will pay for them in the future. I had my 2.35 built at great expense but I now choose to only run at 460bhp making my car future proof if I want to step it up into the mid to high 500s.